Have You Ever Tried to Open a Zoo? Why You Are not Trying?

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Nikola Chavkosk

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Hello Zoochatters,

-I have a question(s) for you, like whether you have ever tried to open a zoo, or to initiate a project to open a zoo?
-Or are you trying or why you are not trying, if you really want to have a small zoo after all (like a little zoo that could, with hopes :) )?

-Can you get grants from different institutions, Government funds, angel inestitors - this should be easy in a developed country?
-Are the money main reason, or other things are essential too, like strong will and willingness to do that, with enthusiasm?

To answer this question(s) myself first, the main reason is financial and with limited possibilities to get funds. I've spend some money on other entrepreneurship ideas, intermittently in the last 3 years, but next time I get enough funds I will try to start with fallow deers and lemurs (ok and a European brown bear, maybe wolves, snakes, parrots):)

Thanks,
These questions may not fully apply to younger zoochatters, especially to those younger than 18 years of course. :)
 
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You got the idea. Funds are the main reason. I've tought seriously in open my own small zoo in my city (Saragossa, Spain) since, despite being a good-sized city (about 700000 habitants), it lacks completely a zoo (except the Fluvial Aquarium, opened relatively recently (in 2008)). However, for start a new zoo is necessary a big amount of money both for permissions and papers as for building, infrastructures, employee salaries, buy food and welfare for animals, buy the own animals, etc). I have a ridiculous salary of less than 500€/month. I've discussed with another animal enthusiast that keeps himself reptiles and other animals at his home, and he liked the idea but again he don't have enough money to start. And after, I've readed again the book "We buy a Zoo", that tells the history of the reopening of Dortmund zoo, and then I stopped definitely my toughts about opening a new zoo.
Saragossa seems particularly unreceptive to raise money for divulgation of natural science: the small natural history museum (Longinos Navás room) was closed in 2006 by lack of funds and was followed by the small but interesting paleontology collection (Lucas Mallada room) in the University. Fortunately both joined together in a single building and reopened just a year ago, but people here do the things almost for free as volunteers...
Appart from money, it's particularly difficult to start a zoo in my city, both because the very strong opposition of society to captive animals (I think stronger than in other countries), both as the bad weather (maybe the worst of Spain), with very hot summers, very cold winters, lack of rain except strong torments, and overall, very often strong winds, that make the outdoor animal welfare more difficult and also improves several days when visitors would not like to go to a open space like a park.
I tought seriously in make an entirely indoor small zoo, much like the Terarium Prague, with smaller animals that don't need much expensive care. However, for the building and permissions I still lack the money to start this project.
I've tried repeatedly to have a job as keeper in a zoo, and despite I have wide experience keeping exotic animals at private states, no zoo caught or wanted me in these crysis times. For me, work as a keeper in any already made zoo would be as good as in my own newmade zoo. All that I want is a good salary and be in contact with exotic species and be able of give use to my extensive knowlegde about species.
 
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Many thanks Kakapo for this extensive explanation.
Zaragoza is almost at same latitude as my living town of Prilep at 41.20 N, so I suppose the climate is simmilar.
When speaking to salary I earn less than 300.0 euros/month :) I estimate that I will don't need a lot of funds for very little zoo starting with fallow deers and lemurs, and some other animals obtained on different basis, but I'll see.
 
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Starting a zoo is going to be tough and most so on finances. Like many tourist attractions you're going to have to not only go through a period of time whilst you run at a loss as you build up reputation; but you're also going to have to sink a lot of money into advertising to ensure that you attract and inform people.

One way toward this is to have a major investor(s) or your own business that earns well. Essentially a ready stream of income that is not tied to the zoo which can prop it up and help provide the money required to get it going. Problem there is that investors are going to be hard to find - those with the money are likely going to want a return on investment that might be hard to find; whilst others might feel better investing in other conservation causes or in an already established major zoo.


The other avenue is a large private collection made public. Quite a few smaller zoos or wildlife centres start out this way (oft your "farm" zoo). You essentially grow things slowly and focus on having species that you'd otherwise have anyway and then seek to turn a profit from it instead of just having it as a hobby. This has the bonus that it should be cheaper and let you draw things out; but it will take a long while and since its low investment (compared to a large zoo) its likely the kind of thing that might not grow huge.

The other big issue no matter what scale you go for is land - ideally you want to own the land you're built upon otherwise renting can be a ticking time bomb (esp if you site yourself near to an urban area or good communication links to provide a market - because then you're sitting in prime development land). There's not a few smaller centres that relied on rented land that lost access and have had to close doors.



Another option is to seek funding through species promotion. There was an Otter sanctuary (Otter Trust?) that was basically focused on repopulating UK otters. With the focus they were able to generate interest and investment; but at the same time the limited scope meant that it was more practical. I'm aware that the site closed once otters repopulated to healthy numbers and it went through a phase of remaining closed but I believe its now being re-opened.


I'd also think you'd need to network with other zoo owners and managers. You'd need to tap into that resource to get a feel of how well things are doing; to network to find access for species; to find practical advice on setup (eg fencing contractors known to be reliable) etc....


I think its a complex dream but no matter how you approach it you'd have to be super dedicated because chances are you will be doing the bulk of the keeper, manager, fund raiser, builder, estate worker etc.... work in the early days.
 
Thanks overread. Here in R. Macedonia, as yet developing from non-market economy from 1991, there are 2 real zoos, and some petting facilities not to call them real zoos. I think small zoo with some animals like fallow deers or lemurs, will attract visitors, particularly if it also offers a mini restaurant and place for recreation outside town. I don't think that such zoo will be very attractive in the UK since there are a lot of zoos there (350+), do you think that too?
 
Latitude is not the only factor that make a climate. Saragossa is in the middle of a wide and great valley an hence acts as a wind corridor. It's also very far from the sea and so don't benefit from the mild maritime climate.
I don't know if your 300€ salary will allow you start that zoo. I'm a nerd in economy and don't know how is the life in Macedonia as compared to Spain (price of things, taxes, etc). But I think that to have fallow deers and lemurs or to have much more expensive-to-keep species such as a giant panda, really will not be the major diference of the investiment. The harder thing is the buy of the terrain, building and overall the multiple permissions and approvements that you must have fully resolved before open and start to earn money from ticket entries. Maybe you need less papers and permissions in Macedonia than in Spain, I don't know.

About my city I forgot to mention that some years ago it was a bird zoo at La Muela, called Aviapark. It closed about a decade or so before opening. Now the place still exist but only is allowed to hold farm animals. I'm not sure about how happened, but I think that the mayoress of La Muela gave a very expensive urbanistic development (including this bird park, a wind museum and an oil museum), but some years after she was in debt.
 
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Another aspect to consider for yourself, esp if the number of zoos is low, is specialists - especially with regard to veterinary care. Whilst you might not be looking too exotic you might well find that even care for animals like fallow deer could be tricky as its not typical for normal vets (most are used to cats and dogs).

That might be one area where you, again, have to learn and put in the work a lot yourself; but chances are you might have to seek out a few specialists; it might also curtail what you feel you can safely take on in any establishment
 
Nikola,
Your insistence on trying to open a zoo is really one of the most worrying trends on ZooChat. You haven't shown the knowledge or skills required to successfully keep a single species alive and healthy. Your exhibit designs are poor at best and dangerous at worst. You don't have a viable financial model or an accurate idea of actual costs of operating a zoo. Please, take a step back, and, for the love and safety of the animals you wish to care for, do everyone a favor and get some real world experience at a zoo first.
 
My dream will always be to either work at or start a zoo, big or small. Luckily, being 14, I have ealot of time to think I about this subject and do some real research. I've found that you can buy a lot of different animals only ethrough exotic animal websites online (for some reason most of the animals are of Texas origin, go figure.) BUT from these sites you can buy almost anything from Kodiak brown bears to spotted hyena cubs. If I was going to build a zoo, I'd star with a private collection on bought land with very well-built enclosures and veiwng walkways and go from there. You could even go as far as to build your own fences and pave your own walkways as this may be back-breaking g work it'd be cheaper than hiring someone to do it all for you, though it'd take longer to do. The presentable problems here would be creating well-kept enclosures and having the funds to pay for everything from vet bills to maitnence. You'd need planning permission for all of this and definetly have trouble with everything from zoning to angry neighbors. But I believe it can be done.
 
A couple of things For sale on this website in the U.S. (Animals for Sale)

Three Banded and Screaming Armadillos
Asian Small Clawed Otter
Badgers
Bears
Binturong
Bobcat
Bonnet Macaque
Capuchin Monkey
Capybara
Coyotes
Chinchilla
Coatimundi
Coyote
Fallow Deer (Nikola's Favorite!), Elk, and Reindeer
Fenec and other Foxes
Genets
Exotic Cats of all kinds (Serval, Fishing, Leopard Cat purebreds)
Hedgehogs
Hyenas
Kangaroo/Wallaroo
Kinkajou
Lemurs
Lynx
Marmosets and Vervet Monkeys
Muntjac deer Galore
Patagonian cavy
Polecat
North American and African Crested Porcupines
Prarie Dogs
Skunks
Sloths
Sugar Gliders
Zebra

Of course, this does not mean this is a reliable way at all to get any animal besides maybe muntjac, marmoset, sugar glider, and Fennec.
 
jbnbsn99 said:
Nikola,
Your insistence on trying to open a zoo is really one of the most worrying trends on ZooChat. You haven't shown the knowledge or skills required to successfully keep a single species alive and healthy. Your exhibit designs are poor at best and dangerous at worst. You don't have a viable financial model or an accurate idea of actual costs of operating a zoo. Please, take a step back, and, for the love and safety of the animals you wish to care for, do everyone a favor and get some real world experience at a zoo first.
Click to expand...

It's also plain tedious. At least with the umpteen threads you know what to expect, but clogging up more interesting discussions with endless pipedreams lowers the standard of the forum as a whole. I can only assume that Nikola views it as a war of attrition: every time the tide turns on his ideas, he just waits a week before raising the topic somewhere else. Eventually the people like yourself, who actually talk sense, get sick of it and walk away.

So, whilst I sort of admire your passion @Nikola Chavkosk, passion untempered by reality is madness. If you held off posting about your "plans" until you had the resources to even begin thinking about them, I'm sure they'd receive a far more welcome response. Particularly if you took the opportunity to enhance your knowledge and experience in the meantime. Otherwise, might I suggest that, rather than lemurs and fallow deer, wild geese and flying pigs are more suitable taxa to begin with?
 
Hey, how much money do you think that someone should reserve before opening a zoo with some animals like Ring-tailed lemurs, Fennecs, Meerkats, Kangaroos/Wallabies, Marmosets/Tamarins, Birds and Reptiles? What if these animals needed to be exported from other country?
 
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I just asked several questions, most of you are telling other things. Ok. I have experience in zoo, practicing, 2 months. Also I am vet, and most of you are not. Veterinary medicine scope is very wide.
Also, all this would mean that people must first practice to keep, and then to obtain even exotic pets, as they are too, wild and exotic animals - but that doesn't make sense, right?
I don't agree with most of you on most of your statements by the way, you are making things very complicated - and there is no need for such thing, in my opinion.
Can you really just answer if you don't mind the questions I have asked initially (or with other words don't set this thread in other direction); if this is not interesting or it is borring, as Giant Panda wrote, then you don't need to reply here and the thread will stay empty - because it is borring.
For example, keeping fallow deers is not very different than keeping goats, if you want. :)

Please don't get angry, but many of you seem like a toxic or pessimistic people, killing every enthusiasm, and it looks like the forum is place for more people that wants to work/to own a zoo, but don't succeded in that, than is for people actually working in zoos/owning them/are very optimistic to establish one. :)
 
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Why don't I open a zoo? Financial reasons, yes, but also...I have worked in the industry for 3+ years as a keeper (which isn't a lot of time, but I am still young). I am just now learning how much I really do not know. My main reason for not opening a zoo is knowing that I am not nearly experienced or knowledgable enough to be the one in charge of husbandry for the numerous species and taxa that make up a zoo, not to mention the customer service, marketing, exhibit design, etc that go into running a zoo. I have more experience in some of those things than the general public, but I don't know nearly enough to run my own zoo.

You take on an enormous responsibility when you are in charge of an animal's life, and some of the people here who keep posting about owning a zoo one day do not seem to currently have the experience to take on this responsibility.
 
Nikola Chavkosk said:
I just asked several questions, most of you are telling other things. Ok. I have experience in zoo, practicing, 2 months. Also I am vet, and most of you are not. Veterinary medicine scope is very wide.
Also, all this would mean that people must first practice to keep, and then to obtain even exotic pets, as they are too, wild and exotic animals - but that doesn't make sense, right?
I don't agree with most of you on most of your statements by the way, you are making things very complicated - and there is no need for such thing, in my opinion.
Can you really just answer if you don't mind the questions I have asked initially (or with other words don't set this thread in other direction); if this is not interesting or it is borring, as Giant Panda wrote, then you don't need to reply here and the thread will stay empty - because it is borring.
For example, keeping fallow deers is not very different than keeping goats, if you want. :)

Please don't get angry, but many of you seem like a toxic or pessimistic people, killing every enthusiasm, and it looks like the forum is place for more people that wants to work/to own a zoo, but don't succeded in that, than is for people actually working in zoos/owning them/are very optimistic to establish one. :)
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Two months is hardly enough zoo experience to consider operating your own. The people who I've met who have opened a zoo have had decades of zoo experience before beginning to operate their own.

You may disagree with our statements, but that doesn't mean we aren't right. Please take some humility in this matter.

We aren't angry, but we are frustrated. Many people on this site understand the complexities of zoos. I myself do not claim to understand even a fraction of the minutiae involved in operating a zoo after four years working in one (working within and with education, guest services, mechanical maintenance, and occasionally with animal staff). What I do know is that operating a zoo is not something to be taken lightly. If you want to operate a zoo, first get a job as a zoo keeper. Learn the daily life of what is involved being an animal caretaker. Live that life day in and day out for several years. If after that, you still think you want to open a zoo, then look at it.

Remember this, the greatest artists, musicians, athletes, actors, etc. spent years developing their craft, learning every skill involved in their field, before making it big. Someone wanting to open a zoo who has never worked in a zoo is like a beginning clarinetist wanting to play in a top symphony orchestra with having put in all the years of training.
 
Kakapo said:
the book "We buy a Zoo", that tells the history of the reopening of Dortmund zoo
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“We bought a Zoo“ by Benjamin Mee was about reopening the Devon Zoological Garden.

A degree in veterinary medicine is helpful in regard to fulfilling certain federal prerequisites in regard to establising/maintaining a zoo. However, it is not an automatic qualification for higgly required aspects such as entrepreneurship, financial or HR rmanagement etc. etc.
 
Ops, sorry. I mixed Dartmoor with Dortmund due to phonetic similarities :oops:

Felipe DBKO: I believe that your answer is not possible to reply with a simple number. The amount of money necessary for start a new zoo can vary a lot depending of how many acres of terrain you buy, how complex and numerous are the buildings you want in it, how many employees will you have, how is the life in each country (prices, taxes, etc), and maybe overall, how are the laws, permissions and approvements necessary for own your own zoo (including different ones for the restaurants, etc), that can be different in each country or even in each state in the same country. The only way to know how much money is necessary for start a zoo, is to make a detailed plan of it, and then to ask the competent authorities of each country/state (the same authorities that must give you each permission and approval).
 
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