what species have been mixed with crocodilians?

O

Ortolan bunting

Well-Known Member
what species of turtles and fish have commonly been keept together with crocodilans ?

i am especially curious about African dwarf crocodile and smaller caimans in european zoos
but all examples are welcome
 
San Diego Zoo had a variety of turtles living with their half-grown Gharials in December of last year. Unfortunately none of them were signed that I saw, but a couple were of a snake-necked variety, and there was an individual of another species that had to be at least three feet long. Plus several other more generic looking turtles.

Other than that I don't ever remember seeing other species exhibited with crocodilians apart from small fish... Generally their large size and predatory nature make them rather poor mixed species exhibit candidates.
 
MagpieGoose said:
Five Sisters Zoo in Scotland had Yellow-crowned Weavers mixed with their Dwarf Crocodiles on my visit last summer.
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I think it was in the old Belle Vue (Manchester) tropical house that they had crocodilians leaping out of the water to catch birds.
 
FBBird said:
I think it was in the old Belle Vue (Manchester) tropical house that they had crocodilians leaping out of the water to catch birds.
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In the Chester Zoo book ("A Zoo Without Bars" is the title?) it was said that the alligators got a new lease on life after being rehoused in the then-newly-built tropical house, and one leapt up to take a toucan that perched above the pool.
 
That's
Chlidonias said:
In the Chester Zoo book ("A Zoo Without Bars" is the title?) it was said that the alligators got a new lease on life after being rehoused in the then-newly-built tropical house, and one leapt up to take a toucan that perched above the pool.
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That might be where I read it. On the other hand, might have been Belle Vue as well.
 
FBBird said:
That might be where I read it. On the other hand, might have been Belle Vue as well.
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I do also recall something about Belle Vue in that regard, although I don't know from where, so it was likely both zoos.
 
Last time i was in Ouwehands they had green iguanas mixed in with a crocodillian, Dont remember the species tho. In burgers zoo they also have freshwater rays and pacus, and used to have lungfish with them as well. Dont know if they have them anymore, as i havent seen them.
 
Tierpark Berlin has this greenhouse with several crocodile species, they're in the same building but in different exhibits and they have crested oropendolas flying around.
 
San Antonio Zoo had some kind of crane (or similar large bird) in with gharial (two of each species). I was quite surprised to see that mix.
 
Small birds, fish, turtles and butterflies are in many zoos.

I read that some largish American zoo mixed muntjac with gharial. I myself would be interested which zoo it was and how successful this mix was.
 
Ortolan bunting said:
African dwarf crocodile
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See: Keeping and Breeding of Dwarf Crocodiles (Osteolaemus tetraspis) in the Leipzig Zoo Aquarium (doc, page 3 for their mixes).

Some other places have reported no problems when mixing dwarf crocodile and turtles, but whether this was long-term and a breeding pair like the ones in Leipzig (presumably making them more aggressive/defensive) is unclear. In addition to the ones listed in the doc, I have seen a very large number of fish species kept without major problems with dwarf crocs. This includes both African and non-African species, and small (e.g., small African tetras) to very large species (largest being arapaima). Basically any fish that doesn't spend most of its not moving (like lungfish) seems to be okay, but it would probably be a bad idea to include any high-value species, regardless of their mobility, in the 5-40 cm (2-15 in) range... because you never know. A bit like the shark tanks where smaller fish generally are left alone, but on occasion one disappears. Among species I've seen mixed are a few that potentially could represent a risk to the dwarf crocodile, including large redtail catfish and giant puffer. According to keepers neither caused problems, but I suspect this was related to the very large size of the enclosures and that the dwarf crocodiles/redtailed catfish were matched in size (a very large redtail probably wouldn't think twice about trying to eat a small dwarf croc). Among birds: weavers, estrildid, mousebirds, turacos, tanagers, siskins, bulbuls, small lorikeets, barbets and probably more I don't remember right now.

Cuban crocs (and their hybrids) will happily jump out of water after medium and large birds. I presume all (or at least nearly all) other Crocodylus species do it too, but for some reason the bad rep follows this one species. Regardless, any aquatic bird should probably be kept out of a crocodile exhibit, except gharial which has been mixed succesfully with ducks and probably could be mixed with other water birds too.
 
These are the ones I've seen...

Abilene Zoo -- a Cuvier's dwarf caiman with a black river turtle

San Antonio Zoo -- gharials with various turtles (black pond turtle, painted terrapin, and giant Asian pond turtle)

dwarf crocodiles with a West African mud turtle and assorted fish

Fort Worth Zoo -- dwarf crocodiles with Congo tetra and assorted African cichlids (rainbow cichlid, jewel cichlid, rainbow krib, zebra obliquidens, probably more there were no signs for)

an American alligator with an alligator snapping turtle

gharials with several different turtles (Asian narrow-headed softshell turtle, pig-nosed turtle, painted terrapin) and fish (flying fox, bala sharks, tinfoil barbs, zebrafish, giant pangasius catfish)
 
FBBird said:
I think it was in the old Belle Vue (Manchester) tropical house that they had crocodilians leaping out of the water to catch birds.
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Chlidonias said:
In the Chester Zoo book ("A Zoo Without Bars" is the title?) it was said that the alligators got a new lease on life after being rehoused in the then-newly-built tropical house, and one leapt up to take a toucan that perched above the pool.
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Indeed "Zoo Without Bars" (June Johns; 1969) describes the incident at Chester Zoo.

Several hummingbirds and an Indian hill mynah were swallowed by alligators after landing too close to the reptiles.

The book then adds:

"Desmond, a magnificent toucan with an eight-inch beak, was snatched from an overhanging branch at least two feet from the surface of the pool. The alligator responsible had leapt in the air to snatch his prey...."

I too recall reading about a similar incident at Belle Vue but haven't yet been able to trace the reference.
 
Tim May said:
Indeed "Zoo Without Bars" (June Johns; 1969) describes the incident at Chester Zoo.

Several hummingbirds and an Indian hill mynah were swallowed by alligators after landing too close to the reptiles.

The book then adds:

"Desmond, a magnificent toucan with an eight-inch beak, was snatched from an overhanging branch at least two feet from the surface of the pool. The alligator responsible had leapt in the air to snatch his prey...."

I too recall reading about a similar incident at Belle Vue but haven't yet been able to trace the reference.
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Might have been in one of David Taylor's Zoovet books.
 
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