Snowleopard's 2019 Road Trip: Netherlands, Belgium, France & Germany

[CGSwans]

The review of Berlin Zoo is not finished yet, but it will almost certainly be 5,000 words when it's done. I realize that expectations are high as I've received a number of messages, but I want to get it just right. I loved Berlin Zoo and so that's the important thing to know. It is my #3 zoo ever, after San Diego and Omaha.

Berlin over Burgers! I don't think anybody would have expected that in advance.

 

[sooty mangabey]

Prague is most certainly an exception in my opinion, for what it is worth

This comment followed an observation from @snowleopard that some of the older zoos in Europe, despite the charm inherent in their antiquity, contained a large number of less wonderful exhibits. It’s worth pointing out that, in contrast to the grand old zoos of Europe, in places such as Amsterdam, Berlin and Antwerp, Prague Zoo is a relative youngster – it was only founded in 1931, and certainly does not have the feel of an “old“ zoo. Indeed, I’m struggling to think of any significant exhibits that are in the zoo, that date back much beyond 40 years. I think the old elephant house is probably about 50 years old, but it’s now really just used as a reptile display area; the old monkey house, which was truly ghastly, now exists as the shell of the brilliant African small animal area. Apart from that – there’s really not much there that is ancient.

 

[sooty mangabey]

Berlin over Burgers! I don't think anybody would have expected that in advance.

As I write this, I think @snowleopard is probably somewhere over Iceland, flying home – and I am sure he is looking forward to seeing his family once again. The review he posted of Arnhem made plain his enjoyment of and admiration for that place, But I got a sense from it that he felt he would have liked to have seen more animals there, especially in the Bush. Nonetheless, nobody would ever be able to say that Arnhem was anything other than a truly outstanding zoo (see @jwer, I can be taken seriously in my opinions on Dutch zoos after all!). With some massive zoos visited, and some fairly lengthy drives between those zoos, @snowleopard is now about a week behind in his reviews – which is excellent news, as it prolongs the enjoyment of this travelogue. While his admiration of the two Berlin zoos may not come as a surprise, I think there may be a surprise coming soon, in his enjoyment of a zoo that is often not particularly highly-regarded in these parts.

 

[TeaLovingDave]

I think there may be a surprise coming soon, in his enjoyment of a zoo that is often not particularly highly-regarded in these parts.

Surprise visit to South Lakes perhaps

 

[lintworm]

Surprise visit to South Lakes perhaps

More likely Hannover

I am also not surprised by @snowleopard 's love for the Berlins as it is quite clear he admires huge collections and though he was impressed in Arnhem it was also clear it is not his type of zoo

 

[ANyhuis]

I would have to say @ANyhuis that I have most definitely 'done' Emmen Zoo. Wildlands Adventure Zoo is just down the street and we saw the whole thing in 2.5 hours. A full hour was the Jungola section, another full hour was the Serenga area, and then 30 minutes was the Polar Bears, penguins and pinnipeds. If I had kids I'd be there all day long, especially with the big indoor play area, but for two grown men 2.5 hours was more than enough time. We did the boat ride in the jungle, but the roller-coaster is an abomination to the landscape and it is just a stain on the view of the African Savanna. Also, those huge trucks going through the savanna on short rides are brutal, with roads through the paddock that have no place in a zoo's African Savanna. Why not start driving big trucks through Woodland Park Zoo's African Savanna or into Giants of the Savanna at Dallas Zoo? Maybe we should just pave an entire savanna and turn it into the Autobahn. Ugh. The 'new' Emmen Zoo is a half-day zoo, at best, for a zoo nerd. I will fully admit that I thoroughly enjoyed the first hour in Jungola, but after that the zoo was hit-and-miss and way too small. I know that @Tim Brown did the 'new' Emmen in around 3 hours when it first opened.

All of Wildlands in 2.5 hours? There's only one conclusion I can make -- you were RUSHING! I don't blame you, as you are obviously trying to fit in as many different zoos into this trip as you can. But I strongly disagree that you have really "done" Wildlands. For one thing, you have no idea what that Artic 1 4D show includes. Sorry, but even though it's fantasy, it's part of the adventure there, and it's a great show! Did you also skip the similar 4D show at Hannover? I remember when you went to Disney's Animal Kingdom, you skipped everything at that place that made the park "Disney" (including the 4D Tough to Be a Bug show) and then you complained that the place is over-priced -- even though the park gets more visitors than any other zoo on earth! While you may not have appreciated the Serenga Safari rides, they are again part of the "adventure" and their popularity shows it. No, they're not as good as Disney's Kilamanjaro Safari ride, but nonetheless they are FUN! Mexico's Guadalajara Zoo has a similar safari ride -- again the most popular thing in that zoo. When I was at Wildlands, I was there literally ALL DAY, and I was thankful for their late 8pm (20:00) closing time -- and that was before they built the roller coaster (which I can understand you skipping).

 

[Dassie rat]

PerhapsSnowleopard will parachute down to Reykjavik Zoo to see the anglerfish.

 

[Maguari]

All of Wildlands in 2.5 hours? There's only one conclusion I can make -- you were RUSHING! I don't blame you, as you are obviously trying to fit in as many different zoos into this trip as you can. But I strongly disagree that you have really "done" Wildlands. For one thing, you have no idea what that Artic 1 4D show includes. Sorry, but even though it's fantasy, it's part of the adventure there, and it's a great show!

That sounds like something I would personally skip as well. I think that I were at Wildlands (and I have yet to visit Emmen since the Great Reboot) on my own or just with other zoo enthusiasts, as with most zoos, I would want to see the animal bits, and the landscaping and design of the grounds, but any non-animals shows or rides I would almost certainly pass by.

At the risk of causing an international incident, I did the same at Disney's Animal Kingdom in 2013 - I just did the walking trails with animals and the safari ride. I'm sure the rest is very good, but it's not really for me and certainly not for me to spend time on a zoo tour (for the record this was not because I didn't like it - I actually enjoyed DAK rather more than I expected!).

I don't have anything against theme parks, but they're a different day out for me. They're a family/friends fun day out type day, and I enjoy them in that context - they don't trigger my nerd gene though, and I can quite understand if that's the same for @snowleopard .

 

[sooty mangabey]

For one thing, you have no idea what that Artic 1 4D show includes. Did you also skip the similar 4D show at Hannover? I remember when you went to Disney's Animal Kingdom, you skipped everything at that place that made the park "Disney" (including the 4D Tough to Be a Bug show)
.

You may not be surprised to read that I would, genuinely, rather spend an evening watching reruns of Love Island then have to endure something called a “4D tough to be a bug show“.

they are FUN!

In common with many, many others, I have been avidly reading, and loving, this thread since the start of July. I really do not think that @snowleopard has been short of fun in any way at all! The absence of rollercoasters has not been a problem, as far as I can tell.

 

[FunkyGibbon]

More likely Hannover

I don't think it should be Hannover, as Sooty knows very well it would not be a surprise for SL to enjoy it. However, I am stuck for other ideas.

 

[lintworm]

I don't think it should be Hannover, as Sooty knows very well it would not be a surprise for SL to enjoy it. However, I am stuck for other ideas.

Only other one I can think of is Osnabrueck, which is a rather strange beast...

 

[ANyhuis]

I don't have anything against theme parks, but they're a different day out for me. They're a family/friends fun day out type day, and I enjoy them in that context - they don't trigger my nerd gene though, and I can quite understand if that's the same for @snowleopard .

I totally understand this. For most of the folks here on ZooChat, the rides and shows of a park like Wildlands (or Disney or Hannover) aren't high on the priority list. ZooChat people (called "zoo nerds" by SnowLeopard) are more interested in seeing various spiny mouse species, or different cloud rats, or various basilisk lizards. Most "typical" zoo visitors give these species about 2 or 3 seconds and move on. This is why zoo nerds find Frankfurt, Plzen, and similar zoos so fascinating. The more "typical" zoo visitors (families with children) will gravitate towards the bonus animals (gorillas, elephants, pandas, koalas, etc.) and they will almost always enjoy the different rides and shows. When I'm reviewing a zoo for a possible future zoo travel guide, I tend to try to think like these more typical zoo visitors, and thus I never miss any zoo's rides or major shows, and this is why I personally found Wildlands and Hannover to be vastly preferable zoos to Frankfurt and Plzen. But I totally understand the differing priorities, and even SnowLeopard seems to understand, as he admitted that if he had been at Wildlands with his children, he would have spent a LOT more time there.

 

[ANyhuis]

You may not be surprised to read that I would, genuinely, rather spend an evening watching reruns of Love Island then have to endure something called a “4D tough to be a bug show“.

"It's Tough to Be a Bug" (4D show) is one of the overall most popular attractions at the entire 4-park Disney World theme park. It's so popular that Disney has also featured this show at other theme parks around the world. But if you're not a fan of Disney entertainment, it's understandable that this wouldn't appeal to you.

 

[Ituri]

"It's Tough to Be a Bug" (4D show) is one of the overall most popular attractions at the entire 4-park Disney World theme park. It's so popular that Disney has also featured this show at other theme parks around the world. But if you're not a fan of Disney entertainment, it's understandable that this wouldn't appeal to you.

Actually they only added it to Disney California Adventure and it’s been gone from there for many years. It’s only at DAK now and not nearly as popular as many of the park’s other offerings.

 

[ANyhuis]

Actually they only added it to Disney California Adventure and it’s been gone from there for many years. It’s only at DAK now and not nearly as popular as many of the park’s other offerings.

It WAS one of the most popular attractions, at least a few years ago. But I guess people get tired of overly-familiar attractions. As an example, the "Tower of Terror" ride was once Disney's #1 most popular attraction, but now the California park has replaced it with some stupid Guardians of the Galaxy ride.

 

[TeaLovingDave]

As an example, the "Tower of Terror" ride was once Disney's #1 most popular attraction, but now the California park has replaced it with some stupid Guardians of the Galaxy ride.

I think it's vaguely hypocritical to say that skipping rides or not liking them means one is missing out on the true "adventure" and everything that makes a place what it is, only to dismiss a given ride as stupid after all, surely that ride is part of everything that makes the California park "Disney" and is part of the adventure!

 

[Maguari]

When I'm reviewing a zoo for a possible future zoo travel guide, I tend to try to think like these more typical zoo visitors, and thus I never miss any zoo's rides or major shows

Of course - that's appropriate given the audience you're working for.

this is why I personally found Wildlands and Hannover to be vastly preferable zoos to Frankfurt and Plzen.

...but this does suggest that you do genuinely enjoy these features more than the average ZooChatter - which is entirely your right, and let no-one take that away, but it does mean that it shouldn't be too surprising that your favourites list and visit lengths don't always tally with the majority here where animals and enclosures are the main things!

I don't think @snowleopard 'rushed' Wildlands - at most he perhaps simply skipped the areas that were not interesting enough to him, as, to be honest, anyone would on a normal visit, regardless of their schedule.

 

[Ned]

I totally understand this. For most of the folks here on ZooChat, the rides and shows of a park like Wildlands (or Disney or Hannover) aren't high on the priority list. ZooChat people (called "zoo nerds" by SnowLeopard) are more interested in seeing various spiny mouse species, or different cloud rats, or various basilisk lizards. Most "typical" zoo visitors give these species about 2 or 3 seconds and move on. This is why zoo nerds find Frankfurt, Plzen, and similar zoos so fascinating. The more "typical" zoo visitors (families with children) will gravitate towards the bonus animals (gorillas, elephants, pandas, koalas, etc.) and they will almost always enjoy the different rides and shows. When I'm reviewing a zoo for a possible future zoo travel guide, I tend to try to think like these more typical zoo visitors, and thus I never miss any zoo's rides or major shows, and this is why I personally found Wildlands and Hannover to be vastly preferable zoos to Frankfurt and Plzen. But I totally understand the differing priorities, and even SnowLeopard seems to understand, as he admitted that if he had been at Wildlands with his children, he would have spent a LOT more time there.

This begs the question of how much children are influenced by the culture they are brought up in? I have an interest in animals but is this because visiting zoos and natural history museums, along with certain TV documentaries, have shaped that interest? Or is my interest more innate?
Assuming zoo visits etc inspired my interest, don't zoos have a responsibility to inspire other children with an interest in the spiny mice and cloud rats rather than promote a mentality of animals being sideshow exhibits in theme parks?

 

[Brum]

First of all @Ned has hit the nail on the head with the whole reason I'm against rides and sideshows in zoos, they detract from the animals. I'm willing to concede that play areas are a necessary evil but when your zoo has an acre or more given over to fair rides (using the Dudley example) it just comes across as overkill.

Assuming zoo visits etc inspired my interest, don't zoos have a responsibility to inspire other children with an interest in the spiny mice and cloud rats rather than promote a mentality of animals being sideshow exhibits in theme parks?

I'd rather take kids to a zoo with a dozen obscure rodents over one with a 4D theatre or a boat ride, and trying to spot those little mice can be just as much fun, and sometimes even more rewarding, as (in my experience) some kids like the challenge.

 

[Dassie rat]

Surely zoos could invent rodent characters to interest children in obscure species. I remember Tufty the squirrel, Roland Rat, Jerry the mouse, Hammy Hamster and Kevin the gerbil.