Could Gorilla be housed in rotra once monsoon forest reopened?
Belfast Zoo Belfast Zoo News 2020
- Thread starter Babyrousa
- Start date
Your suggestion is highly speculative and I wonder how far removed from reality it is.
I doubt it. As a very temporary measure, a very small number could go into the old Ape House (which adjoins RotRA), as it did hold a pair of gorillas as well as orangs, back in the 1970s: but I can't imagine anyone thinking it would be a good idea now, except in the direst emergency.
At this exact moment the facilities to house Gorillas are not there. But im sure if it was an emergency situation there could be a solution until a more permanent habitat is created. Lemur island was suggested as a temporary holding area. But how feasible that is im not sure
This sounds rather similar to the situation some years ago when Chessington was rumoured to be going to disband the animal collection. Chester were interested in getting their gorilla group (ten animals) and would have built an enclosure for them in advance. However none of that happened.
I would hope that whoever suggested that either did so as a joke or is one of a small group of people that want gorillas running free around Upton. The house on the island alone would barely hold a juvenile animal, let alone a breeding group of eight (the number Belfast currently have).
Some rather interesting news, 1.1 Scottish wildcats have arrived in Belfast. The male (Oscar) came from the Alladale Wilderness Reserve, while the female (Ossian) is from the Highland Wildlife Park.
Just purrfect... wildcats move to Belfast Zoo
This now makes Belfast only the second zoo outside of Mainland Britain (the other being Norden's Ark) to keep Scottish wildcats.
Just purrfect... wildcats move to Belfast Zoo
This now makes Belfast only the second zoo outside of Mainland Britain (the other being Norden's Ark) to keep Scottish wildcats.
Except Scottish wildcats are no different from any other wild cat in Europe.
True.
Reqoute some of the papers here please!
Any alleles rare and restricted to the Scots wild cats versus those from mainland Europa at all?
An article from the zoo's website about the Scots wildcats: The Zoo | Love is in the air at Belfast Zoo!
This document by the IUCN Cat Specialist Group on the revised taxonomy of the Felidae family indeed subsumes Felis silvestris grampia into F. s. silvestris, doubting that the Scottish wildcat is not distinct enough to be considered a seperate subspecies:
https://repository.si.edu/bitstream...e_Taxonomy_CatNews.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y
This document by the IUCN Cat Specialist Group on the revised taxonomy of the Felidae family indeed subsumes Felis silvestris grampia into F. s. silvestris, doubting that the Scottish wildcat is not distinct enough to be considered a seperate subspecies:
https://repository.si.edu/bitstream...e_Taxonomy_CatNews.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
Fine, and neatly negates the need to bother with the Scottish ones - until someone else changes their mind again, and they've been lost... remind anyone of their big stripy cousins?...
There seems to be an acceptance( or a belief anyway) now that few if any 100% pure Scottish cats remain, yet there must be vast areas of the more remote parts of Scotland that have not been looked at for their presence- only those five target areas. So repopulation, using either European cats and/or cats with hybrid genes from the current captive breeding programme may be on the horizon, while unknown pure cats of the grampia race do still remain somewhere.
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
Yes indeed; and removal of the separation of grampia, would facilitate the release of European animals or hybrids, as of course they would not be hybrids under the new classification. All a bit convenient, really....
It is indeed-a bit convenient...
Did researchers genotype any museum type specimens and those in minimum valid sample size? It is all well and good to be sceptical, but that means zilch without proof to the contrary! Proof gentlemen and ladies please!
I'm sure research was done on museum specimens of both. I know it has been done on Scottish cats, with emphasis on historical specimens that were believed to be purer before hybridisation took hold. But I think they found evidence of some hybridisation even going back hundreds of years. I believe there is still difference of opinion as to how close grampia and sylvestris really are though. It may only be considered as a distinction at race level now, but if European cats are introduced to bolster the Scottish population, then the original grampia race will eventually be lost for good, even if any pure specimens do still exist in remote areas where they haven't even been looked for yet. The other alternative is the release of near-pure cats from the captive programme-which is frequently mentioned as being the plan. These cats would be grampia with some (low) hybrid content. I am unclear whether the intention is to release both types though it appears that way at present.
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Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
Proof before (or after) extinction..?
Phenotypical differences seem low and based on the genetic work I found so far the Scottish Wildcat seems to be nested within European Wildcats. If a population was special in W Europe, it would be the Iberian population. This would make sense as the colonization of Wildcats of N Europe would only have occured after the last glaciation (and similar to Red Deer), this means that the main difference is between different refugia (Iberia, Balkans), not the areas subsequently colonized.
Incidentally, from memory this looks to be true, but not solely due to the reason you suggest - I seem to recall there is evidence that there may be genetic admixture with the African species in the Iberian Peninsula, though whether this is a result of natural overlap in the past or introductions is probably impossible to know.
In geological terms the separation of UK from the European continent was indeed Esther recent and thanks for commenting as I had similar donuts over grampia/sylvestris separation.
One more point on grampia: what basis for claims of not researched outlier grampia populations? Any validity to this argument (I am having doubts there as well)?