Thanks, but you voiced your opinion very well. Whereas I have had this discussion already before.@Batto You said it way much better than I could
Zoo/Aquarium Hot Takes
- Thread starter pachyderm pro
- Start date
If you approve of elephants, great apes, and birds in captivity, there's no reason you shouldn't approve of cetaceans in captivity.
Yes, I do mean SeaWorld should be doing better with what they have. The two areas I mentioned both use the same type of ride (river raft), both use animal exhibits in the ride, and both were created by a large company. Disneys stand out because they include a great exhibit (They use islands with loads of natural trees and plants along with lots of climbing opportunities and have ropes that lead to large towers allowing Gibbons to climb over guests), great education (the final scene of the ride is a giant rainforest that was burned down), and it is still enjoyable for guests. SeaWorlds ride lacks in education, the turtle exhibit is fairly small for the number of animals in it, but the ride is popular with guests.
There were three flamingo pools at SeaWorld in the last ten years: one was next to the now destroyed animal connections building, one next to the Manta ride, and one on the west side of the park across from the ride line.
As for your question, SeaWorld executives have given up on animals because of PETA and Blackfish. When was the last time they opened a new standalone exhibit? When was the last time they opened an educational exhibit? And how many new rollercoasters and rides have they built in the past 4 years? They have given up and are now phasing out Orcas and other animals and slowly becoming more of a theme park.
And as for their exhibits. Do you really think the current Eagle Ray pool next to Journey to Atlantis was big enough for Commersons Dolphins because it wasn't to a point where animals died. In Orlando do you think that their penguin exhibit should have low enough glass that the animals are constantly able to jump out? Back to San Diego do you truly believe that the Dolphin cove is deep enough to fit the need of Bottlenose Dolphins?
Now @amur leopard was correct I did make an error on one of my posts, I said Rescue Center PROFITS when I meant OPERATING COSTS that is my mistake and I am sorry.
I know you would think it's obvious that the workers did all of that stuff, so don't give the credit to the executives. It's like if you give credit to the school administration for the success of the football team. They didn't coach them or help them that was all the coaches and the football team. Don't give higher-ups credit for what aquarists and employees do.
That's exactly what I said in that post you just quoted! That post was in response to you being mad at the executives for not knowing how to care for an animal that had never been kept in captivity before.
Why those 3 specifically?
*Cracks knuckles* Ok, here goes nothing. Not sure if these are all hot takes, but...
- An exhibit isn't bad because it's indoors. I've seen exhibits being dismissed entirely for the fact that there just happens to be a solid ceiling above, and often out of reach of, the inhabitants. No, the tapir/pygmy hippo exhibits at the Lied Jungle would not be improved if said enclosures were outside instead.
- Speaking of Omaha, Expedition Madagascar is really not that bad.
- Exhibits that group animals by geography are not inherently better than those that group by taxonomy. Likewise, there is no issue with Zoos exhibiting animals "out of pace" (such as Amur Leopards in Africa-themed exhibits) if the Zoo has few options otherwise.
- Saltwater/Oceanic fish are too over-represented. Freshwater fish are likewise underrepresented. The US really needs more Tennessee Aquariums.
- NCZ's Desert was better when it just had North American Wildlife (not that there is anything wrong with it as it is now; the Ocelot did get SHea better exhibit out of the change). Also, Streamside was better when the terrariums still had water in them.
- Farm animals don't belong in Zoos.
I 100% agree with the first one, especially in colder climates where the animals could only be outside half the year. I'm not qualified to judge Omaha or North Carolina as I've never been to either. Totally agree on your geography vs. taxonomy point as well, oftentimes taxonomically themed Exhibits can make more sense, especially for reptile houses and aviaries. I respectfully disagree with you on farm animals, however. Nowadays many kids are far removed from the animals that we eat, and I do think there is value to larger zoos maintaining a small farmyard with domestic animals- particularly if endangered heritage breeds are displayed. It should not be the top priority of zoos to keep farm animals, but I generally support their existence.*Cracks knuckles* Ok, here goes nothing. Not sure if these are all hot takes, but...
- An exhibit isn't bad because it's indoors. I've seen exhibits being dismissed entirely for the fact that there just happens to be a solid ceiling above, and often out of reach of, the inhabitants. No, the tapir/pygmy hippo exhibits at the Lied Jungle would not be improved if said enclosures were outside instead.
- Speaking of Omaha, Expedition Madagascar is really not that bad.
- Exhibits that group animals by geography are not inherently better than those that group by taxonomy. Likewise, there is no issue with Zoos exhibiting animals "out of pace" (such as Amur Leopards in Africa-themed exhibits) if the Zoo has few options otherwise.
- Saltwater/Oceanic fish are too over-represented. Freshwater fish are likewise underrepresented. The US really needs more Tennessee Aquariums.
- NCZ's Desert was better when it just had North American Wildlife (not that there is anything wrong with it as it is now; the Ocelot did get SHea better exhibit out of the change). Also, Streamside was better when the terrariums still had water in them.
- Farm animals don't belong in Zoos.
The Henry Doorly's Kingdoms of the Night has not been that changed since it opened, and retains many of the same signage and structure, this goes with the Desert Dome as well. The Mutual of Omaha's Wild Pavilion is also a scarcely updated exhibit with older signage and design, and I find immense charm in places that look like they are straight out of an older time. I also enjoyed many of San Diego's older developments more than their newer ones.
Expedition Madagascar is one of my favorite spots in the zoo. The exhibit may be a little cramped but barely nobody is ever in there and it's a nice quiet place to escape.
- Speaking of Omaha, Expedition Madagascar is really not that bad.
- NCZ's Desert was better when it just had North American Wildlife (not that there is anything wrong with it as it is now; the Ocelot did get SHea better exhibit out of the change). Also, Streamside was better when the terrariums still had water in them.
- Farm animals don't belong in Zoos.
I agree the desert shouldn't have gone more exotic. It's in the North American section and I feel like the expansion into African Deserts just is not something I prefer. If they want to put African Deserts somewhere, how about restoring the African Pavilion?
The other day when I was at the Omaha Zoo, I found it weird that the zoo has two goat petting areas. I really don't care about farm animals considering if I want to see them, plenty of my friends live on farms with animals, and I'm able to get more hands on there without small screaming children.
Where would they put a decent new exhibit at SeaWorld SD? What would they even add? They already have pretty much all the marine life bases covered. And their focus is not on land animals.
Well yeah they're phasing out Orca, there's nothing they can do with them! Thanks to PETA's garbage laws were enacted that now SeaWorld cannot breed them, transport them across state lines, or take in new ones. Once they all eventually die that's the end of the species in captivity here in the US. The higher ups didn't make than decision, it was handed to them. I've heard there's an attempt to get the other cetacean species pinned the same way, at least in California. (Which is downright garbage in my opinion)
Do I think it was the best dolphin exhibit? Not particularly. But can you prove that the deaths were related to the size of the exhibit? I'd be interested to see any information you have proving that. And I mean something you can link, not just "Oh I heard this."
Do the penguins jump out? I've seen more than one penguin exhibit with low glass/fencing. Also I know that exhibit is one of most successful breeders of Subantarctic penguins in the US.
They have a deeper part in the back. Given i have seen Bottlenose Dolphins chasing prey onto beaches and following them, and hunting in fairly shallow water I doubt having a shallow end of the pool affects them much.
Yet you still haven't proven where you got that figure. Two of us now have questioned the figure after looking over the publicly visible report. Unless you have a different report you can link that shows that figure, it's not legitimate.
You said you were going to address that this morning and you have not.
I give them credit for hiring good people. They have some of the best animal care staff around. Do they help with the day to day care of the animals? No. But they do fight to keep their marine mammals, they fought against the orca legislation. Theme parks they may be but SeaWorlds, Busch Gardens, and Discovery Cove are all AZA. Six Flags isn't, and I don't think they have been. The higher ups fund one of the biggest rescue and rehab programs in North America. And on top of that they still donate conservation money elsewhere too.
Cause clearly birds are on the same level as cetaceans
If you mean same level as in altitude level.
If you mean same level as in altitude level.
Always a little mental bonus point for a zoo from me if they have domestic animals but have specifically local breeds, as well (to pick some UK examples, the Oxford Sandy and Black pigs at Cotswold or the Leicester Longwool sheep at Twycross are always nice to see).
Strix
Well-Known Member
Why exactly? These three examples all have very different requirements, all of them easier to care for than cetaceans. I believe that most current exhibits with cetaceans don’t give them the space they need, but the few that do are alright imo. I don’t understand your relation between, say, an orca and a finch at all though.
Mattaki actually just posted above the relation between them
I also too enjoy Expedition madagascar, especially since A little boy I've always loved the fauna from there, and that section of the zoo (at least when I'm there) is usually quite quiet and not many people are there, And a bonus, it was my first and Only mouse lemur so far that I saw there.
Disney movies: The place where zoology is non-existent.... (0 - 0)
If a zoo decides to use geographical theming, I'd rather see them have one or two areas that truly represent the geographical area they feature than have more areas that only give a partial picture of the Exhibited place. Of course this doesn't apply to zoos with a few hundred acres who are able to accurately represent all five continents if they want to...