ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Slightly off topic, but was the Mary mentioned here the same Mary who was the mother of Mike, who sired Hamilton Zoo's Lucifer and Luka?
Australasian Common Chimpanzee Population
- Thread starter Zoofan15
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Slightly off topic, but was the Mary mentioned here the same Mary who was the mother of Mike, who sired Hamilton Zoo's Lucifer and Luka?
No, different Mary’s.
Mary (1960-1977) was born at Taronga Zoo to Bobby and Susie. She was the first of her mother’s nine offspring (the ninth being Shiba). She transferred out (to the Great Moscow Circus) in 1968.
Mary 2 (1956-1989) arrived at Taronga Zoo in 1964 and is believed to have been wild born. Since the original Mary was still at Taronga Zoo when she arrived, she was referred to as ‘Mary 2’, which was later dropped. This female was the mother of Mike, Melissa, Mervin and Monte.
Being technical, I also should have noted that Cassius’ parents were both sired by Bobby, making him a relative of every chimpanzee at Taronga bar Ceres and Naomi.
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ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Thanks for clarifying that there were two different chimps named Mary! If Taronga's Mary was indeed wildborn, that makes her descendants very genetically valuable indeed.
Very true. The descendants of Mary (1956-1989) are:
1.0 Lucifer (16/06/1988) Mike x Lucy
1.0 Luka (28/02/1993) Mike x Lucy
0.1 Chiku (15/02/2016) Luka x Sanda
0.1 Kendi (17/12/2020) Luka x Sanda
1.0 Shabani (14/09/1994) Monte x Shiba
Mike was also listed as a potential sire of Shiba (1981) and Cara (1981), meaning their families could potentially be Mary’s descendants also. The prime paternity candidate for siring Shiba was the beta male Flint; and the prime paternity candidate for siring Cara was the alpha male Jojo.
Cara (1981); her son Alexis (1998); and her grandson Akida (2021) are the only living descendants of Bessie (1950-2011) in Australasia. Alexis will hopefully sire his second infant to Malika this year.
Quite sad news to hear regarding Cassius - although expected following the announcement of his decline a few weeks ago.
I'm glad that Cassius had the opportunity to spend time later in life in a decent sized chimp community. He had a close bond with Alon who clearly respected and admired the older male. And from all the videos I've seen, Cassius also seemed very attentive to the younger chimps too, which, growing up in his situation, was obviously a novelty to him.
It's a huge testament to the keepers that Cassius was able to live so long. I believe he now holds the regional record for males of this species and would certainly be up there globally too with his longevity.
To my knowledge, Cassius does indeed hold the regional longevity record for a male of his species. Bobby (1954-2004) at Auckland Zoo, Charlie (1969-2010) at Willowbank/Mogo and Tom (1950-1990) were other long lived males; as well as Taronga’s Jojo (1964-2016, who died in the US approaching his 52nd birthday.
The five oldest living chimpanzees in the region are as follows:
0.1 Lucy (24/11/1975) Unknown x Lulu
1.0 Boyd (29/10/1978) Tom x Bebe
0.1 Lisa (23/08/1979) Unknown x Lulu
0.1 Sacha (11/06/1980) Unknown x Spitter
0.1 Shiba (22/05/1981) Unknown x Susie
It’s hard to imagine the region’s third oldest chimpanzee has a 23 month old infant, with her birth in 2023 making Lisa the oldest mother of a surviving infant in the region.
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Thanks for this. It seems that Chiku and Kendi will be very desirable females when they are old enough to be transferred out for the breeding programme! It also seems highly likely that there will be another breeding recommendation for Luka and Sanda, what with Kendi turning 5 this year.
I wonder if Hamilton Zoo will receive additional females at some stage, since Luka is still in good health and perfectly capable of siring more offspring, even though Sanda is aging.
Teddy at Melbourne also reached the age of 40. He was wild born in 1952 and passed in 1992.
Boyd himself is also achieving a great record; he'll celebrate his 47th birthday this year. Meaning he's surpassed his father, Tom, and is the third oldest male in regional history after Bobby at Auckland and Cassius at Rockhampton.
It's also interesting to see two of Lulu's daughters being the oldest - even more so when you consider one last had an infant thirty years ago and the other just a few years ago!
Yes, I’m looking forward to hearing news Sanda is pregnant again. She passed a health check (to confirm her health ahead of another pregnancy) and they’re a genetically valuable pair, so there’s no reason she shouldn’t receive a breeding recommendation.
I’ve previously asked about Hamilton receiving more females, but was told it was unlikely due to Luka’s history. The keeper thought they would continue with their current troop (centred around Sanda and her offspring).
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
I too am looking forward to hearing of another pregnancy for Sanda! I'm confident she'll have another infant as she is such a successful mother with her two daughters. Another female offspring would be valuable for the breeding programme, and a male would also be of great value as he would likely become the successor to Luka as alpha (it's pretty safe to say Lucifer will never challenge his brother) and new females could be imported in the future to breed with him when he matures.
That makes sense, that Hamilton wouldn't look towards further female imports with Luka's history - there was the tragic situation with Chima and also the conflict with Fimi when she and Sanda arrived, although Luka has gone on to establish a wonderful bond with Sanda. There's also the matter of Lucy, who despite her advanced age is still a force to be reckoned with in the troop!
Hamilton Zoo has been conscious not to rock the boat due to past issues within their chimpanzee troop. Though they have less than the husbandry guidelines’ recommended number of chimpanzees for a healthy social structure (minimum of three adult males and minimum of four adult females), they hold a cohesive troop, with minimal conflict. Other zoos with just two adult males have reported conflicts, but Luka and Lucifer get along without issue. On nearly every one of my visits over the past couple of years, Lucifer and Lucy have been sat together; with Luka, Sanda and their offspring either spending time together as a family unit or splitting off into pairs (e.g. Luka/Chiku and Sanda/Kendi).
I’ve always though two things could have improved Hamilton Zoo’s current situation:
1. Allowing Mike and Lucy to have bred again in the mid-2000’s, following their transfer to Hamilton Zoo. There was the small risk one of Lucy’s sons could have sired the infant, but Luka didn’t immediately assume the alpha role and my money would have been on Mike.
2. Transferring in Chima and Keza from Wellington Zoo in the mid-2000’s. They were adolescent females at the dispersal age. They would have had each other for support and Luka, being an adolescent male himself at the time may have been more receptive to them.
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Very good points. Although small, Hamilton's chimpanzees are a very harmonious troop, with all the personalities involved blending well. On my last visit in early March, the dynamics were pretty much as you've outlined, with the addition of Chiku and Kendi spending quite a bit of time together in play. The sisters appear to have a strong bond and a vigorous play-based relationship, which bodes well for them being strong support for each other in the future.
I've always wondered why Mike and Lucy never had another infant, either at Auckland or Hamilton, especially due to the genetic value of both their lines! And it will always be a pity that Susie and Sally were behavioural non-breeders.
Lucy featured in the first series of The Zoo in a storyline involving her being given a contraceptive implant. Luka was five years old at the time and the previous contraceptive implant (administered 1995) was beginning to wear off. The reason given was that Auckland Zoo didn’t have the space to accomodate more chimpanzees.
Once the wheels were set in motion to transfer Auckland’s troop to Hamilton (circa 2004), that would have been an ideal time for Lucy to have come off contraception/breed again in my opinion. She was otherwise retired from breeding at just 18 years of age! By 2004, her nephew Lubutu at Taronga Zoo was established as the alpha male and the sire of four infants, so that may have been considered sufficient representation of the L line, though I feel like Lucy breeding would have enhanced the troop dynamics at Hamilton and should have still bred on those grounds.
I note the decision to transfer Auckland’s troop to Hamilton was circa 2004 (despite the exhibit opening in October 2004) because the then director had expressed his surprise/trepidation in Hamilton Zoo receiving the Auckland chimpanzees, implying Hamilton Zoo’s decision to exhibit chimpanzees was made before Auckland’s decision to phase out (and it was not necessarily a given they’d be receiving the Auckland troop). It was of course fortuitous for Auckland Zoo given the challenges of managing that troop in a small outdated exhibit and the need for increased space for their Bornean orangutans (with two adult males, an adolescent male and five adult females at the time; increasing to nine orangutans with the birth of Madju).
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Yes, that makes sense about the lack of space at Auckland, and I agree with you that it would have been beneficial for the troop to have Lucy breed once more even if Lubutu's offspring were considered sufficient representation of the L line. Especially with Mike's mother Mary's line being underrepresented.
It was indeed fortuitous for Auckland that Hamilton was able to accommodate the chimps - for the zoo's and the apes' sake, also for visitors who enjoyed seeing the chimps and they were still relatively close for those who wished to travel to see them. Auckland Zoo's decision to be a Southern Hemisphere and Asian themed zoo meant that orangutans would be the only great apes housed in Auckland from then on, and at the time, Auckland certainly did need the space. It was insufficient for the chimps and, as it turns out, for the orangutans as well - the orangutan exhibit today is much better than anything they've had in the past!
Gender Ratio of Wellington’s Troop
It’s worth noting that the unfortunate deaths of Jessie (aged 46 years) in July 2024 and Samantha (aged 41 years) in March 2025 have reduced Wellington’s troop to 4.4 chimpanzees.
In 2009, the opportunity to offload two adult males to Monarto was cited by Wellington as beneficial in balancing out the gender ratio of their troop, which was male heavy. Their troop in 2009 contained five adult males; five adult females; one adolescent male; one adolescent female; and one infant male.
Factoring in that one of Wellington’s males is a 3.5 year old juvenile and things are far from critical. However, the loss of a further adult female would be keenly felt. Bakari will turn 13 next month and Kitwe is 10.5 years. Alexis does a good job at keeping them in check, but it’s clear conflict will arise as they enter their enter young adulthood.
1.0 Alexis (20/08/1998) Boyd x Cara
1.0 Bakari (11/06/2012) Sam x Sally
1.0 Kitwe (15/11/2014) Sam x Keza
1.0 Akida (01/11/2021) Alexis x Sally
0.1 Cara (10/09/1981) Unknown x Chiki
0.1 Sally (13/01/1985) Unknown x Spitter
0.1 Keza (06/07/1998) Marty x Samantha
0.1 Malika (27/10/2010) Sam x Samantha
Obviously we hope Wellington’s females (or all their chimpanzees for that matter) have long lives ahead of them; but Cara turns 44 years old this year and Sally is 40 years old. Reaching their 60’s is a luxury a handful of captive chimpanzees reach, but the deaths of Jessie and Samantha in their mid-40’s are a reminder this is by no means a given.
My expectation is that (as we’ve all discussed in the past) two females from the same natal troop will be transferred to Wellington in the future. Hope (2019) and Zola (2019) at Monarto appear the strongest candidates. They’re six years now and could realistically transfer out at 10-12 years of age, meaning Wellington Zoo could have the opportunity to acquire new females within 4-6 years.
It’s worth noting that the unfortunate deaths of Jessie (aged 46 years) in July 2024 and Samantha (aged 41 years) in March 2025 have reduced Wellington’s troop to 4.4 chimpanzees.
In 2009, the opportunity to offload two adult males to Monarto was cited by Wellington as beneficial in balancing out the gender ratio of their troop, which was male heavy. Their troop in 2009 contained five adult males; five adult females; one adolescent male; one adolescent female; and one infant male.
Factoring in that one of Wellington’s males is a 3.5 year old juvenile and things are far from critical. However, the loss of a further adult female would be keenly felt. Bakari will turn 13 next month and Kitwe is 10.5 years. Alexis does a good job at keeping them in check, but it’s clear conflict will arise as they enter their enter young adulthood.
1.0 Alexis (20/08/1998) Boyd x Cara
1.0 Bakari (11/06/2012) Sam x Sally
1.0 Kitwe (15/11/2014) Sam x Keza
1.0 Akida (01/11/2021) Alexis x Sally
0.1 Cara (10/09/1981) Unknown x Chiki
0.1 Sally (13/01/1985) Unknown x Spitter
0.1 Keza (06/07/1998) Marty x Samantha
0.1 Malika (27/10/2010) Sam x Samantha
Obviously we hope Wellington’s females (or all their chimpanzees for that matter) have long lives ahead of them; but Cara turns 44 years old this year and Sally is 40 years old. Reaching their 60’s is a luxury a handful of captive chimpanzees reach, but the deaths of Jessie and Samantha in their mid-40’s are a reminder this is by no means a given.
My expectation is that (as we’ve all discussed in the past) two females from the same natal troop will be transferred to Wellington in the future. Hope (2019) and Zola (2019) at Monarto appear the strongest candidates. They’re six years now and could realistically transfer out at 10-12 years of age, meaning Wellington Zoo could have the opportunity to acquire new females within 4-6 years.
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
Hopefully an infant from Malika will help to boost numbers, and I am hopeful that in future years Hope and Zola will be transferred to Wellington. I had hoped it would be Chiku and Kendi so they could stay within NZ, but their being related to some of the Wellington males means that won't be a possibility and they'll likely go to Australia. I would love the opportunity someday to see Hope and Zola in person, though.
Another infant I'm hoping for is one from Luka and Sanda at Hamilton Zoo. With Kendi due to turn 5 this year, barring any obstacles it would be a good time for Sanda to get a breeding recommendation - I think it's likely that she will, especially with the unfortunate passing of Tsotsi meaning that her line is underrepresented.
It's possible that Hamilton might consider retaining Chiku and Kendi if they don't end up having a younger brother. Once Luka and Lucifer pass on, they could then work on acquiring some additional males (and maybe females), to join Sanda/Chiku/Kendi.
Sanda should hopefully get another recommendation. The only thing against her at this point is her age. If she's in perfect health, I don't see why they shouldn't give her another recommendation. Lisa at Taronga recently produced an infant aged 43 so it's do-able!
I meant to post an update following my visit to Hamilton Zoo last Friday, but unfortunately Sanda did not appear to be pregnant. She was looking very slim compared to her adolescent daughter Chiku; and to Lucy, who will turn an impressive 50 years of age in November.
That’s not to say Sanda won’t breed in the future (or even that she isn’t in the early stages of pregnancy); but it’s been 4.5 years since Kendi was born and I was hopeful she might have received a breeding recommendation/been close to having an infant by now. Sanda underwent a health check last year, which was undertaken in part of ascertain whether she was in good enough health to undergo another pregnancy. It was determined she was.
ApeLadyNZ
Well-Known Member
@Zoofan15 - thanks for the update! Even if Sanda isn't pregnant now, hopefully she will receive a breeding recommendation at some stage. I see no reason why she shouldn't!
As @Jambo suggested, the structure of Hamilton Zoo's chimp troop in the future will depend a lot on the sex of Sanda's third infant, should she produce one. If she has a son, he'll likely be the future successor to Luka, Chiku and Kendi will be transferred out and new females will be brought in. Should Sanda have a third daughter, it looks like Chiku and Kendi might be retained, and new males be brought in when Lucifer and Luka pass on (and possibly, new females also).
I hope Monarto undertake paternity testing soon as that would give a conclusive answer to the representation of the now deceased Tsotsi (brother of Sanda), who has one confirmed offspring (Hope); but another potential two in Zola and Happy.
It would be similarly beneficial to retrospectively ascertain whether Mike sired Shiba or Cara while those females are still alive as more descendants from these females are inevitable (especially with Alexis anticipated to sire Malika’s first infant; and Shiba’s daughters at least presumably being given an opportunity to breed in the future).
I hope long term that Hamilton Zoo can establish a larger troop. If Sanda has a third daughter at Hamilton Zoo, another way to do it could be to bring in 3.2 new chimpanzees once Luka/Lucifer pass. The two incoming females would be bonded/from the same natal troop and have each other for support; while Chiku (the eldest sister) could remain at Hamilton as a breeding female. She’d have the benefit of breeding while she has the support of her mother and sisters and by the time her sisters transfer out (and her mother may have died), she’d be well established in the troop with 2+ offspring of her own; meaning she won’t be left an outsider against the two incoming females. It wouldn’t be ideal to have three sisters all in the same troop from a genetic standpoint, so ideally they’d be split 0.1/0.2 - with the two transferring out together so they’d have each other for support. At this point in time, Sydney Zoo appears their best option.