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I honestly am completely at a loss as to why this is getting such a big backlash. It’s a decision the zoo has made, end of. There is nothing anyone can do. Will I miss the hippos yes but complaing to the heavens that capybaras are replacing them is getting tedious and incredibly repetitive.
Last I knew this was forum where people could express their opinions. My opinion on this remains one of sadness that ZSL (great organisation that does a lot of good) is getting out of hippos after a century and a half, replacing a charismatic megafauna with a rodent. And yes, I know Capybara are currently fashionable….
 
I honestly am completely at a loss as to why this is getting such a big backlash. It’s a decision the zoo has made, end of. There is nothing anyone can do. Will I miss the hippos yes but complaing to the heavens that capybaras are replacing them is getting tedious and incredibly repetitive.

I agree! We're all dissapointed that Whipsnade are going out of Common hippos(as we all know they're an iconic species) but the decision has been made and we have to accept it.

Personally there are 2 other zoos in the South that I would have liked to see gone into the species but it'll never happen.
 
I think the majority of keepers worth their salt will tell you working with a semi-aquatic rodent is a significant comedown to working with Common hippopotamus!o_O
Having worked with them for many years, I can tell you that they are dull to the point of being tedious and not 'nice' to work with at all. Cute as babies, but that wears off very quickly - then again the same could be said for most of us.
They are just a big guinea-pig after all, and manage to make meerkats look fascinating. The current trend is an example of spin triumphing over content - and they are VERY common in all sorts of collections. The rodent version of a Bennett's Wallaby perhaps, but at least that has the basic interest of being a marsupial with an upside-down reproductive system - to a Pom at least.
 
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I honestly am completely at a loss as to why this is getting such a big backlash. It’s a decision the zoo has made, end of. There is nothing anyone can do. Will I miss the hippos yes but complaing to the heavens that capybaras are replacing them is getting tedious and incredibly repetitive.
I don't see a problem with people expressing their frustration. A species that was universally adored on this forum and is really hard to come by is gone. In its place is a species that most of us have seen too many times to count. It is, for most of us, a big downgrade. We are allowed to feel upset, and we are allowed to discuss with other people online why we feel upset. ;)

In the past I have found myself infuriated at people's irrational (or so I deemed it) criticism of ZSL. But I don't think this is irrational. I'm sure ZSL have their reasons not to replace the old hippos with new ones, but they haven't told us this. Most of us were very disappointed to see the hippos had left - a species that is charismatic and crowd-pleasing, yet also extremely rare in captivity in this country. A joy for casual zoo-goers and enthusiasts alike, as well as a species that has played a huge role in the Society's long and fascinating history. It was sad that they are gone, but I think most of us, including me, took a similar approach of hoping that whatever replaced them was similarly amazing and gave us enough of a 'silver lining' to move on from the hippos. For most of us (and I am glad to hear that there are exceptions who love the species), capybara just don't cut it.

I adore ZSL, and I adore the very much upwards trajectory that the zoo is on at the moment. But that doesn't mean they aren't open to criticism. No-one is. My football club is currently in the best place it has ever been under the best manager that it has ever had, but if he makes a poor substitution that costs us the game, I will criticise him all the same. That analogy applies here, I think. With the rate at which new, interesting species are arriving and that new, high-quality exhibits are closing, ZSL is arguably at the best place it has been in years, and I love that. But I still criticise them where I deem it warranted.

Other people will be better-informed on this than myself, but I don't think people at ZSL (or any other zoo) in power to make decisions such as this typically read through these forums. And if they do so, then they can either conclude that us enthusiasts make up a small percentage of their visitor numbers and dismiss it, or interpret it as constructive criticism from people who are really passionate about it. I don't believe there is any damage done to the zoo or anyone else by being a bit critical, as long as it isn't excessive, unfair, or targetted at particular staff members. Therefore, I don't see a problem with people continuing to point out any disappointments with our beloved zoos, and I will continue to do so. So long as nobody is doing it 'for the sake of it,' irrationally or unfairly.

As a side-note, I am delighted to hear that the keepers at Whipsnade don't share our sadness and are looking forward to working with the species. :) It is very important that the staff enjoy their work and don't look back on the days of working with hippos too regretfully. Asides from my personal bias that comes from having just seen them too many times, capybara are cute, interesting, and potentially fun to work with.
 
To be honest, it's all personal preference, really, isn't it?

Probably for everyone devastated the hippos are going, there's someone entirely ambivalent about it. Ditto capybara.
 
I just think a few too many people are making it sound as if hippos were phased out in favor of capybara when more likely the decision to phase out hippos was made first. Capybara may only be a stop-gap specied to fill an otherwise perpetually empty enclosure with something popular. Perhaps it's not a preference of hippo versus capybara but empty exhibit versus capybara.

It's perfectly understandable to be disappointed, I certainly am despite being far across the pond, and I do come from understanding. Brookfield had an empty hippo exhibit for years. Something was better than nothing, and hippos are now slated to return.
 
I also think it's always worth considering the fact not every keeper knows everything. Someone was asking the macaque keeper a few weeks ago about where the emu had gone and he didn't know it had moved and the tufted deer had moved in. As he said, he wasn't a bird keeper. I wonder if there's a bit of 'not overstepping' into other departments/teams at times.

In my experience, news tends not to get shared between the keeping teams unless they know each other socially, with the exception of the very high-profile stuff (big / charismatic animal moves, births, deaths, etc.) The most reliable source of news at ZSL London was actually the guy who did pest control, because he talked to everybody as part of his job! :D

It's also worth noting that I've had at least three non-zoo people approach me separately in the last few weeks to ask whether "London Zoo has capybara now?!", two of whom are now making plans to visit before they leave for Whipsnade. I don't understand it, myself, but they're obviously able to bring people (and money) through the gates in a way that the other species proposed in this thread (tapir, deer, etc.) likely would not. Not to mention the possibility of well-attended animal talks / feeds and, of course, the usual paid experiences.

I do empathise with the people who are disappointed, but I find that I can't fault Whipsnade's decision-making here. It's clear they were unable and / or unwilling to keep common hippo long-term - whether due to cost, the suitability of their enclosure, or simply something that's out of their hands (as breeding recommendations almost always are). With the recent proposed changes to animal welfare in zoos, it may be that they felt it was better to go out of one or two species in order to focus on providing for their more successful breeding groups of megafauna - of which they have a great many. If the choices were therefore between an empty paddock, more medium-sized hoofstock to add to their current collection of medium-sized hoofstock (which, whilst admittedly excellent, isn't exactly a must-see for most visitors) or an easy-to-care-for species that will bring people through the gates... well, I know which one I would choose, and I say that as someone who was fully ready to go and see a single duiker in that massive enclosure! :D

If the capybara end up in the old hippo enclosure, then I would hope the long-term plan is to mix them with something that has more conservation value and get the best of both worlds. Given how popular the capybara have been at London, it does feel like a rather out-of-the-way place to put them.....
 
In my experience, news tends not to get shared between the keeping teams unless they know each other socially, with the exception of the very high-profile stuff (big / charismatic animal moves, births, deaths, etc.) The most reliable source of news at ZSL London was actually the guy who did pest control, because he talked to everybody as part of his job! :D

I'd say this is fairly consistent with most jobs. I only find out what's happening in other departments in my workplace because I have lunch with people across the workplace each day. Why would I know the day-to-day stuff of another team? I've got enough on my plate with my own team.
 
On my recent vist I noticed half the indoor giraffe area was closed off with straw bales all around the outside walls, not sure what this means if anything.
 
The most reliable source of news at ZSL London was actually the guy who did pest control, because he talked to everybody as part of his job! :D

If the capybara end up in the old hippo enclosure, then I would hope the long-term plan is to mix them with something that has more conservation value and get the best of both worlds. Given how popular the capybara have been at London, it does feel like a rather out-of-the-way place to put them.....

I do like the first part, it certainly has the ring of truth about it. :D In my experience, especially in larger zoos with big staff, you usually have to find the right keeper (for the relevant section) to maybe get the news or information you are seeking.

As to the the Capys, their recent popularity, or 'fashionable' status, is it, seems to have gone over my head- have they featured in a film or internet 'viral sensation' to make them suddenly so popular? It must be their look as they are largely innactive much of the time, but then so are hippos.... I know the Whipsnade Hippo transfer is a done deal but this leads me to wonder what would happen if Common hippo suddenly became 'fashionable'....
 
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On my recent vist I noticed half the indoor giraffe area was closed off with straw bales all around the outside walls, not sure what this means if anything.

Did you see both the calves that were born last year? As Lafone mentioned, straw bales set like that often means extra privacy or support for vet treatment, or even a calf being handraised but nothing has been announced afaik.
 
As to the the Capys, their recent popularity, or 'fashionable' status, is it, seems to have gone over my head- have they featured in a film or internet 'viral sensation' to make them suddenly so popular? It must be their look as they are largely innactive much of the time, but then so are hippos....
You're actually very close to it. The big line that goes around a lot is how they are the "chillest animal ever", though they are not as docile as people like to imagine. This is often accompanied by, for example, video of a Capybara sitting in a car, or popular music - there's a big meme I don't fully understand associating them with a party song ("ok I pull up") that originated from TikTok. There's also an unrelated meme involving a particularly cute photo of a Capybara named Gort.

They're perceived as very relaxed and agreeable and not easily phased, which are traits particularly admired/desired right now by young people, and they're also cute, and I think they are a bit "exotic" and "new" to the mainstream right now in the same way sloths were ten or twenty years ago.
 
You're actually very close to it. The big line that goes around a lot is how they are the "chillest animal ever", though they are not as docile as people like to imagine. This is often accompanied by, for example, video of a Capybara sitting in a car, or popular music - there's a big meme I don't fully understand associating them with a party song ("ok I pull up") that originated from TikTok. There's also an unrelated meme involving a particularly cute photo of a Capybara named Gort.

They're perceived as very relaxed and agreeable and not easily phased, which are traits particularly admired/desired right now by young people, and they're also cute, and I think they are a bit "exotic" and "new" to the mainstream right now in the same way sloths were ten or twenty years ago.

Thanks for the explanation, this is all way, way, way above my head:D but I know the sort of thing you are talking about I think. Strange how these qualities can get fixed to a certain species over time so that it becomes 'trendy'. Are they new Meerkats perhaps, at least temporarily. It probably also explains London's recent interest and related publicity about them. I was just looking at an old postcard of Capybara at Whipsnade circa the 1930's- though back then I doubt they elicited the same level of interest as indicated currently- so it won't be new for them historically speaking.
 
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Constructive criticism of course is what every forum is/should be based on. That is not what frustrates me, it’s the constant bashing of ZSL to be something that is not realistic for it to be.


ZSL not only has two sites to look after but countless conservation projects and whilst Whipsnade undoubtedly has the size to to look after hippos, that would continue to cost money and a bigger hippo exhibit would only amplify that. There are always animals at a zoo that one person will enjoy more than others. For me I’m not really an insect or invertebrate person but I know lots are. Personally I’m looking forward to seeing capybara (having not actually seen them for quite a while) and while I appreciate they may not be as iconic but we have to look at it from the animals perspective.


I would like to apologise if my post went beyond being a reasonable response (I didn’t have a good day yesterday so I think I let my emotions get the better of me). I think my main problem is the little belittling comments of which I know I’m also guilty of. It just doesn’t seem to me to be a good way of discussing something. If the hippos and capybara were being swapped between two completely inappropriate exhibits then that would be a much bigger issue. Ultimately the pair of capybara will be having a fantastic environment to live in and that is the most important thing.
 
I think a big element is on whether there are plans to keep a larger number of capybara and breed - a larger group (and cute babies) will have a lot more interest and use the size of the space. I do know Belfast had a few comments from visitors (mostly humorous) when they put capybara, which they’ve kept successfully for years, in the former lion enclosure. It also speaks to the “medium-size” hoofstock issue - a sizeable breeding herd with impressive males and calves is a different prospect for visitors than a pair or trio.
 
I think a big element is on whether there are plans to keep a larger number of capybara and breed - a larger group (and cute babies) will have a lot more interest and use the size of the space. I do know Belfast had a few comments from visitors (mostly humorous) when they put capybara, which they’ve kept successfully for years, in the former lion enclosure. It also speaks to the “medium-size” hoofstock issue - a sizeable breeding herd with impressive males and calves is a different prospect for visitors than a pair or trio.

Well they will have to get some more in as the current pair are brother/sister, however I'm sure there is no shortage of capys at other collections if they did want to breed.
 
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I do like the first part, it certainly has the ring of truth about it. :D In my experience, especially in larger zoos with big staff, you usually have to find the right keeper (for the relevant section) to maybe get the news or information you are seeking.

As to the the Capys, their recent popularity, or 'fashionable' status, is it, seems to have gone over my head- have they featured in a film or internet 'viral sensation' to make them suddenly so popular? It must be their look as they are largely innactive much of the time, but then so are hippos.... I know the Whipsnade Hippo transfer is a done deal but this leads me to wonder what would happen if Common hippo suddenly became 'fashionable'....
I agree, that finding the right keeper for the information you require can be difficult, especially in larger zoos, mind you, in my experience, keepers on the whole have no interest in anything other than what is happening on their section. I think that the escaped capybara (Cinnamon) at Hoo Zoo, last November, certainly put the species at a high public interest level. There was even a children's book written about him,plus being on the news nightly aswell.
 
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