Indian rhinos in US zoos
- Thread starter Kifaru Bwana
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- indian rhino
The Buffalo pair is very valuable from a purely genetic perspective as well as for the overall fitness of the Indian rhino population in the US.
If one scans the sit, one could say it is Buffalo, NY Bronx, Oklahoma, The Wilds, Toronto and White Oak really do matter for the Indian rhino SSP (this with 2 express dots).
* The above statement is is not taking away any of the shine of the breeding record of San Diego. It just goes to show that their success has made them overtly over-represented in the SSP population.
* I left out both Forth Worth, Lowry Park and Miami Metro Zoos as all these institutions have yet achieve reproductive success (while containing some genetically valuable individuals).
The only healthy debate one can level at San Diego is that SD-WAP has continued to breed from rhinos with a higher inbreeding coefficient when they could have phased breeding from them out or sent them and their offspring on to other regional programmes (where their genes are not yet fully represented) or even more challenging providing individuals for reintroduction programmes (an area not yet explored fully in global population management, but wished for and actively sought by WAZA).
The same debate goes for the Basel Zoo lines within the EEP ...... (I will take this all up in private pm with okapikpr)
If one scans the sit, one could say it is Buffalo, NY Bronx, Oklahoma, The Wilds, Toronto and White Oak really do matter for the Indian rhino SSP (this with 2 express dots).
* The above statement is is not taking away any of the shine of the breeding record of San Diego. It just goes to show that their success has made them overtly over-represented in the SSP population.
* I left out both Forth Worth, Lowry Park and Miami Metro Zoos as all these institutions have yet achieve reproductive success (while containing some genetically valuable individuals).
The only healthy debate one can level at San Diego is that SD-WAP has continued to breed from rhinos with a higher inbreeding coefficient when they could have phased breeding from them out or sent them and their offspring on to other regional programmes (where their genes are not yet fully represented) or even more challenging providing individuals for reintroduction programmes (an area not yet explored fully in global population management, but wished for and actively sought by WAZA).
The same debate goes for the Basel Zoo lines within the EEP ...... (I will take this all up in private pm with okapikpr)
We will have to deal with the regional species coordinators here. Perhaps the International studbook keeper could also play a pivotal role in this too. I am sure that everyone sees the scope for good cooperation here and the need to exchange genes unrepresented in other regions.
Anyhow, regarding the SSP rhinos .. how could I forget: Cincinnati's lone females are important, as is the new Peace River bull.
Anyhow, regarding the SSP rhinos .. how could I forget: Cincinnati's lone females are important, as is the new Peace River bull.
SSP population update
2007 successful Births
#389 "Rocky" M 02.10.2007 Arun x Jeta Montgomery, AL
#394 UNK M 05.01.2007 Sanjay x Ellah Bronx Zoo
#395 UNK F 28.10.2007 Himal x Dailey The Wilds
#396 UNK F 01.11.2007 Himal x Sanya The Wilds
2008 successful births
#400 "Jontu" M 25.01.2008 Arun x Jakichu SDWAP
#UNK "Clover" F 01.03.2008 Henry x Tashi Buffalo, NY
New Transfers
#259 "Gram" M from San Diego Zoo to Tanganyika Wildlife Park, Goddard, KS
#351 UNK M from Patna, India to SDWAP
#355 "Ecko" M from SDWAP to Safari Wild, Lakeland, FL
#364 UNK M from Patna, India to SDWAP to the Wilds
#368 "Khali" M from SDWAP to Safari Wild, Lakeland, FL
The is no record to the 3rd imported male that was to go to Peace River/Rum Creek. However, I have found many errors in the most current N American Rhino Studbook and Rum Creek is no longer part of the AZA and is not required to report to studbook keepers. I'll see if I can find more information.
2007 successful Births
#389 "Rocky" M 02.10.2007 Arun x Jeta Montgomery, AL
#394 UNK M 05.01.2007 Sanjay x Ellah Bronx Zoo
#395 UNK F 28.10.2007 Himal x Dailey The Wilds
#396 UNK F 01.11.2007 Himal x Sanya The Wilds
2008 successful births
#400 "Jontu" M 25.01.2008 Arun x Jakichu SDWAP
#UNK "Clover" F 01.03.2008 Henry x Tashi Buffalo, NY
New Transfers
#259 "Gram" M from San Diego Zoo to Tanganyika Wildlife Park, Goddard, KS
#351 UNK M from Patna, India to SDWAP
#355 "Ecko" M from SDWAP to Safari Wild, Lakeland, FL
#364 UNK M from Patna, India to SDWAP to the Wilds
#368 "Khali" M from SDWAP to Safari Wild, Lakeland, FL
The is no record to the 3rd imported male that was to go to Peace River/Rum Creek. However, I have found many errors in the most current N American Rhino Studbook and Rum Creek is no longer part of the AZA and is not required to report to studbook keepers. I'll see if I can find more information.
Hi okapikpr,
Surprised!
I was already up-to-date regarding the births in 2007/2008, but the recent male out transfers from SD-WAP indicate a trend, no? What kind of facility is Lakeland, FL; are they part of AZA?
Regarding Peace River/Rum Creek; I am a little perturbed ... Peace River left (or was expelled from) AZA ...
What happens to the animals transferred out there? The way I see it these remain the property of the SSP, am I right?
In particular, the male imported from Delhi Zoo in 2007 is integral to the SSP future development. If Peace River is no longer providing records to the studbook keeper that entails a direct infringement on the property/breeding loan ethic. What can the studbook keeper do here?
Anyhow, I also find it disconcerting that the Delhi Zoo male Brahmaputra is not even mentioned in the new studbook!
Well, I suppose you will either pm or comment here!
Cheers,
Jelle
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
Would you have any clue about where the Three females went to in India?
Safari Wild in Lakeland, FL is co-owned by Lex Salisbury, Director of Lowry Park Zoo, Tampa, FL, and a local veterinarian. It is part of AZA, but of ZAOA the other and little known accreditating zoo organization in the US. They had a troop of Patas Monkeys escape last month into the Florida swamps and have only recovered two. There has been some worries of Salisbury's use of the park as a holding/breeding facility for the Lowry Park Zoo. Should a zoo director use publicly owned animals to financially benefit him?
The AZA and its SSP have no legal authority over those animals. Peace River left the AZA because of the politics (they also probably got some heat regarding their record keeping practices). The SSP can only reccommend that those animals' owners removed the animals involved.
A studbook keeper can do absolutely nothing. As for the legal issues, I do not know the details of the male rhino imports. Peace River may have legal ownership of that male.
okapikpr,
Thanks for your comments, it has been enlightening. I seem to remember the story of the escape of patas monkeys from a private facility that was alligned to the Lowry Park Zoo. I thought the facility was designed to overcome the present inability for LP Zoo to acquire land for its envisaged countryside zoo breeding facility. Thus the CEO of the Board stepped in to provide land for them in the interval. Sure, one can argue about the desirability and probable conflict of interests here, but I suppose the benefits outweigh its disadvantages.
Regarding the Delhi bull loan out to Peace River, I am shocked. I was under the impression that these imports would benefit the SSP. It now seems that Peace River is less than forthcoming and gone out of the AZA organisation.
Yet looking at what happened to loaned out eastern black rhino at Peace River. These have all been returned to their original owners following Peace River's failure to provide adequate accomodation and care. Perhaps a similar MOU is in operation on the Delhi GOHR bull and that San Diego WAP remains its legal owner (as it probably is over both San Diego WAP borne individuals out there).
Thanks for your comments, it has been enlightening. I seem to remember the story of the escape of patas monkeys from a private facility that was alligned to the Lowry Park Zoo. I thought the facility was designed to overcome the present inability for LP Zoo to acquire land for its envisaged countryside zoo breeding facility. Thus the CEO of the Board stepped in to provide land for them in the interval. Sure, one can argue about the desirability and probable conflict of interests here, but I suppose the benefits outweigh its disadvantages.
Regarding the Delhi bull loan out to Peace River, I am shocked. I was under the impression that these imports would benefit the SSP. It now seems that Peace River is less than forthcoming and gone out of the AZA organisation.
Yet looking at what happened to loaned out eastern black rhino at Peace River. These have all been returned to their original owners following Peace River's failure to provide adequate accomodation and care. Perhaps a similar MOU is in operation on the Delhi GOHR bull and that San Diego WAP remains its legal owner (as it probably is over both San Diego WAP borne individuals out there).
The Patna male living at The Wilds is "Rustum", on loan from San Diego.
"Bhopu" (from Patna) and "Bhramputra" (from Delhi) are still listed on ISIS as being at the SD WAP.
Although it appears that SD WAP is the owner of all three, it is possible that they were used only as a quarantine station (if Peace River is the official owner). San Diego also has a long history of moving animals outside of AZA institutions.
FYI the females that went to India are "Gari" and "Lali" (to Patna) and "Goyona" (to Delhi).
"Bhopu" (from Patna) and "Bhramputra" (from Delhi) are still listed on ISIS as being at the SD WAP.
Although it appears that SD WAP is the owner of all three, it is possible that they were used only as a quarantine station (if Peace River is the official owner). San Diego also has a long history of moving animals outside of AZA institutions.
FYI the females that went to India are "Gari" and "Lali" (to Patna) and "Goyona" (to Delhi).
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
I am looking forward to a future Rhino calf
Safari Park
Well-Known Member
Safari Wild is not an AZA at all, but it is accreditated by the ZAOA. Safari Wild is associated with the Lowry Park Zoo, only because Lowry Park's director Lex Salisbury is the co-owner of the safaripark.
And, no you dont have to be part of the AZA to participate in SSP programs, but that is what Peace River wanted to do was leave behind the politics associated with SSP species. Anyway, after their male okapi died, many zoos were quick to get some of their animals out of their on loan.
And, no you dont have to be part of the AZA to participate in SSP programs, but that is what Peace River wanted to do was leave behind the politics associated with SSP species. Anyway, after their male okapi died, many zoos were quick to get some of their animals out of their on loan.
Safari Park
Well-Known Member
What happened to the male okapi? I knew they weren't in the best conditions but never heard the whole story.
Newest addition to the SDWAP herd.
http://www.imperialvalleynews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2547&Itemid=1
http://www.imperialvalleynews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2547&Itemid=1
Zoogoer2000
Well-Known Member
On the list,the male that sired the Bronx calf with Ellah is actually Patrick and Indira's secong and only male calf born in 1995 at Toronto Zoo.
dragon(ele)nerd
Well-Known Member
I like the calf's name short and sweet Kaya,