I think(without looking it up) that it was Beauval too. Also Chester had Anak from ZSL on a breeding loan and I think he remained at Chester until his death.
I always thought that London tried to keep too many orangs - there were 12 in 1975! The ape block in the Sobells was probably only adequate for a trio of adults at most (it held potential breeding groups of gorillas and chimps too of course): the outdoor enclosure, shown in this photo, was a decent height but there was no real incentive for the orangs to climb. The other orangs were housed in the Round House, which was then known as the Great Apes Breeding Colony: which would have been adequate for a few youngsters at best.
The breeding record was not bad, but neither exhibit suited the animals or showed them well for the public.
I agree that if Jonny and Koko had not escaped at Whipsnade and Jonny had to be shot, that they would probably never have integrated them as a pair, together with the others. I don't know whether they had even tried.
They did-on several occasions. However, Jonny was the problem. Although not very physically imposing, he had a reputation as a troublemaker, being passed between numerous collections before ending up at London.
I remember watching him on numerous occasions-he knew exactly how to wind up Nicky (the dominant male).
That all stemmed from the presentation,(I think it was by the Hong Kong Government of smuggled animals?) of a large number of Bornean youngsters in a single batch in the mid/late 1960's; Boy, Twiggy, Bunty, Blossom, Dodo(Ron) Saleh, Kate, Napolean & Josephine, plus the Zoo already had the young mixed pair of Bulu(B) & Gambar(S). All of them except Napolean & Josephine who were later sent to Vienna, and Gambar who went to Jersey, were retained when the Sobells were built. A couple of them (Bunty and Boy) died fairly early on, but that still left them six (2.4) animals whereas as you say, the Orangutan section was really only big enough for a trio. One male (Saleh) was later moved to the Lubetkin house with a female as the Sobells couldn't house two adult males. Really they shouldn't have accepted the gift of so many in the first place.
They did-on several occasions. However, Jonny was the problem....
I remember watching him on numerous occasions-he knew exactly how to wind up Nicky (the dominant male).
I think the Orangs undoing (implied in "The Ark") is that public opinion deemed they didn't make a good exhibit-always looking "sad" and "fed up" (IMO a load of bull). The chimps had the advantage due to their entertainment factor (the Tea Parties) and the gorillas were box office (Guy et al).
I think the Orangs undoing (implied in "The Ark") is that public opinion deemed they didn't make a good exhibit-always looking "sad" and "fed up" (IMO a load of bull).
Indeed a load of bull. But added to that they were deemed 'labour intensive' by the staff(also mentioned in the Ark) probably because there were so many, and not a single group. So the odds were stacked against them on two fronts.
Panthera- do you happen to know how the two Chimps escaped at Whipsnade? It was never revealed afaik. Was it 'human error' perhaps that they down played?
And the Indian rhino accident a few months back. No more details released of exactly what happened?
Panthera- do you happen to know how the two Chimps escaped at Whipsnade? It was never revealed afaik. Was it 'human error' perhaps that they down played?
And the Indian rhino accident a few months back. No more details released of exactly what happened?
Knowing very little (others may know more) there was an element of Keeper error I believe. Certainly some faces I recognised were not there the next time I visited. I think Jonny had managed to get to the bottom of Bison Hill before he was shot!
RE.the rhino accident. I know nothing, and we may never know the full story. However, no news is good news!
Credit where it's due with ZSL: their Press Office is very good at managing these stories, nipping them in the bud pretty quickly.
I think he had left the Zoo grounds, hence he had to be shot. Reminds me rather of Tarzan's 'father' in the Tarzan film...Somewhere I read that they had 'dug' their way out, but as Chimps don't normally dig I found that a bit unlikely.
At the time of the Rhino incident I had a feeling it would not be made public what the circumstances were, but I would still be interested to know. Asian rhino are normally very placid as captive subjects.
