Twycross Zoo New possible Silverbacks

Mike11

Well-Known Member
Where could possible Silverbacks for Twycross come from what about Howletts and Port Lympne? They must have a possible Silverback although they may not hand them on loan. What about Paignton i think they have a few young silverbacks? What ever happens twycross need to sort it quickly to keep the gorillas going. Also A new male for the group at London needs to be found.
Any ideas?
Any opinions would be great
Thanks
 
Where could possible Silverbacks for Twycross come from what about Howletts and Port Lympne? They must have a possible Silverback although they may not hand them on loan. What about Paignton i think they have a few young silverbacks? What ever happens twycross need to sort it quickly to keep the gorillas going. Also A new male for the group at London needs to be found.

1. Decisions like this are normally made by the EEP- i.e. Twycross will probably(speculation, not fact) have approached the EEP studbook keepers(Apenheul) requesting a new male be selected for them. There are plenty available.

2. Twycross gorilla management has been dysfunctional over a long period with very little breeding. They have kept one group without a male for nearly two years now. My guess is with all their adult silverbacks now dead, they may want to form possibly one new group, under a single new male and before the next summer season starts.

3. Port Lympne males are mostly from very well represented genetic lines, but setting that aside, there are 10 adult and subadult males there to choose from (plus two 9 year olds) Port Lympne would probably accomodate them as they have loaned males to other zoos before.

4. The only suitable male at Paignton(discounting Pertinax who is their male group 'teacher') is Kumbuka(10)and he is related to the potential breeding females at Twycross. Another UK option would be 'Kesho' from Dublin who is unrelated to any Twycross animal.

5. London- will want to have a new male on display as soon as possible, apart from the welfare of the leaderless females. Presumably an application to the EEP for another one is already in process. Its possible, but perhaps less likely than Twycross, that a new male would go there from Port Lympne.
 
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Thanks for the info and opinions could more females may be brought into London Zoo's Gorilla kingdom? How big is it could it accomadate a 'Howletts' Size group?
Do you think Twycross will make their group smaller to make one big group just for breeding? and will it be possible with all the Individual characters?
Thanks
 
Thanks for the info and opinions could more females may be brought into London Zoo's Gorilla kingdom? How big is it could it accomadate a 'Howletts' Size group?

From what has been discussed here on the forums, London only plan to house a few females + offspring and a Breeding male.

Do you think Twycross will make their group smaller to make one big group just for breeding? and will it be possible with all the Individual characters?
Thanks

Who knows, twycross have made some weird decisions for a few years now. I happen to agree with Pertinax in his options of the situation.

I do believe that there best option is to combine the two current groups and bring in a new breeding male. with the other house used for pontential a batchelor group.
 
Thanks i think that would be the best desision for it does anybody know anyting about Bobby at London Zoo leaving any of the females pregant?
 
Thanks i think that would be the best desision for it does anybody know anyting about Bobby at London Zoo leaving any of the females pregant?

It was talked about on here that he had a low sperm count (which apparently is common in captive gorillas). Thus it is believed that none of the gorillas at london are pregnant.
 
Thanks yes ive been hearing about that with Boulas at Belfast,Jitu at Blackpool,Ya Kwansa at Jersy and Bobby.Shame its quite common, Gorillas could of been doing alot better in the UK if this wasnt the case.Also ive been hearing from ZSL that Zaire is too old to have any Offspring but being only 31 or so surely she could be perfectly able to have 2 or 3 at least?
Thanks for any Info
 
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lI've been hearing from ZSL that Zaire is too old to have any Offspring but being only 31 or so surely she could be perfectly able to have 2 or 3 at least?

Its rubbish for them to say Zaire is too old to breed now and I don't understand why they put that out, probably just an excuse if she fails to breed anymore. Females will sometimes breed into their forties.. As you pointed out, Salome at Bristol had a baby recently aand she's only one year younger than Zaire. Zaire's problem is she hasn't bred for a very long time due to unsuitable males- but with a good breeding male it might be possible for her to breed again.

Don't expect to see more additional females arriving- I think the group will stay at 4 (when a new male arrives) until they start breeding. All three females could (potentially) be breeding if the new male is a good breeder though.:)

Twycross- the logical thing is for them to now form a single group with the four remaing females and a new male. But I have no idea yet if this is what they are planning.
 
Since the sad death of Molly Badham things havent gone to plan at Twycross but good luck with their new developments which should help
Yes ,you are right Zaire could have quite a few offspring by now if she had the appropriate males. How many gorillas do you think Gorilla Kingdom could hold approprately? unfortunately i havent been able to see it yet.
 
Yes ,you are right Zaire could have quite a few offspring by now if she had the appropriate males. How many gorillas do you think Gorilla Kingdom could hold approprately? unfortunately i havent been able to see it yet.

1. Under good conditions the average for a female Gorilla to rear successfully in her lifetime is about 5-7 babies if all goes well. Juju at Howletts bred into her early forties, producing and successfully rearing a baby about every three years. Zaire could have done similarly with a good breeding male. Of course the long interval since her only birth could produce fertility/ovulation problems for her,as it did for Salome, but that's not the same as being 'too old' to breed. Possibly ZSL think its unlikely she'll concieve again after all this time though.

2. I estimate Gorilla Kingdom could hold about eight animals- maybe five adults plus younger animals. The outdoor is large but the 'dayroom' enclosure is only big enough for say, five adults wheras the Port Lympne/Howletts groups have large indoor areas too.
 
Thanks for the info i am reading the best of friends by John Aspinall so i have read quite abit on Juju and the breeding that went on in the early days.
London - Thats good space wise they just need to get the Gorilla group up again and it will hopefully be succesful.
Thanks
 
Do you know the Gorilla individuals of The Twycross group well? would they be easy to make into one big group? or will there be problems with certain individuals making it harder to put the groups together?

What are the Enclosures for Gorillas like at twycross? I have heard good things and bad things my last visit was in 2004/5 and the new house was being built cant remember much though.
Regards
 
Thanks for the info i am reading the best of friends by John Aspinall so i have read quite abit on Juju and the breeding that went on in the early days.
London - Thats good space wise they just need to get the Gorilla group up again and it will hopefully be succesful.

Juju was the very first Gorilla to have a baby at Howletts. That baby, Kijo is now a mature silverback with his own group. Juju and the other two females Mouila and Baby Doll have now been retired from breeding but Juju's last son Bitanu still lives with them- he's 5 years old now.

London will have a better chance of breeding with a new male than with Bobby who had a bad background- he was very small(stunted) for a silverback.
 
Thanks for the info on the gorillas very interesting.I have heard about Bobby being a rather small silverback and i do hope one arrives soon so the troop can not get that upset by it.
Out of all The enclsoures in the uk which ones do you think are best for gorillas?. I would think it would be Port Lympnes Palace of the Apes giving equal amount of space with a roof and no roof and providing plenty of vegitation outside.
Thanks for any ideas
 
Do you know the Gorilla individuals of The Twycross group well? would they be easy to make into one big group? or will there be problems with certain individuals making it harder to put the groups together?
Regards

I can't see any problem putting the four females(Bongo, Biddy, Asante and Ozala together- but they'd have to try it to see what happens) Ozala is Biddy's daughter and used to live in Mamfe's group of which there are now only Bongo & Biddy left. The oldest female 'Bongo' is 'butch' and acts rather like a male- she might stand up to a new male but he should be able to dominate her if he's any good. I think its unlikely she will breed though as she never has before.. The others I can't see any problem with and all three could potentially breed as well. Of course Twycross might do something different, who knows?
 
I have heard about Bobby being a rather small silverback and i do hope one arrives soon so the troop can not get that upset by it.
Out of all The enclsoures in the uk which ones do you think are best for gorillas?. I would think it would be Port Lympnes Palace of the Apes giving equal amount of space with a roof and no roof and providing plenty of vegitation outside.

I've seen a great many Silverback Gorillas over the years- Bobby was definately the smallest male I've ever seen.. I saw him at his previous homes at Rome and at Bristol too- his former 'mate' Romina is a large female and she and Bobby were virtually the same size. He spent his early life in a circus in Italy and I think his growth was stunted from a bad diet. Its a pity he didn't breed though as he has no offspring in the population. My guess is they will get a replacement as quickly as possible, both for the well being of the females and also to have a male Gorilla again.

Best Uk Gorilla enclosure- probably Port Lympne Palace of the Apes because of the large covered areas plus an open grassy enclosure as well. Jersey's is good but they need a bigger indoor area now. Bristol- outdoors is nice but indoors too small. Blackpool-wooded island is good, older outdoor area okay, the inside is very old but remarkably roomy. Paignton- inside is good, outdoors is okay but bad for viewing them. Hopefully Chessington will come up with a good design for their new (2010) enclosure.
 
I have to agree with you with Palace of the Apes, one of the most amazing structures ive ever seen in a zoo (except maybe London). I havent been to many Zoos with gorillas. Big cats are my passion and i have only got 'into' gorillas when looking into my hero John Aspinall. Do you know what Belfasts Gorilla Exhbit is like?
Thanks for any info
Regards
 
I have heard that the new Chessington Gorilla Exhibit is going to be an Island Style like Gorilla Kingdom maybe with quite alot of vegitation it could be very good and they might be keeping the original enclosure. What do you think to this idea?
regards
 
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