Taronga Zoo Recent history of Taronga and developments etc

[Zoofan15]

They were all in one community with the interconnecting doors open so they had access to all three cages. There was something like 20 of them, if I remember correctly, so it was a noisy place and sometimes stressful for the chimps as I would periodically see them chasing each other through the cages screaming.

Yes, 20 sounds about right. The founding females Fifi (1947), Susie (1948), Bessie (1950), Biddy (1950), Lulu (1952) and Mary (1956) all had several offspring each but many died or were exported so there was never more than around 20 in the community at any one time. With so many chimpanzee in such a confined space, it must have been chaos. Infant mortality decreased significantly following the move to the open air exhibit in 1980.

 

[steveroberts]

Just did some research. Mangar (M) and Shimbu (F) were siblings born at Melbourne Zoo 29/03/1989. They arrived at Taronga Zoo in February 1990 and left Taronga Zoo in March 1991 to return to Melbourne Zoo. Mangar later went to Mogo Zoo and fathered two litters of cubs in October 1999 (Shiva and Bhutan) and October 2003 (Tenzin and Kumar). Shimbu remained at Melbourne Zoo but never bred with her mate.

Taronga Zoo's first breeding pair were Prafula (M) and Omaha (F). Prafula was born 03/06/1988 at the Chicago Zoo and arrived at Taronga Zoo in September 1990. Omaha was born 27/07/1989 at the Omaha Zoo and arrived at Taronga Zoo September 1990. The pair never bred and retired to Mogo Zoo in September 2003.

Awesome thanks! pity they never bred at Taronga hey

 

[Jabiru96]

Awesome thanks! pity they never bred at Taronga hey

Taronga did manage to breed two cubs in 2005, however: male Sabu and female Kamala (born to female Samara from Mulhouse and male Leon from Nindorf).

 

[Pertinax]

The chimps moved into the new Chimp Park in 1980 so the orangs pretty much had the complex to themselves for over a decade until the new orang facility was built in the early 90's

Now I remember properly- I only saw Orangs in these old cages because the Chimps had already moved to the new enclosure, even on my first visit. In my opinion, Taronga's Chimpanzee exhibit is/was the best I have ever seen and it was the exhibit at Taronga I wanted to see most- I wasn't disappointed*. The contrast with the Orangs still living in the old enclosure was very marked. I revisited some years later when the Orangutans too were in their new area and this old Ape area had been demolished.

*Only superceded by discovering the Zoo had Leopard Seal...

 

[Zoofan15]

Awesome thanks! pity they never bred at Taronga hey

Like Shiva and Selatan, the mysterious Prafula and Omaha were immensely popular with visitors and a huge draw card for Taronga. Sadly the only magic they couldn't do was make cubs. They received a fertility blessing from a group of Buddhist Monks shortly after the exhibit opened, but despite this, never bred. There's a story about in 'Postcards from the Zoo.'

It was later revealed that Omaha was given a higher dose of contraceptive in her early years than what would be recommended today. This caused damage to her ovaries and by the time she was taken off them for breeding, it had rendered her infertile.

As mentioned by Jabiru96, following Prafula and Omaha's retirement to Mogo Zoo, a new pair were imported in 2003. Samara from France and Leon from Germany. This resulted in the first cubs being born in 2005. They also received a fertility blessing from a group of Buddhist Monks.

 

[Zoofan15]

Now I remember properly- I only saw Orangs in these old cages because the Chimps had already moved to the new enclosure, even on my first visit. In my opinion, Taronga's Chimpanzee exhibit is/was the best I have ever seen and it was the exhibit at Taronga I wanted to see most- I wasn't disappointed*. The contrast with the Orangs still living in the old enclosure was very marked. I revisited some years later when the Orangutans too were in their new area and this old Ape area had been demolished.

*Only superceded by discovering the Zoo had Leopard Seal...

It looks like the chimpanzee have an amazing enclosure from what I've seen, and it's impressive it's still in good shape after all these years, and following the 2011 upgrade. Taronga's chimpanzee community have been studied by Jane Goodall and she has praised the exhibit in the past. They essentially function as a wild community. You must have been visiting during the 80s, there would have been lots of babies in the group around then.

 

[Pertinax]

Taronga's chimpanzee community have been studied by Jane Goodall and she has praised the exhibit in the past. They essentially function as a wild community. You must have been visiting during the 80s.

There are plenty of large multi-male chimp groups in Europe nowadays- a sizeable group like Taronga's was probably less common back then but other zoos did exhibit like that even then. What I liked particularly was the huge enclosure sited on the hillside in a way which made viewing them so easy/enjoyable. I couldn't understand why the Gorilla area was not as good- though I am aware it was originally a Giant Panda exhibit- its really too small for the Gorillas.

 

[Zoofan15]

There are plenty of large multi-male chimp groups in Europe nowadays- a sizeable group like Taronga's was probably less common back then but other zoos did exhibit like that even then. What I liked particularly was the huge enclosure sited on the hillside in a way which made viewing them so easy/enjoyable. I couldn't understand why the Gorilla area was not as good- though I am aware it was originally a Giant Panda exhibit- its really too small for the Gorillas.

I hope Hamilton Zoo are able to build up a decent group. They've certainly had a lot of setbacks over the years but it'd be nice to see them hold a large community like Taronga, or Wellington (though I think they're down to 10 now). Both Hamilton and Monarto could benefit from the import of new females.

What's the indoor area like for the Taronga gorillas? I understand they spend most of their time there. Even Johari tolerates the presence of Kibali if it means she can be inside.

Given the size of Taronga's enclosure, I think it's more likely Kipenzi will go to Melbourne Zoo then. She's unlikely to have an association with Frala, and has never even met Johari and Mbeli (despite being her niece) so there's no social advantage to Kipenzi to be at Taronga. That way each zoo can have a silverback and three females each (one non breeding at each zoo).

 

[marmolady]

The indoor area for the Taronga gorillas is very small, and the window is often crowded and noisy with visitors. The gorillas do have access to (again, small) indoor areas away from the public, but in my eyes it is still woefully insufficient. I couldn't see Taronga having enough room for an additional female unless they drastically change the exhibit.

 

[Zoofan15]

The indoor area for the Taronga gorillas is very small, and the window is often crowded and noisy with visitors. The gorillas do have access to (again, small) indoor areas away from the public, but in my eyes it is still woefully insufficient. I couldn't see Taronga having enough room for an additional female unless they drastically change the exhibit.

Fair enough, when Taronga had the three breeding females Mouila, Frala and Kriba, there wasn't much space so you're probably right about not importing a fourth female. If Johari suddenly fell pregnant, that would be four females all with offspring.

In my opinion, Frala and Mouila should be allowed to breed naturally (birth intervals not extended by contraception) so if their subsequent offspring include males, they will be similar in age to Mjuuku and Fabumi are can form a bachelor group down the line.

Mbeli could have her next baby in 2017 and a third in 2019. Frala could have one more baby in 2018. In a worst case scenario (all three infants are male), that would be five young males born between 2014-2019 that could all leave to form a bachelor group at Mogo. By this time, Kibabu would have passed away, Kipenzi would have been exported. and Kriba (if still alive) maybe accompanied her as a non breeding addition to Kipenzi's new troop.

 

[Jabiru96]

Taronga will be renovating the gorilla exhibit (as well as pretty much nearly the entire zoo) as part of the new Development Plan, although it is not clear the timeframe of this redevelopment: | Taronga

The current exhibit is probably at its maximum capacity in terms of numbers of individuals (especially when the youngsters get even larger and more boisterous) so I would be quite happy for breeding to be put on hold for the time being (especially as Johari still doesn't like Kibali!).

 

[Zoofan15]

Taronga will be renovating the gorilla exhibit (as well as pretty much nearly the entire zoo) as part of the new Development Plan, although it is not clear the timeframe of this redevelopment: | Taronga

The current exhibit is probably at its maximum capacity in terms of numbers of individuals (especially when the youngsters get even larger and more boisterous) so I would be quite happy for breeding to be put on hold for the time being (especially as Johari still doesn't like Kibali!).

That sounds good. I'm sure it's due for an upgrade. It probably hasn't changed much since it was built in 1996?

Fully agree on Johari, Pertinax suggested her best hope may be to breed with one of the young males as they grow older since she would trust them interacting an playing with her which could lead to breeding behaviour. That seems like a good idea.

I don't think breeding should be delayed though. Males are hard enough to place at other zoos and if they're not close in age in age to Mjuuku and Fabumi, then introducing them won't be an option unless they've grown up together. When Taronga had all three breeding females, each female always had at least two offspring, and Mouila and Frala even had three offspring each at one stage.

 

[Pertinax]

Fully agree on Johari, Pertinax suggested her best hope may be to breed with one of the young males as they grow older since she would trust them interacting an playing with her which could lead to breeding behaviour. That seems like a good idea.

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Just to add, this has happened a number of times with de-socialised females who are frightened of approaching big silverbacks and therefore won't breed with them. A recent example is Kera at Bristol Zoo in the UK who had a first baby at around 14, having mated with(or allowed mating by) subadult Komale but never with his father. The reverse is possible too- male Ya Kwanza from Melbourne only bred with one female at Jersey, - the youngest one who was his main playmate/friend in the group.

Re the enclosure size- I think there were nine(?) Gorillas living in it when I first went- the original import from Apenheul was around this number. I think a miximum of one male/three females+ young dependants is the maximum it can hold without overcrowding. Enlarging the whole enclosure indoors and out would be great.

 

[Zoofan15]

Just to add, this has happened a number of times with de-socialised females who are frightened of approaching big silverbacks and therefore won't breed with them. A recent example is Kera at Bristol Zoo in the UK who had a first baby at around 14, having mated with(or allowed mating by) subadult Komale but never with his father. The reverse is possible too- male Ya Kwanza from Melbourne only bred with one female at Jersey, - the youngest one who was his main playmate/friend in the group.

Re the enclosure size- I think there were nine(?) Gorillas living in it when I first went- the original import from Apenheul was around this number. I think a miximum of one male/three females+ young dependants is the maximum it can hold without overcrowding. Enlarging the whole enclosure indoors and out would be great.

Fingers crossed this will happen for Johari then. I believe she's quite curious about the infants, and would probably make a good mother.

The original import was 10 gorillas: Kibabu (M77), Mouila (F72), Kriba (F79), Frala (F81), Shinda (F91), Haoko (M93). Kijivu (F93), Anguka (F94), Shabani (M96) and Safiri (F96) in December 1996. So each female arrived with two dependent offspring, all aged between six months and five years. The troop then grew to 11 gorillas in 1998 when Frala gave birth, but the infant died within a month.

I think if Frala is bred once more, and Mbeli is bred twice more by 2019, the enclosure would be adequate as this would still less than the size of the original import. The five young gorillas could grow up together and then Mjuuku and Fabumi could leave to form a bachelor group around 2022/2023, with any remaining males joining them when they are aged 6-7 years. Note: The purpose of Mjuuku/Fabumi staying 8-9 years not 6-7 would be to maximise the bonding time they would have with younger male sibilings who would then be reintroduced to them upon their later export (as was done with Mahali).

 

[steveroberts]

Does anyone know about Helen, Leslie, Roy and Rufus the old Orangutans??

 

[steveroberts]

Looking at this photo, there appears to be about 7 separate cages. The chimps had the run of at least three of them.

Do you know when this was built?

 

[Zoofan15]

Does anyone know about Helen, Leslie, Roy and Rufus the old Orangutans??

Rufus (born 1940 approx) and Roy (born 1958 approx) were wild born male Bornean orangutans. Rufus arrived at Taronga Zoo 17 June 1949 and died 16 September 1974. Roy arrived at Taronga Zoo 30 August 1963 and died 28 December 1983.

Helen (born 1949 approx) and Leslie (born 1951 approx) were wild born female Sumatran orangutans that arrived at Taronga Zoo 7 January 1956. Helen died 3 September 1970 and Leslie died 27 February 1977.

 

[steveroberts]

Wow thanks thats really interesting are there other founder Orangs from the same eras?

 

[Zoofan15]

Wow thanks thats really interesting are there other founder Orangs from the same eras?

There were many others imported, but they didn't contribute greatly to the regional population in the long term. Many died young without producing offspring, or produced one or two non surviving offspring.

Helen was the mother of Judy II (1957-2007) and Wendy (1961-2001), both who had many offspring including Jantan (1987) and Willow (1985).

 

[Pertinax]

There were many others imported, but they didn't contribute greatly to the regional population in the long term. Many died young without producing offspring, or produced one or two non surviving offspring.

Helen was the mother of Judy II (1957-2007) and Wendy (1961-2001), both who had many offspring including Jantan (1987) and Willow (1985).

As you pointed out before, it really was a matter of chance whether those early pairs were comprised of single or mixed species, thus producing pure or hybrid lines.