Have just returned from visit to Whipsnade on a cold, wintery morning. As Fellows of ZSL living close to the zoo, we are regular visitors and enjoy walks around the zoo at least once a week. Today we discovered that the Wild Bite Cafe is shut until February, as it is being transformed into the "Base Camp Restaurant" and that the Look Out Cafe (which has been undergoing transformation) has finally been reopened in its new guise as the "River Cottage Deli and Kitchen". In fact the whole "catering offer" at the zoo is undergoing change, supposedly to reflect so-called modern trends in catering and to replace the "out-dated cafeteria" concept. No real problem with change, but always it seems to come with a cost implication. Looking at the menu at the River Cottage Kitchen, the minimum spend for a typical two adult, two children family would be about £40 this for just a kid's menu main course and adult main course, with no drinks or vegetable add-ons. Add the latter plus appetisers and/or desserts and you are looking at upwards of a £60-£80 spend. True, it is waitress service, but do families, who could have already shelled out upwards of £80-£100 (seasonally dependent) to get into the zoo, want to spend their time with restaurant style service at high street prices. The price appears to be justified under the banner of "organically produced, ethically sustainable, local produce". The River Cottage brand is that of Hugh Fearnley Withingshall and, to my mind, is best left to the high streets of suburbia and not mass catering at zoos. It will be interesting to see how the paying public take to the concept in 2018.
ZSL Whipsnade Zoo Goodbye Cafes, Hello Restaurants at Whipsnade
- Thread starter Mrhinuk
- Start date
SealPup
Well-Known Member
Kind of ironic, because the message/appeal of River Cottage is growing your own, to keep costs down, if you can. Though based on location, one imagines Whipsnade to be less proletarian than average Londoners, going to their local zoo. They probably will be fine with the prices & branding.
Since when have cafeterias been outdated? People want to eat, so they see food and buy it, or there would be no god awful burger vans. Even the decline of cafes in Britain has nothing to do with people's eating preferences: its that the overheads became too expensive so only chains like MaccyDs survived. How does this mean cafes at tourist attractions are outdated?
Since when have cafeterias been outdated? People want to eat, so they see food and buy it, or there would be no god awful burger vans. Even the decline of cafes in Britain has nothing to do with people's eating preferences: its that the overheads became too expensive so only chains like MaccyDs survived. How does this mean cafes at tourist attractions are outdated?
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I'm not sure how this will go down at Whipsnade. A great majority of local visitors will be coming from the nearby urban centres of Luton and Dunstable, which from experience growing up there, is not a wealthy area. Far from it. Yes, some money is increasingly coming out of London as the commuter belt widens, but not enough to cover the costs of a meal at the new restaurant. When we went as children our family always took a packed lunch as the price of the zoo-food was out of our reach even then (1990s).
Whipsnade always proudly announced on their menu boards that the produce came from local farmers in Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire. I really hope they continue to source their ingredients locally in this way.
Maybe waitress service will appeal to some, but most visitors will surely be after something quick and easy and affordable, a quick sit-down to rest and feed the children, before heading off on the next leg of the visit. Didn't Bristol recently open a restaurant along similar lines? Does anyone know how that is faring?
Whipsnade always proudly announced on their menu boards that the produce came from local farmers in Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire. I really hope they continue to source their ingredients locally in this way.
Maybe waitress service will appeal to some, but most visitors will surely be after something quick and easy and affordable, a quick sit-down to rest and feed the children, before heading off on the next leg of the visit. Didn't Bristol recently open a restaurant along similar lines? Does anyone know how that is faring?
I visit Whipsnade fairly regularly ( between 6-10 times a year) and rarely used either of the cafes for food, because they were too expensive, particularly for families, as has been mentioned.
When I have eaten in them, the food has usually been reasonably edible, but if the price of fish & chips has increased from the previously overpriced £9 in the new restaurants, they can forget it!
I'm not quite sure who they think requires waitress service or wants to pay several £s more per head for it?!
When I have eaten in them, the food has usually been reasonably edible, but if the price of fish & chips has increased from the previously overpriced £9 in the new restaurants, they can forget it!
I'm not quite sure who they think requires waitress service or wants to pay several £s more per head for it?!
Worth reading this announement regarding ZSL Whipsnade's partnership with Levy Restaurants UK. Full of management-speak.
https://www.compass-group.co.uk/med...xciting-partnership-with-levy-restaurants-uk/
It seems that ZSL Managemen's approach is based A policy of providing their clientele with what Management consider is best for them, rather than giving them what they would much prefer. The majority of zoo visitors just want a selection of good food at reasonable prices, in a clean and hygenic environment, with minimal waiting time. Is that not how cafeterias came into being in the first place.
Levy Restaurants UK are behind similar developments at Bristol, Twycross and Edinburgh zoos. Any member experience of how these have gone down with visitors?
https://www.compass-group.co.uk/med...xciting-partnership-with-levy-restaurants-uk/
It seems that ZSL Managemen's approach is based A policy of providing their clientele with what Management consider is best for them, rather than giving them what they would much prefer. The majority of zoo visitors just want a selection of good food at reasonable prices, in a clean and hygenic environment, with minimal waiting time. Is that not how cafeterias came into being in the first place.
Levy Restaurants UK are behind similar developments at Bristol, Twycross and Edinburgh zoos. Any member experience of how these have gone down with visitors?
SealPup
Well-Known Member
Well povs always prefer packed lunches, we always did. It was that or kiosk chips, then if we did, we would complain about the price. TBH I wondered as a kid, how much money zoos and theme parks actually lost by trying to milk the visitor numbers for basic catering: there are reasons why many of us take packed lunch. Its cheaper and it has guarenteed quality, since you know what goes in it.
Although ppl talk often about zoo memories, no one recalls delicious zoo food. Please share yr delicious memories.
Although ppl talk often about zoo memories, no one recalls delicious zoo food. Please share yr delicious memories.
I have no knowledge of this specific development and in fact have never visited Whipsnade. However I have visited roughly a dozen zoos in western Europe (majority in England) and nearly a hundred in USA. Based on this limited sample it seems food service in European zoos is far superior to American zoos (a pet peeve of mine).
sooty mangabey
Well-Known Member
I disagree with the general feeling here, and welcome the changes at Whipsnade, as described above.
For a start, anyone who doesn’t want, or cannot afford, zoo food is very able to bring in a picnic - when money was tighter, and when my children were younger, this was certainly something I would always do.
If table service is efficient, and quick, then it should lead to a wholly better experience. At London, for example, if you want different sorts of food, you need to queue in different areas, juggle trays of whatever, queue again to pay, and then, with rapidly-cooling grub, start the hunt for a table. Far better to sit, order, then be served.
I’ve recently experienced such service in two animal-seeing contexts: at Bristol Zoo and at London’s Natural History Museum. In both cases, service was good, the overall time taken to eat was probably only very slightly extended, the cost was fine (not cheap, but what do you expect in such a context?), the food was wholly decent, and the experience was a great deal more pleasant than in the very functional traditional school canteen style of zoo eatery.
I still sometimes wake up in the middle of the night, recalling a vegetarian pasty purchased at Banham Zoo’s cafeteria, at some stage in the last century. Desiccated, lukewarm and smelling of cheap cleaning products, it was one of the two worst food items I have ever purchased (the other was a vege-burger at Coventry City FC’s old stadium, Highfield Road, but that’s another story).
For a start, anyone who doesn’t want, or cannot afford, zoo food is very able to bring in a picnic - when money was tighter, and when my children were younger, this was certainly something I would always do.
If table service is efficient, and quick, then it should lead to a wholly better experience. At London, for example, if you want different sorts of food, you need to queue in different areas, juggle trays of whatever, queue again to pay, and then, with rapidly-cooling grub, start the hunt for a table. Far better to sit, order, then be served.
I’ve recently experienced such service in two animal-seeing contexts: at Bristol Zoo and at London’s Natural History Museum. In both cases, service was good, the overall time taken to eat was probably only very slightly extended, the cost was fine (not cheap, but what do you expect in such a context?), the food was wholly decent, and the experience was a great deal more pleasant than in the very functional traditional school canteen style of zoo eatery.
I still sometimes wake up in the middle of the night, recalling a vegetarian pasty purchased at Banham Zoo’s cafeteria, at some stage in the last century. Desiccated, lukewarm and smelling of cheap cleaning products, it was one of the two worst food items I have ever purchased (the other was a vege-burger at Coventry City FC’s old stadium, Highfield Road, but that’s another story).
sooty mangabey
Well-Known Member
...that said, whoever wrote this piece of PR bilge, from the link above, needs to be force fed Banham Zoo pasties, 1997 version, until they say they’re very, very sorry:
“Alongside the amazing animals and exhibits to be explored at the Zoo, we are sure visitors will go wild for the launch of an award-winning eatery in River Cottage”.
“Alongside the amazing animals and exhibits to be explored at the Zoo, we are sure visitors will go wild for the launch of an award-winning eatery in River Cottage”.
I think that this is another sign of zoo commercial departments looking up-market, following on from the glamping lodges and expensive 'experience' days. On the other hand there is nothing wrong with giving customers better choices, as long as more basic options are still available. I will continue to take packed lunches, which I try to eat while watching whichever species I particularly want to photograph and I'm always ready to pack them away promptly if a subject poses nicely.
It may also encourage more middle-aged people, probably without children (through never having any or them having left the roost), to visit -these are often people with good levels of disposable income.
I'm sure some must be currently be put off by more "mass market" catering (and possible the screaming kids/families that tend that flock to it) and may be attracted by "better" food in a more peaceful setting. Hey, it may even become the hip thing to do, "why go to meet friends at a restaurant when you could meet them at a restaurant in a zoo*?" -marketeers can have that line for free.
Whilst I'm happy to see eateries like this in zoos I wouldn't want them to be the only type though- many taste should be served to ensure it encourages all types of peoplento come to the zoo**.
*Perfect for those meet-ups of people who work together accompanied by spouses who've never met before and feel a bit awkward -there's always going to be something in the zoo to talk about to fill any potential awkward silences (they could use Hugh Grant in the advert).
**And let's face it -most of us like some "cheap" and nasty junk food once in a while
I'm sure some must be currently be put off by more "mass market" catering (and possible the screaming kids/families that tend that flock to it) and may be attracted by "better" food in a more peaceful setting. Hey, it may even become the hip thing to do, "why go to meet friends at a restaurant when you could meet them at a restaurant in a zoo*?" -marketeers can have that line for free.
Whilst I'm happy to see eateries like this in zoos I wouldn't want them to be the only type though- many taste should be served to ensure it encourages all types of peoplento come to the zoo**.
*Perfect for those meet-ups of people who work together accompanied by spouses who've never met before and feel a bit awkward -there's always going to be something in the zoo to talk about to fill any potential awkward silences (they could use Hugh Grant in the advert).
**And let's face it -most of us like some "cheap" and nasty junk food once in a while
The thing is - I am happy to buy zoo food, but what I consider 'zoo food' is not what is generally served in the table service places I've seen the menus for (e.g. Twycross / bristol / Whipsnade). What I want on a cold day at Whipsnade is to head on over to the Wild Bite Cafe and get myself a lovely bowl of hot soup with bread and croutons and a chaser of coffee & cake for a vaguely reasonable price. I definitely don't want Scottish venison ragu, macaroni, Quickes mature cheddar and a side of roast savoy cabbage with quince and thyme for £16.50. Or a brownie and coffee for £7.50. Whatever way you look at it, £24 is a lot for lunch at the zoo when you would have been happy with a sandwich / soup / baked potato type offering.
We actually walked out of Bristol's new table service place having ordered nothing as the service was so poor.
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I agree with this - I'm sure some people would love the table service element but I think having it as the only option shows that you need a captive audience for it to work. Given the choice, I am certain most people would chose the more traditional cafe option.
littleRedPanda
Well-Known Member
Table service is something that I can live without in general and certainly don't need it at a zoo.
SealPup
Well-Known Member
Some people think it is restaurants vs low quality food. Why not improve the budget food, even a stall so people can add to a packed lunch on site w things like fresh cheese, freshly squeezed fruit juice and the like.
Maybe its the same with glamping, if you can glamp near the animals, there must be even more interest in letting folks pitch their own tents or motorhomes.
Maybe its the same with glamping, if you can glamp near the animals, there must be even more interest in letting folks pitch their own tents or motorhomes.
My head is still trying to get round an "award-winning eatery" that hasn't yet been opened.
sooty mangabey
Well-Known Member
...the current Bristol menu offers just that - and at £4, at a “vaguely reasonable price”. http://www.bristolzoo.org.uk/files/download/5cfb8e038d59d07
I think there were, inevitably, teething problems when the restaurant first opened. On a recent visit, on a fairly busy Saturday, the service was cheerful, and swift. And, to be fair, on busy days I’ve sometimes stood in line waiting to be served for a long, long time.....