Giant Pandas in Europe

Fallax

Fallax

Well-Known Member
5+ year member
Last year saw Berlin and Rhenen aquire pandas and the birth at Beauval. 2016 also had the Belgian cubs which is quite recent. There appears to be a bit of a panda mania right now in Europe. I was wondering if more zoos in Europe are planning on aquiring pandas despite the huge cost, does anyone have any information to share?
 
Copenhagen started to build a house for pandas in November, and they are supposed to come in 2018 or 2019.
 
What's the scorecard now? Madrid, Beauval, Pairi Daiza, Rhenen, Edinburgh, Berlin and Vienna, with Copenhagen to come? I can imagine a couple more: Lisbon struck me as the sort of ABC collection that might see pandas as an ultimate goal. Attica Zoo is a private for-profit, a category that also applies to four of the seven zoos that already have pandas, so I could see it there too. And it has a sense of ambition that it shares with Beauval and Pairi Daiza, certainly, albeit Madrid seems content to quietly atrophy into nothingness.

Also, remembering that panda diplomacy is still very much a thing it wouldn't surprise me to see them return to Moscow Zoo or even Budapest, whose authoritarian governments are cuddling up to China. And what's more Chinese and cuddly than a giant panda?
 
CGSwans said:
What's the scorecard now? Madrid, Beauval, Pairi Daiza, Rhenen, Edinburgh, Berlin and Vienna, with Copenhagen to come? I can imagine a couple more: Lisbon struck me as the sort of ABC collection that might see pandas as an ultimate goal.
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The other "big name" which plans to receive Giant Panda in the next few years is Prague; they also have intentions to go into Golden Snub-nosed Langur at the same time.
 
beccasunbear said:
Hahaha! I too fail to see the fascination.
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It's not so much a failure to see the fascination, and more a feeling that the cost of obtaining and continuing to keep the species has ruined Edinburgh Zoo :( it used to be my second-favourite UK collection, behind only Chester, but has declined dramatically and would now only *just* scrape into the top twenty.
 
TeaLovingDave said:
It's not so much a failure to see the fascination, and more a feeling that the cost of obtaining and continuing to keep the species has ruined Edinburgh Zoo :( it used to be my second-favourite UK collection, behind only Chester, but has declined dramatically and would now only *just* scrape into the top twenty.
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But the fact that, and this is an interesting titbit so thanks to CGSwans, four of the seven holders are for-profits suggests that they at least believe they will come out in the black. Possibly Edinburgh is the exception rather than the rule here?
 
I agree with this too. In fact, it was one of the reasons why I stopped volunteering at Edinburgh.

There really does seem to be some level of fascination in order to make these costs worth it - obviously there must just be something about a panda that brings the visitors through the doors in order to be able to maintain the expense.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
But the fact that, and this is an interesting titbit so thanks to CGSwans, four of the seven holders are for-profits suggests that they at least believe they will come out in the black. Possibly Edinburgh is the exception rather than the rule here?
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It caused significant financial distress to Adelaide too. I suspect they are at least as much a vanity project as a genuine profit driver. Giant pandas buy distinction for a zoo.
 
Don't forget the giant pandas for Finland's Ahtari Zoo, which were meant to have arrived by now, unless I've missed news of their arrival.
 
devilfish said:
Don't forget the giant pandas for Finland's Ahtari Zoo, which were meant to have arrived by now, unless I've missed news of their arrival.
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Good grief. I had to look this place up as I'd never heard of it. What on earth is a small municipal zoo in a town of 6,000 people near the Arctic Circle doing getting pandas?
 
It’s crazy really, because the zoos that I would consider to be the most distinguished, iconic and incredible don’t have pandas. For example, Chester and Burgers are for me two of the highest quality zoos I’ve ever visited. I can’t imagine that pandas would prove to be a significant improvement for either.
 
CGSwans said:
Good grief. I had to look this place up as I'd never heard of it. What on earth is a small municipal zoo in a town of 6,000 people near the Arctic Circle doing getting pandas?
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It seems they are a genuine gift from the PRC to Finland, on account of Finland's early recognition of the new state and subsequent support for its UN membership.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
It seems they are a genuine gift from the PRC to Finland, on account of Finland's early recognition of the new state and subsequent support for its UN membership.
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Which is nice, sure, but they really need to put them in Helsinki. They will be nothing but a millstone around Ahtari's neck. This article, starring a rather insightful local pensioner, makes that clear:

China is giving Finland two pandas for its 100th birthday - but one pensioner is jeopardising it
 
CGSwans said:
Which is nice, sure, but they really need to put them in Helsinki. They will be nothing but a millstone around Ahtari's neck. This article, starring a rather insightful local pensioner, makes that clear:

China is giving Finland two pandas for its 100th birthday - but one pensioner is jeopardising it
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The point about Ahtari being overwhelmed by by visitors it isn't equipped for is a fair one. But, dare I say it,not the worse thing that could happen to a small zoo?
The article quotes eight hundred thousand euros as the (annual?) upkeep of a panda; is this legitimate? It sounds too similar to one million dollars; ie the rent of a panda.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
The point about Ahtari being overwhelmed by by visitors it isn't equipped for is a fair one. But, dare I say it,not the worse thing that could happen to a small zoo?
The article quotes eight hundred thousand euros as the (annual?) upkeep of a panda; is this legitimate? It sounds too similar to one million dollars; ie the rent of a panda.
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That's probably what it refers to. Giant pandas are an expensive gift to receive.

The impact on visitation in such a remote location is likely to be the worst of both worlds. Too many people for the town to manage, but not enough to justify the costs incurred. Looking at the map it's not even on the way from anywhere to anywhere else. To put this in an Australian context it's a rough equivalent to parking giant pandas at Altina Wildlife Park. It doesn't make any sense.
 
CGSwans said:
That's probably what it refers to. Giant pandas are an expensive gift to receive.

The impact on visitation in such a remote location is likely to be the worst of both worlds. Too many people for the town to manage, but not enough to justify the costs incurred. Looking at the map it's not even on the way from anywhere to anywhere else. To put this in an Australian context it's a rough equivalent to parking giant pandas at Altina Wildlife Park. It doesn't make any sense.
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If you look the vocabulary of when Denmark made something of a diplomatic push to get pandas, it was stated quite clearly they had been given the right to host the pandas, whereas here the pandas themselves are the gifts. I think it would be quite embarrassing, for China, if Finland turns out to be paying rent on them. But I grant that it's still not something known.



I think part of it is that almost everywhere outside of Helsinki is in the middle of nowhere, but it would have made perhaps more sense to put them in Ranua, which is in Lappland and thus very much a significant part of nowhere.
 
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