I don't remember any reference of Kaa being male (in the Spanish translated version of the book, that is what I know). I always tought it as a female (overall giving the fact that Kipling said that it's enormous or giant).

No, Kaa's male. I believe he's referred to as a he in... "The King's Ankhus" and "Kaa's Hunting".


That's one of the most controversial points of The Jugle Book... in India of course it should be a sloth bear, but, the own Kipling said that it's a brown bear... and I think I prefair fidelity to this tale, than fidelity to biogeology. If we accept that there is a long and precise Jungle Law and all animals speak ones with others, then why don't accept the only species-slip of Kipling?

I need to find the exact passage, but Kipling does describe a sloth bear in the book, but, in The Strange Ride of Rudyard Kipling, the author states that Rudyard's father, Lockwood, is responsible for the original illustrations and the popular idea that Baloo is a brown bear*.


* - It's not so much a species slip for me, because it's not implausible that a Himalayan brown bear was wandering the sub-continent teaching the Law.
 
but Kipling does describe a sloth bear in the book

In the Spanish translated version of the book, in the first introduction of Baloo it said... "The only animal of other species that was allowed to take part in the Council, Baloo, the giant brown bear that... (?)..., the old Baloo, that can come and back where he wants because doesn't eat nothing more than nuts, roots and honey..." (maybe inexact, as I'm quoting just from memory - the book is in my parents house)
 
In the Spanish translated version of the book, in the first introduction of Baloo it said... "The only animal of other species that was allowed to take part in the Council, Baloo, the giant brown bear that... (?)..., the old Baloo, that can come and back where he wants because doesn't eat nothing more than nuts, roots and honey..." (maybe inexact, as I'm quoting just from memory - the book is in my parents house)
That could be a translation issue.
 
I don't remember any reference of Kaa being male (in the Spanish translated version of the book, that is what I know). I always tought it as a female (overall giving the fact that Kipling said that it's enormous or giant).
In the English version he is always depicted as male. Regarding Baloo as a brown bear, in the book he is stated as such. I didn't mind that so much as I did that the wolves were always depicted as a more northern subspecies instead of the Indian variety.
 
Has anyone seen the new trailer:

It got its world premiere in my city (Mumbai) last night. Huge deal over here, since it's our first ever Hollywood world premiere.

I have mixed feelings. On the plus side, I love Serkis and The Jungle Book.

As for negatives - along with all the other animal complaints mentioned here (like that Chil/Rann, or the bizarre faces)... whaaaaaaat is going on with Tabaqui!?

I can understanding switching species from golden jackal to striped hyena, since a lot of the viewing audience might have trouble identifying a jackal from a young wolf.

But did they have to butcher the striped hyena into this miniscule, snivelly thing? Real-life Indian striped hyenas are big, tall and dominate both leopards and wolves in the areas they co-habit. It bothers me that we're going to get ANOTHER piece of animation that makes hyenas out to be the lowliest of carnivora, while grossly oversizing the leopard, sloth bear and Indian wolves.

In fact, with the weird facial expressions, I'd say some of his wolves look more like striped hyenas than Tabaqui does! Lol.
 
It seems like they don't have much hope if they're releasing this on Netflix. The facial expressions are odd, but it might not be a bad movie.
 
However, that bird is identical to a swallow-tailed kite with black nape, or a scissor-tailedkite with longer wings, longer neck, smaller head and black upperparts. Anyway for sure not the brahminy kite that is the species that I always assigned to Rann/Chil.

That is like me saying that bird is identical to a Bald Eagle because of the white on the head, the black back, and long black wings. I can point out those similarities, but it doesn't make that bird anymore of an eagle as it does a Scissor-Tailed Kite.

As for the movie itself, I was extremely excited for this for the longest time but now I've lost pretty much all excitement for it. The majority of the animals look horrible to me and it sucks me right out of the movie, and the trailers in general make the movie look unintentionally goofy imo. The fact that it lost its theatrical release and was shipped to Netflix ala The Cloverfield Paradox shows that the studio has little faith in the project as well.

~Thylo
 
As for the movie itself, I was extremely excited for this for the longest time but now I've lost pretty much all excitement for it. The majority of the animals look horrible to me and it sucks me right out of the movie, and the trailers in general make the movie look unintentionally goofy imo. The fact that it lost its theatrical release and was shipped to Netflix ala The Cloverfield Paradox shows that the studio has little faith in the project as well.

Sounds like another "6,000 words of pure anger"* rant in the making! :D
 
Sounds like another "6,000 words of pure anger"* rant in the making! :D

Probably not, unless the movie is just that terrible... but I doubt it will be. I have my doubts on how good it will be, but I am rooting for Andy Serkis and I do hope the only rant-worthy element is how awful the animals look.

~Thylo
 
I've seen it twice now and have mixed feelings.

On the first watch, I really didn't like it. I just couldn't get over how awful the animals look. The mo-cap faces look bad - as most viewers and critics seem to have pointed out. But the animals are also horrifyingly inaccurate and unrealistic beyond just the technology - I'm talking sizes, coat colors, etc. Disney/Favreau's 2016 version took some pains at least to stock the cast with species at least native to India (if not always the Central Highlands), and gave some screen time to less depicted species like pangolins and pygmy hogs. Most look quite good, even if Baloo is still not a believable sloth bear (which I think is unfortunate).

This one does the exact opposite. Has anyone figured out what the antelope is that they prey on? It's definitely not a nilgai, blackbuck, chinkara, etc. Looks like a generic spiral-horned antelope with some inspiration from kudu, nyala and sitatunga. And then there's Tabaqui... a brown hyena, like, what!? Not a golden jackal as in the books, nor even a striped hyena... he's brown as bark, and woefully undersized, and with the single worst face in the movie. He looks more like Stitch or a gremlin. Akela, the head wolf, looks a lot more like a striped hyena, with his tuft and big, sloping back and bizarrely hyaenid face.

Then, there's the other wolves - some of which are weirdly piebald, and others of which are patterned like giraffes. It's all bizarre. I also didn't like that there was green algae-like grass growing on the elephant's back, but I guess that's from Kipling (as is Baloo's brown coloration). Kaa is like a giant version of Master Viper from KungFu Panda with pouting lips. Yes, pouting lips, lol.

Big exception: the monkeys. Andy Serkis can do primates and it showed. There's a lot of orc-like extra-ness to their body movements, but the faces and mannerisms are a great representation of the angry rhesus/bonnet macaques and grey langurs we get here in India.

Anyway, the visuals + some clunky dialogue moments ruined watch #1 for me, even though I did like some of the additions (much of the village/hunter sequence, and an albino wolf character) as well as the performance by Rohan Chand (Mowgli).

On Watch #2, I put aside my issues with the animals and actually really enjoyed the film. I think the best way to watch it is to see it as a highly fantastical and largely faithful adaptation of the book, which was always full of biological oddities. Down to the "British Raj" gymkhana vibes you get from the wolves interacting with each other. Cumberbatch's lame Shere Khan grew on me, as did the new dynamic between Baloo and Bagheera. I feel like a better name for this movie would have been "Rudyard Kipling's Jungle Book", because it's best enjoyed in context of the OG book.

I'm also a huge fan of how he's worked in the theme of otherness. It's almost an elevation of that aspect from the book. Many critics seem to dislike the village sequence, but it was my favorite part of the movie. The climax felt a little rushed but, imo, had the right idea. Act 1 was also good at bringing out the intra-wolf politics, Shere Khan-induced manipulations and tensions around the conservatism of the Laws of the Jungle - all intriguing bits of the book that get lost in adaptations that are forced to be more child-friendly. I thought the conservation / human-wildlife conflict angle ended on a very awkward note ("with the hunter and tiger gone, peace prevailed again" felt like a strange message after Akela noted that human encroachment had been taking its toll on the jungle long before the hunter's arrival, unless they're making the somewhat weird insinuation that man was "taking more of the jungle" solely as reprisal for Shere Khan's cattle killing.) But Serkis has always stressed the "otherness" theme as more important... and that he has achieved 100%.

I'll watch it a third time, I'm sure - but I loved Watch #2, which makes me all the angrier that the team seems to have put zero effort into animal research.

EDIT, PS: Is it being marketed heavily in other countries? Netflix has balled out to make as big a splash with this movie as possible here in India. They've made it available not just in Hindi but two regional languages, and got an absolute A-list of Bollywood actors to voice the characters. Billboards everywhere... in Mumbai, where I live, there is a stretch of prime advertising space along our most heavily trafficked and iconic road with SIX different Mowgli billboards one after the other. Inescapable.
 
EDIT, PS: Is it being marketed heavily in other countries? Netflix has balled out to make as big a splash with this movie as possible here in India. They've made it available not just in Hindi but two regional languages, and got an absolute A-list of Bollywood actors to voice the characters. Billboards everywhere... in Mumbai, where I live, there is a stretch of prime advertising space along our most heavily trafficked and iconic road with SIX different Mowgli billboards one after the other. Inescapable.

Thanks for the review of the film. The film is barely being marketed in the United States. My impression is that Netflix acquired it quite cheaply because the studio that made it basically abandoned it after Disney was hugely successful with their Jungle Book.

Here's an article about what went on behind the scenes with the distribution of the film: ‘Mowgli’: A Gloomier ‘Jungle Book’ Finally Sees the Light of Day
 
I decided to watch the movie and it was better than I thought it'd be. The animals look absolutely horrible but the story is pretty good. There's a chunk of it from when Baloo and Bagheera arrive to rescue Mowgli from the langurs to when Mowgli arrives in the man-village that I thought was rushed and pretty all over the place, and the entire climax of the film feels the same way. The Hunter is definitely waaaay underdeveloped and goes from being a hero character to a villain in about 4 seconds (though the way they do this is very effective).

I do like the grittier nature of this version and I think I would recommend it but I enjoyed the Disney version more.

~Thylo
 
Thanks for the review of the film. The film is barely being marketed in the United States. My impression is that Netflix acquired it quite cheaply because the studio that made it basically abandoned it after Disney was hugely successful with their Jungle Book.

Here's an article about what went on behind the scenes with the distribution of the film: ‘Mowgli’: A Gloomier ‘Jungle Book’ Finally Sees the Light of Day

Thanks for the article! I was aware of some of the stuff that went on with this production, which is why I was surprised that it is being so heavily marketed in India. I was wondering whether it is an India-specific marketing push, or if Netflix has invested so much into promoting this film all over the world. I guess it's India-specific... interesting move by Netflix.
 
I just watched "Mowgli" for my self and I quite like it. I didn't like it as much as Disney's 2016 version mind you but I still enjoyed watching it. It made me want to read the novel which I've unfortunately not had the chance to do yet. Also...
...I was not at all expecting to see the decapitated head of Mowgli's white wolf friend and that definitely came as a surprise but I suppose it certainly gave Mowgli a good reason to hate the hunter.
 
I will also watch Mowgli soon.

I've watched Mowgli now, and I certainly liked the story better than The Jungle Book's, although the latter had it's nostalgia advantages too. The finale felt a bit rushed, as was the rescue from the monkeys as @ThylacineAlive said, but overall it was good. The part about the hunter was a nice touch, and the film surprised me a couple of times (see @Hipporex' spoiler). I sort of did not like how Baloo turned out, but that may be because it was such a change from Disney's classic version. I do think his character fitted a brown bear better, while Disney's version fitted a sloth bear better.

My critisisms of this film are mostly animal related. Akela looks more like a hyena than a wolf, and speaking of hyenas the tradition of picturing them as useless evil henchmen continued. I really did not like how the hyena turned out. The birds and antilope were imaginary species. More important however, is that Disney's version focussed much more on the jungle itself and it's inhabitants, instead of focussing strongly on the main characters as Mowgli did. The Jungle Book had me in awe of the world they created all the time, which was mostly missing from Mowgli.

That being said, I do believe the versions are different enough to watch both, but I think I liked Disney's version better. The Jungle Book also had a pangolin, so it gets bonus points!
 
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