Zoo Barcelona Barcelona municipal council and Zoo XXI initiative

carlos55 said:
I find the EAZA post quite usefull because it shows some of the errors of the anti zoo activists quite clearly. There position is too clearly ignore scientific evidence when it does not back their claims. Instead positions based on relative valúes are used. For example so called happiness of animals in zoos versus happiness of animals in the wild. These anti zoo activists want to close a major European zoo, that is their motive, not the actual welfare of the animals at Barcelona zoo.
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Nailed it right on the head there; these people don't truly know animals, and they give them human traits, which they lack, like a "want for freedom". People who are ignorant of other realities project their reality unto others. It's their way, and I'm so glad the EAZA realizes this and counters it with science and facts.
 
From the Great Ape Project facebook
"This is one of the best news for a long time: the Barcelona City Council approved a request for amendment on 14.2.2019 to significantly reduce the livestock population of local zoos: only animals of 11 selected species (hence heron, otter, Bach Turtles etc. ) should remain, all animals of the other species (depending on the source: between 2000 and 5000 individuals from up to 500 species) are to be distributed on sanctuaries and the zoo will be cells a subsequently closure."

Last night, a friend asked on the post how they envisaged these sanctuaries working out, suggesting they would just be an inferior type of zoo. She was immediately banned from their fb page for daring to ask a simple question.
 
We know that three year old children should not be given a pet, because they will pet it to death. Animal rights activists, in the same way, should not be given charge of a zoo, because they will kill the animals.

Your friend was unrealistically optimistic. There are no sanctuaries in Spain or Europe capable to take care of 2000 wild animals, including many large ones. The animal spaces simply do not physically exist. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Most of these 'rescued' animals will simply quietly die of neglect or be euthanized in the following years or months. Some cuter ones might be exploited by activist groups for donations 'Poor Emma the chimp/elephant/tiger needs your help...' We all saw these ads. But donations and public interest periodically dry out, and big animals need care for years or decades - or die.

I can see how a decision of closing the zoo might be popular in a city council. This is an excuse no to invest in animals, because they are supposed to depart to fictional sanctuaries. In fact, most will suffer for years in poor conditions.

I think the best what an animal lover can do is to petition to reverse the decision and give funds to modernize the Barcelona zoo. If this will not happen, follow very closely for the next years the future of animals and activists who proposed and supported this decision - and publicize it, to learn from the example.
 
Alright, it's news time! Today the city council has made their decisive vote to say if the zoo will be ransacked by the activists.
And the answer is...
It's not. The Zoo will proceed on a different path.
The zoo will focus on three directives in terms of their collection:
- Mediterranean animals (Montseny brook newt and other herps, bison, Iberian wolf, barbary macaque, vultures, waterfowl, Spanish toothcarp...), Which will me the most focused on.
- Endangered animals from across the world (great apes, certain mammals [Scimitar-horned oryx, various smaller primates], various birds and herps...)
- Animals they already have in captive breeding programs (many of those I already mentioned, Dorcas gazelle, giant anteater, Sri Lankan leopard...)

However, some of the animals that'll be fased out include:
- Those we already knew: Dolphins, brown bears, common hippos, white rhinoceros, Dalmatian pelicans, Chilean flamingos...
- New additions: Lions, Giraffes, elephants, giraffes.
This last section bothers me. They just invested a crap-ton of money in making new enclosures for all three of these, and now they say they won't be restocked in the future? Makes no sense to me...
Also, the activist influence is all over this new plan, with the frontrunners accusing the zoo as it is of being "colonialist", for instance, and could prove detrimental in the long run... However, I am happy that they won't reduce the zoo to 11 species, and this at least gives the institution more margin for flexibility.
What do you all think about this?
El Ayuntamiento de Barcelona aprueba un nuevo modelo para el Zoo
PA 180717 | betevé
El Ayuntamiento de Barcelona inicia el fin de su zoo decimonónico
 
Thanks for the update!

JigerofLemuria said:
this at least gives the institution more margin for flexibility.
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This is the key bit for me. This version of the plan gives plenty room for manoeuvre and negotiation in future, whereas a strictly restrictive species limit such as was rather bizarrely proposed would not.
 
Thank you for the update JigerofLemuria. The news reports are still quite confusing about the future of the zoo. I wonder what the zoo staff thinks of the plan. I wonder If the animal rights extremistas will not try again to close the zoo. At least the plan includes more investment for the zoo. If the rhino and elephants leave that is Ok If iberian lynx arrive.
 
Either way, I am glad I recently visited Barcelona and hence saw it before these changes hit.
 
[QUOTE="carlos55, post: 1136474, member: If the rhino and elephants leave that is Ok If iberian lynx arrive.[/QUOTE]
They have been toying with the idea of having Iberian lynx in the zoo for a long time, along with waldrapp and bonobos.
I think they should use the elephant paddock as either an elephant rehab center, or if not I think black rhinoceros could really suit that enclosure!
 
On another forum I read that in the now approved plan the zoo should stop being a member of other zoo organizations and thus terminate its EAZA membership. As they do want to keep (mainly) species which are in breeding programs, they will have some challenges for the future...
 
lintworm said:
On another forum I read that in the now approved plan the zoo should stop being a member of other zoo organizations and thus terminate its EAZA membership. As they do want to keep (mainly) species which are in breeding programs, they will have some challenges for the future...
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Damn... It's all the fault of all those stupid anti-zoo activists pulling at the zoo's reigns. I don't think it'll reach THAT level of being ousted altogether, but... They're giving these bastards way too much power.
 
Has is it been stated if the exotic endangered species and the ones with captive breed programmes will be allowed to breed? Or keeping them also implies that they will be allowed to breed?
 
Acinonyx said:
Has is it been stated if the exotic endangered species and the ones with captive breed programmes will be allowed to breed? Or keeping them also implies that they will be allowed to breed?
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The penultimate goal seems to be re-introduction, as in only species for which such possibilities exist should be kept. Fortunately there are re-introduction efforts for species like Gorilla, Rhino and many others, even if only on a small scale...

All in all there seems enough opportunity to make a really good zoo of Barcelona and the fact that they can't keep all ABC megafauna species on such a small site should have been clear years ago. This initiative gives the zoo a chance to develop in a meaningful way. I hope that the zoo direction ignores the politics, but uses this to significantly improve the zoo... We will see a first indication of this when they propose their first collection plan within the next 12 months.

There is currently only one small city zoo that has the possibility to keep all large ABC species long-term (except Tigers and Bears) in good enclosures and that is Basel. A zoo like Barcelona can only dream of that level currently and it is far from the only path to take for city zoos, just look at Bristol and Paris.
 
lintworm said:
The penultimate goal seems to be re-introduction, as in only species for which such possibilities exist should be kept. Fortunately there are re-introduction efforts for species like Gorilla, Rhino and many others, even if only on a small scale...

All in all there seems enough opportunity to make a really good zoo of Barcelona and the fact that they can't keep all ABC megafauna species on such a small site should have been clear years ago. This initiative gives the zoo a chance to develop in a meaningful way. I hope that the zoo direction ignores the politics, but uses this to significantly improve the zoo... We will see a first indication of this when they propose their first collection plan within the next 12 months.

There is currently only one small city zoo that has the possibility to keep all large ABC species long-term (except Tigers and Bears) in good enclosures and that is Basel. A zoo like Barcelona can only dream of that level currently and it is far from the only path to take for city zoos, just look at Bristol and Paris.
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You are right that the space is very reduced. In fact, they've been trying to move the zoo to a larger site since the 1930s. However, while keeping a large collection of ABC animals could prove doubtful at best, I do believe that they can keep lions, tigers, giraffes and their great apes, as well as perhaps rhinos in the future, in their grounds. They have the space to do so, and the giraffes and great apes already have their enclosures made and occupied, and they've been breeding very successfully, and the new lion enclosure has been built. However, the zoo mustn't be over-ambitious, so animals like hippos, elephants and bears I don't believe to be very sustainable unless they eliminate a large portion of other enclosures.
 
JigerofLemuria said:
- New additions: Lions, Giraffes, elephants, giraffes.
This last section bothers me. They just invested a crap-ton of money in making new enclosures for all three of these, and now they say they won't be restocked in the future? Makes no sense to me...
(...)
What do you all think about this?
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I think Barcelona city council desperately needs to consult European Association of Zoos and Aquaria or a similar body.

Many old mid-city zoos modernized with removing some big animals. Barcelona surely can get valuable knowledge from other zoos.

Now it looks like the city council does not know much about modern zoos. The proposal that Barcelona zoo should breed endangered species but without membership in zoo organizations sounds self-contradictory. How would they get animals for fresh blood and funds?
 
Jurek7 said:
I think Barcelona city council desperately needs to consult European Association of Zoos and Aquaria or a similar body.

Many old mid-city zoos modernized with removing some big animals. Barcelona surely can get valuable knowledge from other zoos.

Now it looks like the city council does not know much about modern zoos. The proposal that Barcelona zoo should breed endangered species but without membership in zoo organizations sounds self-contradictory. How would they get animals for fresh blood and funds?
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The root problem is that activist lies have permeated into the public consciousness and even the city council. They're blind to the meaning of what zoos truly are.
Also, I'm not inherently against moving out bif animals, and there are a few they've stopped having. It's just a shame, in my opinion, that they invested millions of euros and over 5 years in making this new savannah zone for them, only to be spat in the face by those zealous over-powered activists...
 
JigerofLemuria said:
Animals that'll be phased out include: common hippos
New additions: Giraffes, elephants
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So they'll get rid of a species that is currently in not so good position in captivity worldwide for two in captivity overpopulated species, where one is being strictly regulated by management tools and second will come to this phase very soon... both of them also with much bigger space requirements, although giraffes will be considerably cheaper. That is some 5D Chess s*** right here.
 
JigerofLemuria said:
Dalmatian pelicans
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Weird choice for a phase-out in this situation. Dalmatian pelican is a mediterranean species and endangered on the European scale.

lintworm said:
On another forum I read that in the now approved plan the zoo should stop being a member of other zoo organizations and thus terminate its EAZA membership. As they do want to keep (mainly) species which are in breeding programs, they will have some challenges for the future...
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Any idea why? This seems extremely counterproductive for a zoo that now has to participate in conservation breeding. It's not like a zoo this size can keep viable populations of the bigger species (great apes, leopards, etc).
 
Mr. Zootycoon said:
Weird choice for a phase-out in this situation. Dalmatian pelican is a mediterranean species and endangered on the European scale.
Any idea why? This seems extremely counterproductive for a zoo that now has to participate in conservation breeding. It's not like a zoo this size can keep viable populations of the bigger species (great apes, leopards, etc).
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Their pelicans are quite elderly, and it's only a matter of time before they pass away.
The fact they don't want to be members of zoological organisms is because they don't want to be connected to the "colonialist business" of zoos... As I said before, SJW's now rule the park.
 
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