Hi I'm new to computers and don't have a clue if this is what i'm supposed to do. I have a gripe about the jungle fowl on the cocos islands ( i think that is the place). Why were they slaughtered and not offered to a zoo, or dedicated breeders? They were the green jungle fowl and very, very rare. there are breeders who would have given an eye tooth to look after them, including me!!!! They had been there for a long time and would have been true to type; what a terrible, terrible thing to do.
Jungle fowl
- Thread starter bitch
- Start date
I don't know much about green jungle fowl, so I checked them out on ISIS.
ISIS shows that there are only 30 of them in 8 zoos world-wide. (Probably a few more in private hands.)
Even if they couldn't have been imported into Australia, if they are that scarce then surely some other zoo would have accepted them.
Where did you hear about the ones on Cocos Islands being slaughtered?
ISIS shows that there are only 30 of them in 8 zoos world-wide. (Probably a few more in private hands.)
Even if they couldn't have been imported into Australia, if they are that scarce then surely some other zoo would have accepted them.
Where did you hear about the ones on Cocos Islands being slaughtered?
If this claim is true to form than Australian authorities are guilty of active extermination of an endangered species. Unbelieveably so, for a nation that harbours so many endangered species on its continent. Australia does have a special interest for native species conservation and a duty to conserve exotic endangered species within its borders. Euthanasia is the most cynical method for Biosecurity to deal with a perceived surplussed or disease-issue. I am dismayed and if found to hold truth I am ... 
The Cocos Buff-banded Rail (Gallirallus philippensis andrewsi) is a subspecies of banded rail endemic to the Cocos (Keeling) Islands. It is now confined to one island in the group, with probably less than 1000 remaining individuals. It has been eliminated from the other islands in the group by various factors including competition with introduced junglefowl. There are two species of junglefowl in the islands, the red and the green, with both species being found in the same areas on West Island where they hybridise -- in other words, the green junglefowl on the Cocos (Keeling) Islands are not pure, they are hybrids. The eradication of junglefowl is essential to the survival of the endemic rail (through the ability to reintroduce the rails to islands from which they have been extirpated).
ComLaw Legislative Instruments - Attachment - National Recovery Plan for Cocos (Keeling) Island Buff-Banded Rail (Gallirallus philippensis andrewsi)
a particularly relevant quote to the subject:
ComLaw Legislative Instruments - Attachment - National Recovery Plan for Cocos (Keeling) Island Buff-Banded Rail (Gallirallus philippensis andrewsi)
a particularly relevant quote to the subject:
Chlidonias,
Thanks for the clarification. Native endangered species conservation and eradication of hybridised competitor species is a more than relevant reason for the extermination process of junglefowl. It seems the comments made by forumster bitch were somewhat premature.
Just one more point to clarify here: what on Earth possessed authorities to introduce non native species like junglefowl to the wild ... or (another possible explanation) were these accidental releases by other (even unnamed) individuals?
Thanks for the clarification. Native endangered species conservation and eradication of hybridised competitor species is a more than relevant reason for the extermination process of junglefowl. It seems the comments made by forumster bitch were somewhat premature.
Just one more point to clarify here: what on Earth possessed authorities to introduce non native species like junglefowl to the wild ... or (another possible explanation) were these accidental releases by other (even unnamed) individuals?
The population was originally made up of indonesians, but now there is a large Malay population. They regulalrly travel back to Malaysia and INdonesia and I presume, on their return, they bring chickens which they let run around in the yard. Presumably some of these go bush.
Hix
Hix
The population was originally made up of indonesians, but now there is a large Malay population. They regulalrly travel back to Malaysia and INdonesia and I presume, on their return, they bring chickens which they let run around in the yard. Presumably some of these go bush.
Hix
Sorry, to get personal here ...!
I thought you Aussies were rather strict on Biosecurity (overtly so) and immigration and stuff ..... 
Domestic fowl as we know them probably include blood from both red and green jungle fowl historically. This seems to crop up in a number of domestic species, having descendents from more than one species.
As to the comments regarding jungle fowl (or should we just admit ... chickens) being released with gay abandon on to Australia's pristine offshore islands by nomadc Malays and Indonesians, I would think that they were released before Australia had biosecurity laws.
As to the comments regarding jungle fowl (or should we just admit ... chickens) being released with gay abandon on to Australia's pristine offshore islands by nomadc Malays and Indonesians, I would think that they were released before Australia had biosecurity laws.
The green junglefowl were introduced to the islands between 1880 and 1890 by, or along with, coconut-plantation workers from Indonesia. The islands were only settled at the start of the 1800s and were owned by the British family Clunies-Ross (who used slaves from Asia and Africa to work the plantations, as was the custom of the day). Australia only gained control of the islands in 1955. The regular domestic chickens (domesticated red junglefowl) have probably been in the islands since they were first settled.
Sorry, to get personal here ...!
True, but the Cocos Keelings are a long way from the Australian mainland, and I'm not too sure what biosecurity/quarantine arrangements are in place there.
Hix
Well that topic got a good airing, and some clarification. There is always two sides to every story. Just a few sour grapes on my part. It would be lovely to have a few green jungle fowl in our zoos, or even some decent red jungle fowl. Most of what is seen here are not true to type. They have already done their quarantine time being on an Aus. controled island. It would take next to no effort to get the green only back in the birds.
From what I understand in talking with somebody in this country it is very difficult to acquire absolutely pure captive green or red junglefowl. If there was a source from one of the range countries then you could probably guarantee having pure birds. Unfortunately it seems that many species of pheasants and fowl have been repeatedly crossed in the past, accidently or on purpose - blue/green peafowl, amherst/golden pheasant etc.
jungle fowl green or red
The red jungle fowl is gallus gallus murgi, and I have a pure strain, descended directly from the Adelaide zoo many years ago. I keep very few and do not sell them to the general public, as I don't want them crossed with OEG, which is done by some. The green j. fowl is gallas varius and from Java and East Indian islands. Both strains would be pure gallas, but I suspect the debate is a waste of time, as we won't get them back in a zoo now!
The red jungle fowl is gallus gallus murgi, and I have a pure strain, descended directly from the Adelaide zoo many years ago. I keep very few and do not sell them to the general public, as I don't want them crossed with OEG, which is done by some. The green j. fowl is gallas varius and from Java and East Indian islands. Both strains would be pure gallas, but I suspect the debate is a waste of time, as we won't get them back in a zoo now!
traditionally there are five subspecies of red junglefowl Gallus gallus, of which G.g.murghi comes from India (the other subspecies being gallus, spadiceus, jabouillei and bankiva). There are three other species in the genus, namely the green junglefowl G. varius, grey junglefowl G. sonneratii and Sri Lanka junglefowl G. lafayettei.bitch said:
Could you clarify what you mean by "Both strains would be pure gallas" because it doesn't really make any sense to me.
And I have no idea what OEG is an acronym for...
OEG is an abbreviation for old english game. A breed of domestic fowl.It was used with jungle fowl (by a few thoughtless people) to breed up the numbers of jungle fowl. You will see photos of them on some of the pheasant web sites. They are the ones with the big combs. Some wild life parks in Tassie have them as well. If they were shown a pure strain, then a comparison could be made by them. I know nothing about the different strains of j. fowl, just make the presumption that if the two colours; or strains have interbred then they could be brought back to true variations.
green junglefowl and red junglefowl are not strains, they are separate species. You could probably selectively breed birds from the hybrids that would look more or less like a pure bird but they will still be hybrids. It is like if a tiger and lion have been bred together to produce hybrid offspring: you can do whatever you like with the offspring but you'll never be able to breed back pure lions or tigers from them.bitch said:
Green Junglefowl in Cocos Keeling Islands
Can anyone provide an update on the status of the species on the islands?
I read here that the birds are hybrid but photos I've seen of the birds are clearly pure Gallus varius. . It's been well-documented in literature for centuries that hybrids between the Green species and domestic fowl/ Red JF are essentially sterile- so I am confused as to the statements of justification of their eradication based upon their hybrid nature. Likewise, the birds are described as "wild chickens" in some literature online. Green JF are hardly wild chickens. They prefer estuarial habitat- and represent the closest living relative of the most ancient ancestors of all four species of junglefowl - a living fossil that's been around for millions of years.
Regardless, any information about the status of this species in Cocos Keeling is much appreciated.
Can anyone provide an update on the status of the species on the islands?
I read here that the birds are hybrid but photos I've seen of the birds are clearly pure Gallus varius. . It's been well-documented in literature for centuries that hybrids between the Green species and domestic fowl/ Red JF are essentially sterile- so I am confused as to the statements of justification of their eradication based upon their hybrid nature. Likewise, the birds are described as "wild chickens" in some literature online. Green JF are hardly wild chickens. They prefer estuarial habitat- and represent the closest living relative of the most ancient ancestors of all four species of junglefowl - a living fossil that's been around for millions of years.
Regardless, any information about the status of this species in Cocos Keeling is much appreciated.
the birds are still found on the islands (I've seen photos from this year). I have read differing opinions on the hybrid/pure status of the birds (which of course are pretty much relative to the aims of the author) but to pick up on a couple of points from your post, I seriously doubt the green junglefowl as a species is "millions of years" old, and while it is true that female hybrids of varius X gallus are sterile it is equally true that the male hybrids are not and can breed with hens of both gallus and varius.
The birds being (possible) hybrids is not the "justification" for removing them from the islands, it is because they are a threat to the existence of an endemic subspecies of rail.
The fossil and molecular history of the genus Gallus is well documented. They originated during the Miocene with rapid diversification of fossil species occurring during the early and mid Pleistocene. According to molecular data, the ancestors of extant junglefowl species diverged ~ 3.6 MYA. Fossils of Green Junglefowl have been described from Pliocene deposits from Flores and Java.
While hybrids between domestic fowl and varius are common in Java, indeed hybrid roosters have probably been carried to Cocos by Indonesians over the years, there has never been a single recorded case of a hybrid producing chicks with a green junglefowl female. The reciprocal cross is possible. Hybrid females are sterile as you've stated - fecundity of hybrid males derived of subsequent crosses - hybrid males bred back to domestic fowl for generations - is somewhat limited as well. Well-established breeds derived of this hybridization like the Onagadori and Koeyoshi are very difficult to propagate with poor fertility and high mortality of developing embryos. According to one research paper, outcrossing the inbred strains of these cultural heirloom breeds of domestic fowl to f1 hybrids with Green Junglefowl dissolved genetic bottlenecks and buttressed certain desirable traits. Nevertheless, females of this hybridization were sterile and within a few generations- the fecundity of males decreases once again.
These chromosomal issues are evidently present in hybrids between most of the junglefowl species. Fertile males can and do breed but successful reproduction appears to occur only when these hybrid males breed with domestic hens and more successfully when bred to their own mothers. Hybrid roosters breeding successfully with Sri Lanka and Green Junglefowl females has never been documented.
As the Green Junglefowl has such unusual ecological requirements it's highly unlikely that it presents a serious threat to endemic rail. The preferred diet of Gallus varius are crustaceans uncovered in sand, organisms trapped in litoral pools during the low tide, shore line detritus and the fresh green seeds and buds of understory plants. They also forage on decaying fruit.
With the precept that the Green Junglefowl is simply a feral chicken - one that is mongrelized with domestic fowl- justification of its eradication is obvious. Nevertheless, these suppositions cannot be substantiated without hard science.
Thank you for informing on the current status of the species in the Cocos- any links to recent photographs will be much appreciated.