ZooChat Cup Group B: Detroit vs San Diego ZSP
- Thread starter CGSwans
- Start date
3-0 SDZSP. No questions asked.
This is the Safari Park's best, and likely only really strong. category. After all, it won unanimously against Dallas with this category. Not only do they have a great variety of ungulates, but their exhibits are good to spectacular IMO.
This is the Safari Park's best, and likely only really strong. category. After all, it won unanimously against Dallas with this category. Not only do they have a great variety of ungulates, but their exhibits are good to spectacular IMO.
Agreed, don't really see Detroit getting much from this round...
I do think Detroit deserves a point here, as it is probably their second best category after ectotherms. Although the zoo doesn't have that many species, all of the ungulate species the zoo does have are kept in large, spacious enclosures, often in mixed species. Here is the list:
-Domestic Bactrian Camel
-White-lipped Deer x American Elk
-American Elk
-Common Eland
-White Rhino
-Grevy's Zebra
-Eastern White-bearded Wildebeest
-Common Warthog
-Generic Giraffe
-American Bison
-Domestic Horse
-Domestic Donkey
-Domestic Sheep
-Domestic Pig
-Domestic Cow
-Domestic Yak
-Pronghorn (bts)
And here are some of the enclosures:
One half of the Common Warthog exhibit. The exhibit is larger than most elephant enclosures I have seen!
Huge Giraffe yard.
Eland yard.
-Domestic Bactrian Camel
-White-lipped Deer x American Elk
-American Elk
-Common Eland
-White Rhino
-Grevy's Zebra
-Eastern White-bearded Wildebeest
-Common Warthog
-Generic Giraffe
-American Bison
-Domestic Horse
-Domestic Donkey
-Domestic Sheep
-Domestic Pig
-Domestic Cow
-Domestic Yak
-Pronghorn (bts)
And here are some of the enclosures:
One half of the Common Warthog exhibit. The exhibit is larger than most elephant enclosures I have seen!
Huge Giraffe yard.
Eland yard.
I will be visiting the Safari Park tomorrow! Very excited! Having just visited Detroit in August this will be one of the few matches in this thing where I have actually visited both zoos! Because I'm visiting in a day, I will be holding my vote until then, but I'm pretty sure already which way my vote will go.
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@birdsandbats Keep in mind that I'm open to persuasion on this, but considering that most/nearly all of SDZSP's hoofstock live in enormous enclosures bordering free-range status, how close does Detroit really measure up? I can see Detroit being strong in this category against other competitors, but personally I need to see/hear more before I'm convinced it deserves a point.
Also I'm pretty sure that their rare deer (the biggest species in Detroit's favor IMO) are also held by SDZSP, and in much larger numbers there.
Also I'm pretty sure that their rare deer (the biggest species in Detroit's favor IMO) are also held by SDZSP, and in much larger numbers there.
It’s no more or less unfair than San Diego ZSP drawing primates against Berlin was.
Very rearly vote 3:0 and this will be one of the exeptions. Appreciate the Detroit's spacious enclosures, but San Diego ZSP is the Ungulate king and probably the only tiny flaw, they have are the exclusivity of Asian plains.
Detroit has Guanaco and Fallow Deer as well but would have been stronger a few years back when they also had Przewalski's horse, tapir, peccary, pudu, takin, and kudu.
In any case, while the exhibits are all very nice, they are also all basically the same (grassy yard in a park). It's hard to see the zoo measuring up to the exhibit size and complexity, collection size, chance to see herding behavior, or breeding programs at San Diego.
I forgot about the Guanaco and Fallow Deer.
Not including the domestic forms, Detroit Zoo has around a dozen ungulates in decent exhibits. I've visited the zoo twice (2008 and 2018) and I'm a big fan of the facility, but in reality I would argue that the zoo is not very strong in this category.
San Diego Zoo Safari Park is a place that I've been to on three occasions (2006, 2011, 2017) and it's one of the great zoos of the world in terms of ungulates. Someone else can supply a species list, but there are vast enclosures packed with large herds at the park. The 5-acre African Bush Elephant exhibit has had numerous births over the years in the big group that is maintained there, the large herd of 20 Giant Eland is remarkable, a herd of at least 10 Southern Gerenuk were there a couple of years ago, plus large groups of at least 25 Scimitar-horned Oryx, 15 Cape Buffalo, a dozen Gemsbok, and the list could go on and on. There are not many zoos on the planet that have such an extensive ungulate collection as SDZSP. The establishment has bred almost 100 Southern White Rhinos and probably a couple of thousand antelopes since the inception of the facility in 1972. It's a remarkable zoo for ungulates.
My vote is an easy, breezy 3-0 victory for San Diego Zoo Safari Park.
San Diego Zoo Safari Park is a place that I've been to on three occasions (2006, 2011, 2017) and it's one of the great zoos of the world in terms of ungulates. Someone else can supply a species list, but there are vast enclosures packed with large herds at the park. The 5-acre African Bush Elephant exhibit has had numerous births over the years in the big group that is maintained there, the large herd of 20 Giant Eland is remarkable, a herd of at least 10 Southern Gerenuk were there a couple of years ago, plus large groups of at least 25 Scimitar-horned Oryx, 15 Cape Buffalo, a dozen Gemsbok, and the list could go on and on. There are not many zoos on the planet that have such an extensive ungulate collection as SDZSP. The establishment has bred almost 100 Southern White Rhinos and probably a couple of thousand antelopes since the inception of the facility in 1972. It's a remarkable zoo for ungulates.
My vote is an easy, breezy 3-0 victory for San Diego Zoo Safari Park.
For purposes of completeness, it only seems right to make an attempt at San Diego's collection list. It's been a few years since I visited, but I've followed the news enough that this should be pretty accurate. The shocking thing is that even with 60+ species on site I can think of a dozen or more additional species that were present not too long ago.
Elephants (1): African
Equids (4): Przewalski's Horse, Somali Wild Ass, Grevy's Zebra, Mountain Zebra
Tapirs: none
Rhinos (3): Black, Southern White, Indian
Camelids (1): Bactrian
Pigs/Peccaries (3): Babirusa, Warthog, Red River Hog
Hippos: none
Chevrotain: none
Pronghorn: none
Musk Deer: none
Deer (6): Southern Pudu, Red Deer, Bactrian Deer, Eld's Deer, Barasingha, Sika
Giraffids (4): Okapi, Reticulated (hybrid?) Giraffe, Rothschild's (hybrid?) Giraffe, Masai Giraffe
Cattle (4): Ankole, Banteng, Gaur, Cape Buffalo
Caprines (at least 3): Domestic goat, Markhor, Bighorn Sheep (do they still have Urial or Barbary Sheep?)
Antelope (at least 32): Giant Eland, Common Eland, Bongo, Sitatunga, Greater Kudu, Nilgai, Red-flanked Duiker, Steenbok, Kirk's Dik-dik, Red-fronted Gazelle, Thomson's Gazelle, Sommering's Gazelle, Grant's Gazelle, Springbok, Gerenuk, Blackbuck, Impala, Kob, Red Lechwe, Nile Lechwe, Common Waterbuck, Defassa Waterbuck, Bontebok, White-bearded Wildebeest, Roan Antelope, Sable Antelope, Addax, Gemsbok, Fringe-eared Oryx, Scimitar-horned Oryx, Arabian Oryx.
Elephants (1): African
Equids (4): Przewalski's Horse, Somali Wild Ass, Grevy's Zebra, Mountain Zebra
Tapirs: none
Rhinos (3): Black, Southern White, Indian
Camelids (1): Bactrian
Pigs/Peccaries (3): Babirusa, Warthog, Red River Hog
Hippos: none
Chevrotain: none
Pronghorn: none
Musk Deer: none
Deer (6): Southern Pudu, Red Deer, Bactrian Deer, Eld's Deer, Barasingha, Sika
Giraffids (4): Okapi, Reticulated (hybrid?) Giraffe, Rothschild's (hybrid?) Giraffe, Masai Giraffe
Cattle (4): Ankole, Banteng, Gaur, Cape Buffalo
Caprines (at least 3): Domestic goat, Markhor, Bighorn Sheep (do they still have Urial or Barbary Sheep?)
Antelope (at least 32): Giant Eland, Common Eland, Bongo, Sitatunga, Greater Kudu, Nilgai, Red-flanked Duiker, Steenbok, Kirk's Dik-dik, Red-fronted Gazelle, Thomson's Gazelle, Sommering's Gazelle, Grant's Gazelle, Springbok, Gerenuk, Blackbuck, Impala, Kob, Red Lechwe, Nile Lechwe, Common Waterbuck, Defassa Waterbuck, Bontebok, White-bearded Wildebeest, Roan Antelope, Sable Antelope, Addax, Gemsbok, Fringe-eared Oryx, Scimitar-horned Oryx, Arabian Oryx.
Not that it matters but for correctness sake:
Equids: I don't think they have Hartmann's Mountain Zebra but I could be wrong. I certainly never saw any.
Rhinos: Probably worth noting their active project to clone Northern White Rhinoceros as well.
Camels: Dromedary as well.
Pigs/Peccaries: Never saw any sign of babirusa.
Deer: Barbary Deer (all female, dead-end program though I think they want to import more somehow), White-Lipped Deer, Vietnamese Sika, Mandarin Sika, Tufted Deer, Pere David's Deer, Indian Muntjac, Malayan Sambar, and Indian Sambar as well.
Giraffids: hybrid Reticulated, hybrid Rothschild's, maybe a few pure Rothschild's.
Caprines: Kordofan ssp of Aoudad, Nubian Ibex, Urial, and 1 or 2 Armenian Mouflon as well. Possibly another unnamed species present bts.
Antelope: I believe the Soemmerring's Gazelles are all condensed at the zoo now. Black Duiker, Yellow-Backed Duiker, Slender-Horned Gazelle, Addra Gazelle, Arabian Oryx, Klipspringer, and nyala are present as well.
No disrespect to Detroit here but 3-0 SDZSP.
~Thylo
I think they might, in one of the hillier exhibits along the tram, but I cannot confirm that either.
They have Northern Sulawesi Babirusa in an exhibit off of the lagoon in Nairobi Village. Just visited the Safari Park today. There appeared to be some pretty young ones with the adults. I will type up more details on my opinion later, but having just visited Detroit in August this is definitely 3-0 SDZ Safari Park.
A recent visit from myself and a re-identification confirms that the species is present at the park at least in January.
I think this will be the only match I am confident about voting, since I haven't visited any zoo in this series.
3-0 Detroit of course
3-0 Detroit of course
That sounds even worse. If it's between the East & West zoos, it's a straight-up annihilation.