Best UK Gorilla enclosure

Best UK Gorilla enclosure


  • Total voters
    28
  • Poll closed .
It’s because of what I said before. There are two very clear different designs of gorilla enclosure in the UK. One, the gorillarium, looks ugly to many given the cage-style design, but is incredibly functional, giving the gorillas the cover they desire and deep bedding on the floor to spend hours and hours outdoors, even in winter. The gorillariums also take into account the often forgotten fact that gorillas do, actually, like to climb!!
The other, the ‘island’, is more natural, looks pleasing to the eye, and provides gorillas with plenty of green space and, in some cases, undergrowth...but are rarely if ever used because of the lack of shelter! Look at Apenheul in the Netherlands. Their gorilla enclosure is a huge (3.5 acre) green space, but with plenty of trees. As a result, the gorillas often go outside as they don’t feel too exposed. (The same goes for Dublin, though I’ve never visited)

I wager that some of the above voters have either not visited some of the zoos (and so are using the photos you shared as the basis for their vote) or visit the zoos *so much* that they are voting based on favouritism (Jedd Cullinan for example, has voted Other, and knowing how much he loves Longleat I can only guess that’s who he’s voting for). Jersey and Paignton both look the most appealing in said photos, which is likely why at least a couple of people are voting for them.

If you don’t want the vote to be as close...then it might be a good idea to not include Howletts, Chessington or Port Lympne in the vote. The fact is their husbandry and enclosure design is *so different* from any other zoo in the UK, that it almost feels odd to include them on a list of largely island/garden style enclosures.

For the record, I said it up thread but I’ll say it again, out of the top two natural-style contenders, Paignton is the obvious win. The enclosure has always been for bachelor gorillas, and despite their having to separate one of the four males now, the indoors is darkened (which gorillas like, given they live in dense forests in the wild), the enclosure is spacious enough for the lads they have/have had, and the island is natural looking with a TON of undergrowth. Jersey’s outdoors is nice and big for the small family group that they have, but the indoors is tiny. It doesn’t matter if they looked like they were cramped or if they didn’t, the enclosure is poorer for it. If the indoors was bigger at Jersey, they could accommodate a much larger family group (with up to five breeding females, akin to Apenheul, Howletts or Port Lympne!). If they overhauled the indoors, Jersey would win for me. But based on functionality alone, the obvious winner of the ‘natural style’ enclosures is Paignton.

I should mention that by no means am I claiming to be an expert, like some people in other parts of this forum claim to be!!! But having visited almost every zoo in the UK with gorillas (save for Belfast, Blackpool and Chessington) regularly, it’s not hard to see that Howletts has the best/most functional enclosures of the three with gorillariums (Chessington’s looks like Howletts but lacks some of the things that make Howletts great. If Port Lympne only had the Palace of the Apes group, and not any of the bachelors in the Gorilla Garden, then they’d be the obvious win. But the gorillariums used by the bachelors are much smaller than even the ones at Howletts).

Another note that could be affecting the vote - some zoos built said enclosures with the immediate mindset of keeping bachelor gorillas (Longleat, Paignton, Port Lympne’s gorilla garden), whose husbandry requirements are massively different to a regular group. Certainly with bachelors you need plenty of places for the males to get away from each other, and the option to separate. That, again, is a factor that must be taken into account when voting on the best enclosure for gorillas in the UK.
 
Jersey’s outdoors is nice and big for the small family group that they have, but the indoors is tiny.

It is indeed far too small for nowadays. When it was built it was a lot larger than the previous house( now the chough aviary) where they first started breeding from Jambo/Npongo/Nandi. The indoor dens in that one were just three tiny cubicles. As you suggested, this seems to be why their group is still so small nowadays- from the gorillas they were breeding back in the 1970'-8o's era (though most of them were males) one might expect them to have a much larger group nowadays than they do have. The indoor house size seems the limiting factor still.
 
Thank you @ShonenJake13 for your great reply giving an insight into the qualities of the different Gorilla enclosures in the UK. Just to address a couple of your points.

I wager that some of the above voters have either not visited some of the zoos (and so are using the photos you shared as the basis for their vote) or visit the zoos *so much* that they are voting based on favouritism (Jedd Cullinan for example, has voted Other, and knowing how much he loves Longleat I can only guess that’s who he’s voting for). Jersey and Paignton both look the most appealing in said photos, which is likely why at least a couple of people are voting for them.

Yes, obviously some people who will be voting will have not visited any/many of the collections. Therefore, it is extremely helpful when more knowledgeable members such as yourself contribute to give these members more information to base their vote on. I would obviously still encourage these people to vote because the more members who vote the better.

If you don’t want the vote to be as close...then it might be a good idea to not include Howletts, Chessington or Port Lympne in the vote. The fact is their husbandry and enclosure design is *so different* from any other zoo in the UK, that it almost feels odd to include them on a list of largely island/garden style enclosures.

I understand there are two different types of exhibit that are more difficult to compare. However, that is the whole point of this poll to discover which members think are more suitable for Gorillas and therefore lead to the best overall enclosure.
 
However, that is the whole point of this poll to discover which members think are more suitable for Gorillas and therefore lead to the best overall enclosure.

And that’s where it gets tricky. Despite my personal opinion that Howletts has the best husbandry style for any gorillas in the UK, the fact is that not everyone would think said enclosures are suitable. Which is fine, as all opinions are subjective.
But if the vote is for which enclosure is most suitable and not which enclosure is best as far as husbandry standards is concerned, then I’d probably go with Jersey as my top choice. Certainly for the group it houses (a silverback, an elderly female, two breeding females and a young female infant) it’s suitable. Paignton built their enclosure originally without considering that they may at some point have to permanently split up the boys. And Howletts, whilst having the largest number of gorillas outside of Africa and an amazing breeding history, also frequently runs into trouble with splitting up their groups. They have had to leave blackbacks in their groups well into their early teens (around the time they should be leaving the group) frequently, because the owner of Howletts breeds the gorillas without necessarily wanting to work alongside the gorilla studbook to move on older offspring (anti-zoo mentality and all that jazz).
 
And that’s where it gets tricky. Despite my personal opinion that Howletts has the best husbandry style for any gorillas in the UK, the fact is that not everyone would think said enclosures are suitable. Which is fine, as all opinions are subjective.
But if the vote is for which enclosure is most suitable and not which enclosure is best as far as husbandry standards is concerned, then I’d probably go with Jersey as my top choice. Certainly for the group it houses (a silverback, an elderly female, two breeding females and a young female infant) it’s suitable. Paignton built their enclosure originally without considering that they may at some point have to permanently split up the boys. And Howletts, whilst having the largest number of gorillas outside of Africa and an amazing breeding history, also frequently runs into trouble with splitting up their groups. They have had to leave blackbacks in their groups well into their early teens (around the time they should be leaving the group) frequently, because the owner of Howletts breeds the gorillas without necessarily wanting to work alongside the gorilla studbook to move on older offspring (anti-zoo mentality and all that jazz).

Yes, I see what you mean with there being a difference between the best and most suitable enclosure for Gorilla's. I would suggest in general to take into account how suitable the enclosure is amongst other factors such as husbandry style which you mention to decide what you believe to be the best enclosure for Gorilla's in the UK. It is by far no means a perfect question and people will interpret it differently, but that will hopefully lead to a more interesting debate.
 
The other, the ‘island’, is more natural, looks pleasing to the eye, and provides gorillas with plenty of green space and, in some cases, undergrowth...but are rarely if ever used because of the lack of shelter! Look at Apenheul in the Netherlands. Their gorilla enclosure is a huge (3.5 acre) green space, but with plenty of trees. As a result, the gorillas often go outside as they don’t feel too exposed. (The same goes for Dublin, though I’ve never visited)

Another thing that plays a role, especially in the German speaking zoo world, is that gorillas tend to be afraid of nearly everything they do not know. As many zoos with excellent breeding records (Basel, Frankfurt, Stuttgart, Krefeld) used to keep their gorillas either all indoors or without any natural substrate, animals accustomed to that are often afraid of things like grass or mulch (some of Stuttgart's gorillas preferred to use pieces of wood as shoes on that substrate) and will refuse to use it. There are some "fun" stories of Krefeld gorillas that moved to to other zoos being afraid of rain... This is also one of the reason why they suspect the Frankfurt gorillas don't use the excellent outdoor enclosure, which is full of cover, as their silverback is from Basel and isn't used to outdoor enclosures.
 
Another thing that plays a role, especially in the German speaking zoo world, is that gorillas tend to be afraid of nearly everything they do not know. As many zoos with excellent breeding records (Basel, Frankfurt, Stuttgart, Krefeld) used to keep their gorillas either all indoors or without any natural substrate, animals accustomed to that are often afraid of things like grass or mulch (some of Stuttgart's gorillas preferred to use pieces of wood as shoes on that substrate) and will refuse to use it. There are some "fun" stories of Krefeld gorillas that moved to to other zoos being afraid of rain... This is also one of the reason why they suspect the Frankfurt gorillas don't use the excellent outdoor enclosure, which is full of cover, as their silverback is from Basel and isn't used to outdoor enclosures.

Yes - this just goes to show, that 'best' certainly in threads like this, certainly can depend on whether you an animal looking out or a human looking in... very often, quite different objectives.
 
then I’d probably go with Jersey as my top choice. Certainly for the group it houses (a silverback, an elderly female, two breeding females and a young female infant) it’s suitable.

Where did you get the baby's sex from? They keep saying they are going to release the news soon but I still can't see it anywhere.
 
The results are in. It was extremely close but well done to Jersey on winning the poll for Best UK Gorilla enclosure. With a winning margin of 1 over Paignton, 2 over Port Lympne and 4 over Howletts it was extremely close and all four exhibits should be acknowledged for being excellent Gorilla exhibits in different ways. Interestingly the more natural exhibits appeared to be more popular amongst members than the more functional ones. This was by far the closest of the Great Ape polls, due to the fact there is perhaps, no stand out exhibit in this category that can fully accommodate the visitors and apes needs and stand out from the competition.

Jersey: 28.6%
Paignton: 25.0%
Port Lympne: 21.4%
Howletts: 14.3%
London: 7.1%
Longleat: 3.6%

@Jedd Cullinan I am assuming your vote was for Longleat?
 
Something makes me think-No...;)

I don't seem to have a photo of London's indoor area from my last trip in March, but I'm sure I remember that some of the leaf-decals stuck on the windows have been removed. Not completely, but I'm sure there were more clear areas of glass than there was previously
 
The results are in. It was extremely close but well done to Jersey on winning the poll for Best UK Gorilla enclosure. With a winning margin of 1 over Paignton, 2 over Port Lympne and 4 over Howletts it was extremely close and all four exhibits should be acknowledged for being excellent Gorilla exhibits in different ways. Interestingly the more natural exhibits appeared to be more popular amongst members than the more functional ones. This was by far the closest of the Great Ape polls, due to the fact there is perhaps, no stand out exhibit in this category that can fully accommodate the visitors and apes needs and stand out from the competition.

Jersey: 28.6%
Paignton: 25.0%
Port Lympne: 21.4%
Howletts: 14.3%
London: 7.1%
Longleat: 3.6%

@Jedd Cullinan I am assuming your vote was for Longleat?
That's right
 
I don't seem to have a photo of London's indoor area from my last trip in March, but I'm sure I remember that some of the leaf-decals stuck on the windows have been removed. Not completely, but I'm sure there were more clear areas of glass than there was previously

Yes, I have checked my pics and there are fewer on there than shown in the photo upthread. :)
 
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