Best UK Sea Lion enclosure

[TriUK]

LC has a tunnel crossing the 2/3 width of the second pool (ocean side). It is the pool where the Macaronis we’re first kept. Apparently the seals don’t like the tunnel and though they have access, they rarely go over that side. As I’ve stated here before, I genuinely love LC but they should not be keeping fur seals in that exhibit in 2020. It was designed for sea otter. At best, the smaller pool which the fur seals prefer could house native seals for rehab whilst the tunnel pool could/should be made into a separate display for sea otter, fairy penguin or ......? Either way, this discussion may be over soon anyway if LC closes due to funding issues! I really hope not but.....

The issue with my own suggestion about rehab seals sharing a pool would be cross-contamination through the water of course - so maybe it would be a case of ‘blacking out’ the tunnel and changing the structure of the dividing rock pool to redesign the whole exhibit? Galapagos - penguins, marine iguanas & flightless cormorants?

 

[TriUK]

In this case it isn't a matter of weight so much as pressure. If a bull sea lion were to try and break through the glass with his nose or tail, he could because of the pressure he exerts over a relatively small area compared to female sea lions, who, I assume, are not as strong nor as powerful

Could a cage be placed around the tunnel?

 

[amur leopard]

Could a cage be placed around the tunnel?

That would rather defeat the point of the tunnel wouldn't it?

 

[TriUK]

The distance of the metal ‘squares’ in the cage structure would not have to be close together & could be coated white. If it meant breeding could happen and welfare was improved then it would be worth it.

 

[amur leopard]

Just generally, as mentioned before on the thread about the use of glass in elephant and rhino enclosures, the sealion wouldn't be able to break the glass but would be able to make it shake or even make a small crack in it. It would probably need more like the power of an elephant seal to crack and break the glass. My thinking behind this is that the female sealions would have a smaller surface area to apply a smaller force onto the glass, thus making the force imparted more equal to that from the male than one would think. As a result, the male sealion would not actually impart a much larger force than a female if they were to bang their heads against the glass or try to break it in some other way. Of course, a male is more likely to try and break the glass.

As for the caging, if it is too far apart, the male would be able to get through and have a good go at the glass, but if it is too close together, visitors wouldn't be able to see a thing. As mentioned before up-post, I don't think that a male sealion would be able to apply much more pressure on the tunnel than the female, and I think it is just a cautionary measure relating to the male's aggression

 

[zoogiraffe]

In this case it isn't a matter of weight so much as pressure. If a bull sea lion were to try and break through the glass with his nose or tail, he could because of the pressure he exerts over a relatively small area compared to female sea lions, who, I assume, are not as strong nor as powerful

Just as well the Colchester tunnel just like all other tunnels isn't made from glass then!

 

[amur leopard]

Just as well the Colchester tunnel just like all other tunnels isn't made from glass then!

Glass, plexiglass, acrylic - every material follows the same law of pressure, they're not special

EDIT: I think it is also important to consider the reason why the zoo would choose not to house a bull even though it is extremely likely that the latter would not be able to break the acrylic (or whatever material the tunnel is made from, thanks @zoogiraffe for the correction). Much of the time, the structure concerned, whether it be a bridge, a tunnel or a building, could easily take the pressure or weight. However, the real issue is whether people feel safe in the building. This factor affects the structure's functionality more than anything, and as a result is often very important and taken into account. An example is when the Millenium bridge in London was closed for a short period of time whilst they reinforced it because it was swaying. The bridge could have easily taken 10 times the mass of the people on it when it was swaying, but people did not feel safe on it and as a result it was temporarily closed and restructured slightly to make it sturdier. I suspect the same is the case with the bull sealion, they just haven't tried it because they are afraid that it will make visitors afraid of the sturdiness of the whole zoo.

 

[Zia]

I have been pondering this statement since it has been posted,and I have a question with regards it.I am aware that everything is built has a structural limitation,but surely if a Bull sealion has a weight to great for the tunnel,then surely 4 females are of a great weight and impose a greater risk than the Bull.So in effect I suppose what I am saying is the tunnel isn't the problem for them keeping a bull.I could be wrong and quite often I am.

I don't know tbh - I have been told it is an issue by a keeper at Colchester but I didn't ask if it is specifically the size difference between males / females that is the problem or if it is more of a behavioral risk i.e. that either sex could cause similar damage but males would be more likely to try to attack the tunnel.

My logical brain says it is primarily the size difference and that a male could exert more pressure on the tunnel than a female and cause more damage.

If it is a completely behavioural issue and technically a female could cause the same level of damage then it would seem a bit risky to have a tunnel in place at all...

LC has a tunnel crossing the 2/3 width of the second pool (ocean side). It is the pool where the Macaronis we’re first kept. Apparently the seals don’t like the tunnel and though they have access, they rarely go over that side. As I’ve stated here before, I genuinely love LC but they should not be keeping fur seals in that exhibit in 2020. It was designed for sea otter. At best, the smaller pool which the fur seals prefer could house native seals for rehab whilst the tunnel pool could/should be made into a separate display for sea otter, fairy penguin or ......? Either way, this discussion may be over soon anyway if LC closes due to funding issues! I really hope not but.....

Thank you - I thought there was a tunnel involved somewhere.

 

[Zia]

Glass, plexiglass, acrylic - every material follows the same law of pressure, they're not special

EDIT: I think it is also important to consider the reason why the zoo would choose not to house a bull even though it is extremely likely that the latter would not be able to break the acrylic (or whatever material the tunnel is made from, thanks @zoogiraffe for the correction). Much of the time, the structure concerned, whether it be a bridge, a tunnel or a building, could easily take the pressure or weight. However, the real issue is whether people feel safe in the building. This factor affects the structure's functionality more than anything, and as a result is often very important and taken into account. An example is when the Millenium bridge in London was closed for a short period of time whilst they reinforced it because it was swaying. The bridge could have easily taken 10 times the mass of the people on it when it was swaying, but people did not feel safe on it and as a result it was temporarily closed and restructured slightly to make it sturdier. I suspect the same is the case with the bull sealion, they just haven't tried it because they are afraid that it will make visitors afraid of the sturdiness of the whole zoo.

I don't think that would be an issue - (most) people don't question tunnels with dirty great sharks swimming around above them in sealife centres.

Incidentally - the last time we went to an aquarium (Bristol) we did actually witness a leaking tank. Turned out it was coming from pipework rather than the main tank structure but it did focus the mind on quite how much water is involved!

 

[TinoPup]

I don't think that would be an issue - (most) people don't question tunnels with dirty great sharks swimming around above them in sealife centres.

Sharks don't weigh much, though. Nurse sharks can get a little over 100lb, but most of them just keep blacktips, who weigh about 25lbs. Compared to a male south american sea lion, which can reach nearly 800lbs, over double in size of the females. Male sea lions can also get very aggressive, especially when breeding.

 

[Zia]

Sharks don't weigh much, though. Nurse sharks can get a little over 100lb, but most of them just keep blacktips, who weigh about 25lbs. Compared to a male south american sea lion, which can reach nearly 800lbs, over double in size of the females. Male sea lions can also get very aggressive, especially when breeding.

My point was more that people tend to trust these structures unless there is a clear outward sign of them being too flimsy or unstable - like a bridge swaying... or rivets falling off / water dripping through / cracks showing etc etc. I don't think the average guest would be suddenly scared of the tunnel, or be 'afraid of the sturdiness of the whole zoo' if you put a bull in the Colchester tank.

 

[Zorro]

Whipsnade’s sealion exhibit has been a victim of a lot of empty promises from senior management since public access was restricted by the closure of the indoor housing. There were plans to expand and enlarge the outdoor pool, improved filtration and a “kelp forest” for the indoor pool. Now when visiting, you’ll find a dilapidated underwater walkway coupled with an algal green indoor pool that you can hardly see anything swimming in!

It’s scary to think this exhibit once held dolphins!

I saw this exhibit just after it opened they had two pairs of dolphins in there

 

[amur leopard]

Sharks don't weigh much, though. Nurse sharks can get a little over 100lb, but most of them just keep blacktips, who weigh about 25lbs. Compared to a male south american sea lion, which can reach nearly 800lbs, over double in size of the females. Male sea lions can also get very aggressive, especially when breeding.

Good thought, and yes, mass is indirectly linked with how much pressure can be applied to a surface through force (F=ma and then P=F/A) but just as important as, for example, the acceleration with which they are hitting the glass is equally important and the area over which they are hitting the glass is twice as important. However, these figures are of course useful in determining the force. I think the main issue in shark tanks is that they often contain much more water than sealion tanks, and most importantly, are a lot deeper. If a shark tank is 10 metres deep, you'd need a panel of acrylic that is around 50 cm (20 inches) deep to keep out the water at the bottom of the tank. However, water generally applies pressure over a very large surface area since it is a liquid. In fact, a male sealion could apply more pressure on a surface at the depth that the Colchester tunnel is than the water could at that depth. So I think it was still an informed decision that they made (of course it would be) but the tunnel could still likely hold the water. You're right essentially

My point was more that people tend to trust these structures unless there is a clear outward sign of them being too flimsy or unstable - like a bridge swaying... or rivets falling off / water dripping through / cracks showing etc etc. I don't think the average guest would be suddenly scared of the tunnel, or be 'afraid of the sturdiness of the whole zoo' if you put a bull in the Colchester tank.

Fair enough, although I would say that if they were to get a very aggressive bull, it could probably hit the acrylic and make a smallish crack in it. I'm not sure how thick it is in the tunnel, probably around 10cm but a crack doesn't need to go right through the acrylic to where the visitors are and they'd still see it. There have been incidents where silverback gorillas have made (admittedly quite large) cracks in viewing windows and the visitors watching it at the time have all run away and kept on running. The gorilla would never be able to break the glass, but people do remember these things and can be afraid to go near a glass viewing window or a tunnel again if they've had a similar experience.

 

[Tim May]

I saw this exhibit just after it opened they had two pairs of dolphins in there

When first opened, the Whipsnade Dolphinarium originally housed five dolphins.

 

[Zorro]

When first opened, the Whipsnade Dolphinarium originally housed five dolphins.

Thats what I saw on the day two outside two inside!

 

[Tim May]

Thats what I saw on the day two outside two inside!

I'm not doubting that you saw four dolphins on your visit but there were originally five; this is confirmed in the ZSL Annual Report for 1972.

 

[Zorro]

I'm not doubting that you saw four dolphins on your visit but there were originally five; this is confirmed in the ZSL Annual Report for 1972.

I believe you but still only saw the four!

 

[britishzoofan]

With just over 12 hours to go Blackpool and Colchester are currently tied in first place in the closest vote so far.

 

[britishzoofan]

Results are in. For the first time we have a tie. Congratulations to Blackpool and Colchester for coming joint first in the poll for Best UK Sea Lion enclosure. They both had different strengths, with Blackpool's being the size and attractiveness of the exhibit and Colchester being unique in possessing an underwater tunnel. A mention should also be given to Longleat in third who's exhibit stood out from the crowd with it being the largest and only one in a lake, however it is let down by its lack of saltwater.

Blackpool: 42.0%
Colchester: 42.0%
Longleat: 16.0%

 

[pipaluk]

Results are in. For the first time we have a tie. Congratulations to Blackpool and Colchester for coming joint first in the poll for Best UK Sea Lion enclosure. They both had different strengths, with Blackpool's being the size and attractiveness of the exhibit and Colchester being unique in possessing an underwater tunnel. A mention should also be given to Longleat in third who's exhibit stood out from the crowd with it being the largest and only one in a lake, however it is let down by its lack of saltwater.

Blackpool: 42.0%
Colchester: 42.0%
Longleat: 16.0%

I think probably this is the right result, the top two are far and away the best 2 Sealion enclosures in the UK. I'm just very happy Longleat's Lake didn’t win again!!