Yes they have all those outside, but that's all if I remember right, I went about 3 years ago I think
Living Coasts (Closed) Living Coasts News
- Thread starter Trigger
- Start date
BOTW is the only place I have visited( rather reluctantly) since the virus took hold- we went (or rather I was taken) during the summer. The village itself was absolutely rammed- not the more usual American/foreign tourists I've seen there previously, but with english families seeking local outdoor venues. As an older person I was quite nervous, but found that in the bird garden there was far more space to move around. As I said the only gatherings were around the Penguin display. The dinos take up quite a large area of woodland and winding paths at the back of the site. Nothing like the quality of the WMSP exhibit though, which I thought was extremely good a couple of years back.
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That's probably the key again isn't it?- noisy, pretty/ugly/strange +interaction and 'cute/comical' young ones. Can't fail to attract.
Gigit
Well-Known Member
To return to the subject of Torbay Council supporting Living Coasts, I've had a look back through my archives (press cuttings!) and on the Wild Planet Trust website and can't find a reference to any requests for assistance. They might not have been made public of course.This is an announcement on the website, made on 15 June 2020:
"It is with regret that Wild Planet Trust has to announce that it will not be re-opening Living Coasts as a visitor attraction following its closure during the current global coronavirus pandemic. Falling visitor numbers and the forced closure of all its zoos due to COVID-19 has meant that it has had to look at its cost base and make efficiencies. After nearly twenty years of operation the site also needed substantial maintenance that the Trust is no longer in a position to afford.
The next stage is to find homes for the animals. Living Coasts is part of a world-wide network of zoos and aquariums and will be looking for homes for the animals within them once movement restrictions have been lifted. Most of the animals kept at Living Coasts are marine species that will need specialist facilities. Living Coasts is confident that good new homes for the animals will be found, but at present it is unclear how long this process may take.
All 44 staff at Living Coasts have been placed at risk of redundancy. This will be considered within the context of the wider restructuring of the Trust’s zoos, and potential redundancies at their other sites (Paignton Zoo and Newquay Zoo).
Wild Planet Trust would like to thank the many people who have visited and supported Living Coasts over the years, and the many businesses, and grant giving trusts which have support its vital conservation work."
With days and weeks merging into each other over the past year it's hard to be precise, but I think rumours of the possible closure of Living Coasts were around even before Covid struck, thanks also to the problems and expense caused by the TB outbreak at Paignton.
While there would be no point in me living in Torbay without the zoo, others, including my neighbours (a 15 minute walk and they never go there; Living Coasts made even less of an impression), have different priorities and views on how tax payers' money should be spent locally. Of course, they do benefit from these places through tourism and employment.
All water under the bridge now as far as Living Coasts is concerned. I have no axe to grind either for or against the Council. I just thought I'd remind myself of what was said at the time.
"It is with regret that Wild Planet Trust has to announce that it will not be re-opening Living Coasts as a visitor attraction following its closure during the current global coronavirus pandemic. Falling visitor numbers and the forced closure of all its zoos due to COVID-19 has meant that it has had to look at its cost base and make efficiencies. After nearly twenty years of operation the site also needed substantial maintenance that the Trust is no longer in a position to afford.
The next stage is to find homes for the animals. Living Coasts is part of a world-wide network of zoos and aquariums and will be looking for homes for the animals within them once movement restrictions have been lifted. Most of the animals kept at Living Coasts are marine species that will need specialist facilities. Living Coasts is confident that good new homes for the animals will be found, but at present it is unclear how long this process may take.
All 44 staff at Living Coasts have been placed at risk of redundancy. This will be considered within the context of the wider restructuring of the Trust’s zoos, and potential redundancies at their other sites (Paignton Zoo and Newquay Zoo).
Wild Planet Trust would like to thank the many people who have visited and supported Living Coasts over the years, and the many businesses, and grant giving trusts which have support its vital conservation work."
With days and weeks merging into each other over the past year it's hard to be precise, but I think rumours of the possible closure of Living Coasts were around even before Covid struck, thanks also to the problems and expense caused by the TB outbreak at Paignton.
While there would be no point in me living in Torbay without the zoo, others, including my neighbours (a 15 minute walk and they never go there; Living Coasts made even less of an impression), have different priorities and views on how tax payers' money should be spent locally. Of course, they do benefit from these places through tourism and employment.
All water under the bridge now as far as Living Coasts is concerned. I have no axe to grind either for or against the Council. I just thought I'd remind myself of what was said at the time.
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
Staffing is by far the largest cost of any zoo.
44 staff at Living Coasts seems like quite a lot...?
With a rather large restaurant/café, and lots of behind the scenes research and maintenance staff, I'm not surprised.
Sausagefingers
Well-Known Member
With a rather large restaurant/café, and lots of behind the scenes research and maintenance staff, I'm not surprised.
Was there not a fairly large penguin patrol in the walk through? Several team checking interactions? Safety 1st
Sausagefingers
Well-Known Member
Ah makes sence, I remember seeing an article about the penguin patrol a few years ago. Didn't realise it was voluntary.
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
From the trust reports I have seen, LC needed continuous annual subsidy. Comments varied from it never being likely to be financially viable, to break-even being possible - largely resulting from visitor numbers varying between 100k and 120k. These numbers seem high enough for a relatively modest basically bird collection to be viable. As it wasnt, then recent falling numbers and the staff-loading stated, meant it was only a matter of time...With a rather large restaurant/café, and lots of behind the scenes research and maintenance staff, I'm not surprised.
It is very difficult to continuously live beyond your means, and you will always be vulnerable to your subsidy source being unable (or unwilling) to continue its 'help'.
Zoos are public educational facilities and therefore eligible for being subsidised to cover exploitation / operational costs. I do find it perplexing that the general thought is for profit where it serves the public interests.
Just my two cents of opinion and wisdom.
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
Maybe, but not in the UK. Unless run by a charity, all zoos are classed as being commercial and for profit; all pay huge levels of tax, business rates, VAT etc and are subject to legal and financial requirements over and above all their competitors in planning and licencing laws; and have to provide conservation and education facilities not required of their competitors ether - all out of the slim takings left after their gross income is taxed.
Which is why I think it is full of fallacies and there should be a support structure in place thru small and big Government.
NEVER gonna happen. Thatcher paid off the national collection (London) in a lump sum and they blew that immediately. In the exact same way that local councils have shut down aviaries and greenhouses in parks in Southampton and Portsmouth. I believe Bournemouths aviary is run by volunteers. They are just not going to pump money into animal collections.
And if they did the rules and regs would be ridiculous.
I remain amazed how many animal attractions remain open in the UK, given the size of the country. I do wonder if some collections being merged might be better overall, rather than piece meal and postage stamp.
It might cut down on the number of meerkat exhibits then!
Even so, seven meerkat exhibits is a lot of mouths to feed 
Andrew Swales
Well-Known Member
State intervention in our affairs is the last thing most zoos would be looking for. ZSL itself turned down the Government offer of equality with Kew Gardens, so were very fortunate to receive 'Thatcher's pay off'.
As I have said many times, all we ask for is to be allowed to use some more of the huge amounts of tax we pay, on what we are good at.
NEVER gonna happen, Merging is equally unlikely, and would require State intervention to force it on collections against their will - hardly the best motive for running any business.
I meant private interests merging collections to be a larger collective which could in theory reduce costs overall and be a better force for doing what zoos are supposed to do best-entertain, educate and breed endangered species.
Any number of postage stamp sized collections with farm animals, and the odd meerkat/ring tailed lemur could be replaced by something with more "worth".
I'm not out to put people out of business, but suggesting, in an ideal world, this would surely be better?
That is the reason I'm not too upset by Bristol consolidating their sites to produce a better collection overall on a bigger site (I hope).
I think London should do the same and move up to Whipsnade. (The cynic in me wonders how quickly the preservation orders on archaic exhibits would remain if there was no zoo any more).
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I thought you were referring to the Red River Hogs being put down? Apologies if I misunderstood!Even so, seven meerkat exhibits is a lot of mouths to feed
Last time I was at Marwell there were at least 3 on- show meerkat exhibits.
A major problem housing such a social species that breeds fast, has a constant power struggle for top of the social structure and the willingness to fight to a bloody end!
No, the fact that a few years ago Edinburgh got rid of a lot of species (which would theoretically save on food costs) but then brought in meerkats and ended up with them in a maximum of 7 exhibits.
Last I heard the number was now down to 3.