Parque Zoológico Municipal Quinzinho de Barros Black the Chimpanzee

Onychorhynchus coronatus

Onychorhynchus coronatus

Well-Known Member
David Matos Mendes said:
Yes. Do you remember that early this year, a female even escaped, and made a blast for those silly anti zoo freaks? Gosh, at those times, I saw one of the most unfear and ridiculous comments I had ever seen a celebrity make. Don't even like to remember.
Returning to the main issue, they nowadays keep this female (Kelly) and a male that came from Rio (Paulinho).
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Yes, I remember that they had chimps during that time and these escaping but I thought these were only temporary.

I know and saw how angry the team were when "Black" was forcibly removed and taken to Pedro's little sanctuary so perhaps this is just a conclusion to that.

I have to say though that I was really hoping that after "Black" the zoo would not consider keeping chimps again and would instead focus on the excellent collection of native primates they have.

They also have a new director there who is a primate specialist so that may have something to do with it too.
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Yes, I remember that they had chimps during that time and these escaping but I though these were only temporary.

I know and saw how angry the team were when "Black" was forcibly removed and taken to Pedro's little sanctuary so perhaps this is just a conclusion to that.

I have to say though that I was really hoping that after "Black" the zoo would not consider keeping chimps again and would instead focus on the excellent collection of native primates they have.
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Yes, I also thought these were temporary, but it seems they aren't. That "sanctuary" and their crazy diets killed "Black", and all I hope is that they no longer intromise in good zoos such as Sorocaba. As I mentioned with @Enzo in some thread I don't remember well, Brazil seems to be phasing out the chimps of our zoos, and although we (not you included :D:D) love them, they are not very usefull around here, as we never had programmes for them and it would cost a lot to develop one... Once chimps "phasing out program" seems to be a tendence, it surprises me a bit that Sorocaba acquires a couple of them, but I'm quite sure they won't breed these guys, and the species will probably be phased out when they die.
 
David Matos Mendes said:
Yes, I also thought these were temporary, but it seems they aren't. That "sanctuary" and their crazy diets killed "Black", and all I hope is that they no longer intromise in good zoos such as Sorocaba. As I mentioned with @Enzo in some thread I don't remember, Brazil seems to be phasing out the chimps of our zoos, and although we (not you included :D:D) love them, they are not very usefull around here, as we never had programmes for them and it would cost a lot to develop one...
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I have to be honest I am really disappointed that they decided to go back into keeping chimps and I don't think it is the best decision that they could have made.

That said, I know from personal experience working there that Sorocaba is an excellent zoo and I will always support them.
 
David Matos Mendes said:
Yes, I also thought these were temporary, but it seems they aren't. That "sanctuary" and their crazy diets killed "Black", and all I hope is that they no longer intromise in good zoos such as Sorocaba. As I mentioned with @Enzo in some thread I don't remember well, Brazil seems to be phasing out the chimps of our zoos, and although we (not you included :D:D) love them, they are not very usefull around here, as we never had programmes for them and it would cost a lot to develop one... Once chimps "phasing out program" seems to be a tendence, it surprises me a bit that Sorocaba acquires a couple of them, but I'm quite sure they won't breed these guys, and the species will probably be phased out when they die.
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Wait... double shock... "Black" is dead?
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
I have to be honest I am really disappointed that they decided to go back into keeping chimps and I don't think it is the best decision that they could have made.

That said, I know from personal experience working there that Sorocaba is an excellent zoo and I will always support them.
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Yes, I'm pretty sure they have a great crew, and I tend to think the keeping of this chimps was not like a wish from them, but probably a need for a shelter for these... But I don't know...
 
David Matos Mendes said:
Yes, I'm pretty sure they have a great crew, and I tend to think the keeping of this chimps was not like a wish from them, but probably a need for a shelter for these... But I don't know...
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I think it would have been probably a mixture of both of these incentives.

Pedro did not help matters, "Black" could have stayed at Sorocaba and have lived out the rest of his life peacefully instead of all of that agitation and stress and the zoo could have then phased out the species.

When Pedro created that social media storm of lies and kicked up all of that fuss and then strong armed his way into the zoo and took that chimp away I think what it did was just entrench the zoos attitude.

Perhaps they just though to themselves "**** it, lets get some more chimps" instead of the conclusion of phasing them out which is what I believe they would have eventually done had this not have happened..
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
I think it would have been probably a mixture of both of these incentives.

Pedro did not help matters, "Black" could have stayed at Sorocaba and have lived out the rest of his life peacefully instead of all of that agitation and stress and the zoo could have then phased out the species.

When Pedro created that social media storm of lies and kicked up all of that fuss and then strong armed his way into the zoo and took that chimp away I think what it did was just entrench the zoos attitude.

Perhaps they just though to themselves "**** it, lets get some more chimps" instead of the conclusion of phasing them out which is what I believe they would have eventually done had this not have happened..
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All this story leaves me deeply upset. See an individual such as this man and his institution having this authority in front of such a decent zoo as Sorocaba...

Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Well, I was never very keen on "Black" (or chimps in general) to tell you the truth but I'm really very shocked and sad about his death.

Poor old "Black".
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It's very sad, Indeed. Dying in the hands of those people, living in a different place, passing for all that...
 
David Matos Mendes said:
All this story leaves me deeply upset. See an individual such as this man and his institution having this authority in front of such a decent zoo as Sorocaba...


It's very sad, Indeed. Dying in the hands of those people, living in a different place, passing for all that...
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Not only does the Sorocaba "sanctuary" keep chimps, but they also hold other threatened animals, like siamangs and lions.
 
David Matos Mendes said:
All this story leaves me deeply upset. See an individual such as this man and his institution having this authority in front of such a decent zoo as Sorocaba...


It's very sad, Indeed. Dying in the hands of those people, living in a different place, passing for all that...
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Well I can't really say how "Black" was during his final months alive and whether his wellbeing was ok because I don't have any information on this so I'm not going to speculate about that but what I will say is that yes it was totally unnecessary what went on.

The sensible middle ground that should have been taken was not thanks to animal rights fanaticism and now both sides are even more entrenched in their positions.
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Well I can't really say how "Black" was during his final months alive and whether his wellbeing was ok because I don't have any information on this so I'm not going to speculate about that but what I will say is that yes it was totally unnecessary what went on.

The sensible middle ground that should have been taken was not thanks to animal rights fanaticism and now both sides are even more entrenched in their positions.
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Yes, I mentioned only that he was living in a place he wasn't used to. He was a very old individual at all, but this whole thing was very unnecessary indeed. We'll never know if it was really his "time" or if something influenced it...
 
David Matos Mendes said:
Yes, I mentioned only that he was living in a place he wasn't used to. He was a very old individual at all, but this whole thing was very unnecessary indeed. We'll never know if it was really his "time" or if something influenced it...
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Yep, he was definitely no spring chicken, but compared to some of the chimps in zoos around the world and how long lived they have been he wasn't exactly ancient either.

What was very sad to see was that just he became a pawn / chess piece for that particular activist and their social media campaigns and rhetoric and as I've said before animal rights activists are very good with engineering narratives popular with the masses.

What concerns me now is I really don't think that particular individual is going to give up with the new chimps either so I think what is just going to play out is a vicious circle and battle of attrition between activist and zoo (and the focus / energy and conversation should be going squarely into native primates like the muriquis and callitrichids and their conservation not on great apes).
 
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Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Yep, he was definitely no spring chicken, but compared to some of the chimps in zoos around the world and how long lived they have been he wasn't exactly ancient either.

What was very sad to see was that just he became a pawn / chess piece for that particular activist and their social media campaigns and rhetoric and as I've said before animal rights activists are very good with engineering narratives popular with the masses.

What concerns me now is I really don't think that particular individual is going to give up with the new chimps either so I think what is just going to play out is a vicious circle and battle of attrition between activist and zoo (and the focus / energy and conversation should be going squarely into native primates like the muriquis and callitrichids and their conservation not on great apes).
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Totally agree. This story will only increase the discussion and make things worse, but I still have hope that these people will be controled someday. They say Sorocaba has a bad structure and left the chimp escape? Haven't two chimps from their "sanctuary" escaped, entered a farm and atacked people in the past? The escape in Sorocaba zoo was nothing compared to the incident of this time...
 
Just one last comment on "Black".

As I said before I was never very keen on him because I don't really like chimpanzees as animals but I have to say that by chimp standards he was a comparatively good natured animal.

He was very loved by all of the staff at the zoo as he had been there a long time. He first arrived as an infant with his family in the mid to late 70' s (I think there were about four other chimpanzees that formed this group) after having been confiscated by a circus.

He had a very special bond / friendship with his keeper and this became even stronger when the other chimpanzees had passed away and "black" was the last surviving animal of this group. The two would play and sit quietly together with the keeper stroking the chimp and keeping him company. It reminded me very much of the bond between the lowland gorilla "Bantu" and his keeper at Chapultepec zoo in Mexico except "Black" unlike "Bantu" was more tolerant towards people other than his personal keeper approaching and grooming him (although his strongest friendship was always with his keeper).

From what I was told he had never been known to behave aggressively towards people (but everyone took precautions nevertheless as any animal is unpredictable) although he had been stubborn and mischievous when he was younger. I do remember him doing his aggressive "wraaaa wraaaa" calls and charging displays towards the male sacred baboon kept in the neighbouring enclosure though (which he absolutely hated and which is an exceptionally aggressive animal to both people and other animals). I also remember thinking that if the chimp and baboon had been able to get at eachother what would have transpired would have been a very bloody fight to the death (my money would have been on the baboon winning as it was a very frightening and hyper aggressive animal).

The closest I have ever physically been in proximity with a chimp was with this animal Sorocaba when I was invited by his keeper behind the scenes. I was as nervous of being close to the chimp as I would have been to a big cat but he did not show any aggressive behaviour towards my presence and just a bit of mild curiosity in my shoe laces and then disinterest.

Towards the end of his time at Sorocaba you would often see him either sitting in his hammock in the outdoor enclosure and watching the world go by (used to remind me of an elderly human in retirement) or at the back of the indoor enclosure where it was well shaded and there was a window with a vantage point through which he had a wider frame of view of one of the paths and the goings on of the staff.

Anyway that is what I remember about "black" and I'm sure the team at Sorocaba sorely miss him and I myself even if not a chimp fan find his passing quite sad.
 
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David Matos Mendes said:
I really like "Bicho Paulistano". Him and his group, "A liga animal" always spread great informations. I like that he left clear all the way the "activists" commanded by L**sa M*ll act with their protests. Very sad to hear more about the conditions of this place, wich we already imagined weren't good...
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Yeah he's an alright guy and I'm glad he weighed in on this issue.
 
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