Edinburgh Zoo Edinburgh Zoo News 2022

The stillborn in budongo is still there although it’s basically just a skeleton at this point. Keepers think some of the reasons it’s been so long are that in the wild there’s be more things to take it off the mother and they also noted she was one of the lab chimps, which they think is a possible influence. They’re starting to rotate the chimps between the two groups now so they hope that will help, she’s also fully integrated and socialising properly within the group now which is a good sign.
 
Another thing of note is the cassowary’s are currently living together with the doors open to both enclosures.
 
Jude T said:
The stillborn in budongo is still there although it’s basically just a skeleton at this point. Keepers think some of the reasons it’s been so long are that in the wild there’s be more things to take it off the mother and they also noted she was one of the lab chimps, which they think is a possible influence. They’re starting to rotate the chimps between the two groups now so they hope that will help, she’s also fully integrated and socialising properly within the group now which is a good sign.
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I’ve never heard of a female carrying a stillborn infant for that length of time. A few days or even a week are common. It definitely sounds as if her abnormal social background could be a contributing factor.

It’s not uncommon for females to enter estrus soon after the death of an infant, so she could easily be pregnant again assuming contraception wasn’t administered.
 
How long has the mother been carrying it? Is there some signs to warn visitors or educate them on it?
 
felis silvestris said:
She’s been carrying it for approx. 7 months and there’s a sign about if it may disturb some people and it says that it is their maternal instincts in the wild.
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This is very strange- to continue to allow her to carry it for this length of time without sedating her and removing it. Have never heard of a situation like this before- as Zoofan15 said, a few days or a week, yes, but months?- it must be rotten by now...
 
I saw this stillborn chimp on my visit at the end of December. At first I thought it was some banana peel or a piece of hessian sac but on closer inspection I saw it was the baby. I can't believe she still has it 4 months on. How long ago did she actually give birth
 
nczoofan said:
How long has the mother been carrying it?
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Keelan said:
How long ago did she actually give birth
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She gave birth September 2021.
Pertinax said:
This is very strange- to continue to allow her to carry it for this length of time without sedating her and removing it. Have never heard of a situation like this before- as Zoofan15 said, a few days or a week, yes, but months?- it must be rotten by now...
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I’d also question how healthy it is for the troop. Aside from the bacteria the decomposing body would attract, other females in the troop will be observing abnormal maternal behaviour; as well as reinforcing abnormal maternal behaviour in the mother - in that it’s an infant that’s never fed etc.
 
Pertinax said:
This is very strange- to continue to allow her to carry it for this length of time without sedating her and removing it. Have never heard of a situation like this before- as Zoofan15 said, a few days or a week, yes, but months?- it must be rotten by now...
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It is rather odd, I’ll be sure to ask a staff member some of these questions if I get the chance next time I’m up there as there has to be a reason. I spent a lot of time observing the chimps and the troop has quite a lot going on at the moment, with the reintroductions with the smaller group ongoing daily (different individuals each day) and the antics of young Velu (born 2014) who is troublesome but too quick for the older chimps (including the dominant male), his mother is in the other group to protect his younger sister, Masindi, from him.

Yes, the body is not looking particularly good at this point and many guests mistook it for a toy or food item.
 
Obviously this isn't me saying they should just remove the body because it grosses me out or anything, especially if it's not what's best for the mother chimp, but something about it is so uniquely and awfully fascinating that I really hope it goes away soon. I can't look at it without wanting to throw up but at the same time all I want to do is look at it
 
Jude T said:
It is rather odd, I’ll be sure to ask a staff member some of these questions if I get the chance next time I’m up there as there has to be a reason. I spent a lot of time observing the chimps and the troop has quite a lot going on at the moment, with the reintroductions with the smaller group ongoing daily (different individuals each day) and the antics of young Velu (born 2014) who is troublesome but too quick for the older chimps (including the dominant male), his mother is in the other group to protect his younger sister, Masindi, from him.

Yes, the body is not looking particularly good at this point and many guests mistook it for a toy or food item.
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A few decades ago it would have been removed to avoid upsetting the public; whereas now zoos routinely allow the mother to keep the infant to go through the grieving process, which typically lasts a few days. The zoo have done this, but this has gone beyond the grieving process and what they’re doing now is at best supporting the mother’s illusion she has an infant to care for; and at worst it’s detrimental for the well-being of the mother and the troop.
 
Zoofan15 said:
A few decades ago it would have been removed to avoid upsetting the public; whereas now zoos routinely allow the mother to keep the infant to go through the grieving process, which typically lasts a few days. The zoo have done this, but this has gone beyond the grieving process and what they’re doing now is at best supporting the mother’s illusion she has an infant to care for; and at worst it’s detrimental for the well-being of the mother and the troop.
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I did overhear some keepers discussing it and they seemed to be focusing on the fact that she was now at a stage where she was socialising and behaving completely normally within the group which would lead me to believe it is more a case of habit that she is carrying the infant now. One did mention that a previous stillborn in the group was snatched by a higher ranking female and destroyed shall we say. As I say this was a conversation between a keeper and another staff member that I overheard so perhaps take it with a pinch of salt.

What I can say for sure is that Lianne seemed to be spending half of her time on her own and the other half with the rest of the group. I noticed Velu giving her some grief a few times and it looked like he was trying to take the body from her but she was quickly aided by other individuals within the group.
 
Scottish Wildcat said:
Obviously this isn't me saying they should just remove the body because it grosses me out or anything, especially if it's not what's best for the mother chimp, but something about it is so uniquely and awfully fascinating that I really hope it goes away soon. I can't look at it without wanting to throw up but at the same time all I want to do is look at it
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It’s within our nature to have a fascination with such things and I was quite taken aback the first time I saw it. While it’s not particularly gory as such, it is rather strange to see such a human-like thing in that state.
 
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