I doubt they'd be announced publicly at this point, however, I can assure you the information is from a reliable source.
North American Asian Elephant Reproduction
- Thread starter Elephant Enthusiast
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I doubt they'd be announced publicly at this point, however, I can assure you the information is from a reliable source.
Ok, I have genuine questions about Tulsa speaking of Asian Elephant reproduction. The zoo has confirmed they want a multigenerational herd which the zoo currently does not have. What I do NOT understand is how is breeding going to work because I initially thought the zoo would be breeding their multigenerational herd with Sneezy their bull but according to @Mai Thai Sneezy has gone infertile and can no longer breed. So this means the zoo would have to bring in a new breeding bull right?
Oxley Family Elephant Experience and Elephant Preserve - Building Beyond
Oxley Family Elephant Experience and Elephant Preserve - Building Beyond
Im not sure how accurate that claim is, Sneezy has sired a calf as recently as 2011. I wouldn’t be surprised if Tulsa brings in some cows for breeding with Sneezy around the time the new habitat is ready to open.
Bulls cannot simply go from being fertile to being infertile...Sneezy's age may contribute to lower sperm production; but he would still be fertile.
So Groucho and Sneezy can still breed? Because @Mai Thai posted in the North American Asian Elephant Population 2022 thread that when he reached out to these zoos Denver and Tulsa they confirmed neither could breed. That’s good to know that they still can then.
See the below post from the population thread.
that’s ridiculous to lie about something that. Like breeding plans I get but why would a zoo lie about an animal that can no longer breed but still could? Groucho is at a bachelor facility anyway so at least naturally he couldn’t breed with any females there…
It is, but sometimes zoos don't like to share such plans. Why? We can only guess, but i'd assume it's just (in their view) simply not in our main interest to know. Plans change, and plans also backfire. And especially with popular animals like elephants; a zoo like Fort Worth would never tell you one of their females is pregnant prior to a public announcement even if that said female is.
It is, but sometimes zoos don't like to share such plans. Why? We can only guess, but i'd assume it's just (in their view) simply not in our main interest to know.
Plans change, and plans also backfire. And especially with popular animals like elephants; a zoo like Fort Worth would never tell you one of their females is pregnant prior to a public announcement even if that said female is.
I know that but there’s a difference between an animal that isn’t pregnant when it actually is versus an animal that physically isn’t able to breed when they actually can. It sounds like to me Tulsa and Denver didn’t have any idea what they were talking about when it came to Groucho and Sneezy because you said bulls simply cannot go infertile even though these zoos told @Mai Thai they did.
At the end of the day, however, we don't know whether or not they can breed or not. While @Jambo is true, and male senescence is rare overall amongst mammals, we don't know the medical history of these individuals. There could very well be a medical reason the individuals are infertile that we just aren't aware of, and that frankly, is none of our business.
but if a zoo is saying that an animal is infertile when they truly never can I still think is so silly to make up. You’re right it’s none of our business to know medical buisness but I never was even asking about medical business in the first place. I asked if Sneezy can’t breed, would that mean Tulsa would be bringing in a new breeding bull? I know the zoo wants a multigenerational herd but I had always thought Sneezy would be their breeding bull.
The zoos could just be putting the term 'infertile' out there in reference to the fact the bulls (in their eyes) are/will be non breeding.
Of course it's not the most precise term, but as a normal member of the general public asking such question they would simply go infertile = non breeding.
If the zoo simply said the individuals are 'non breeding', more questions would be asked as to why and quite frankly I don't think most zoos want to give out all of the information as to why.
There could a combination of reasons for all we know - but it's something we don't need to know.
Precisely.
Tulsa would need both new cows and a new bull if they wish to have a breeding group.
So then Sneezy can’t breed? That doesn’t make sense either cause I know he has before. The reason Sneezy isn’t breeding now is because he has no females to breed with that can have calves anyway is what I know. And again, I only was asking would Tulsa bring in a new bull considering they want a multigenerational breeding herd cause right now they have neither other than a potential breeding bull which would be Sneezy.
But they could legitimately be infertile is the part you aren't understanding. As @Jambo said, they can't just "go infertile", but that doesn't mean that a medical issue couldn't make them infertile, for instance certain types of cancers could make an individual go infertile. While I am not saying that these elephants specifically have cancer, I am saying that there is a legitimate possibility that the elephants are in fact infertile.
What? You just said Sneezy can still breed potentially. I know they ARE bringing in new cows because the zoo confirmed to me they are when I reach out to them and the zoo has stated they want a multigenerational herd which right now they don’t have. Now I’m just confused at this point about the bull.
the zoo confirmed to @Mai Thai that Sneezy did go infertile. That’s all I know and it is why I asked would that mean Tulsa would have to bring in a new breeding bull.
In the context of what I said, Tulsa may just simply be choosing not to breed Sneezy.
If Tulsa have said they will not be breeding from Sneezy, then we'd have to take their word for it. There's no reason why they can't import a new bull, is there?
Just to note, it’s already been well hashed out that Mai Tai was a user in their early teens, who would regularly over embellish and make up lies about various zoo related things. Anything that they posted on the forms should be taken with a tremendous grain of salt.