Perth Zoo New exotic mamal species for Perth Zoo? (Speculation)

[Zoofan15]

Really interesting thread, and I'm glad that talk has gravitated towards different feline species. Here are my two cents:

Clouded Leopards: A perfect fit for all the reasons various people have mentioned throughout the thread, but acknowledging the challenges they pose - especially if they are looking to breed them.

Snow Leopards: I will throw snow leopards into the ring! I realise that the climate isn't ideal and that they are not a South-East Asian species, but in this day and age climate control to make an exhibit cooler isn't that difficult for a zoo like Perth. If they really were interested then it would be possible.

The zoo already displays red panda and has apparently expressed interest in Indian rhinos. To my mind, any large, govt funded zoo in Australia that displays red pandas should really be able to display snow leopards - in fact I'd go as far as to say that snow leopards and red pandas pretty much make a small Himalayan precinct - especially if you throw in a few suitable birds, or get some Himalayn Tahr, Langurs or Macaques. If they don't want to do this, then that's fine - but considering how high profile and how endangered snow leopards are, I think that they really should be considered - especially since Melbourne have a proven breeding pair! Surely Perth could take the offspring if they breed again?

"Sri Lankan Leopards": Sri Lankan leopards are not even a species of animal! They are a Subspecies of Leopard. I'm amazed at how many people on the Australian section of Zoochat are so obsessed with them! Never mind the fact that they also don't fit in with the South-East Asian theme either...

I honestly can't see why any zoo would display a sub-species of an animal found throughout many parts of Africa and Asia instead of an endangered and high profile species such as the snow leopard. To put this into perspective, having been to Sri Lanka, I've seen leopards in the wild every single time I've been to Yala National Park - in fact I once saw 7 individuals there in a single day! I would trade every one of those sightings for one sighting of a wild snow leopard!

No issue with leopards (I actually love leopards), but pound for pound surely snow leopards (being more endangered and more high profile) give more bang for buck!

Golden Cats: Why would any zoo with the space and resources of Perth display smaller feline species when they could display larger ones instead? To the general public, golden cats aren't really that different from larger domestic cats. People would much prefer to see leopards, snow leopards or clouded leopards.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Sri Lankan leopards are wildly popular with forum members as they represent a return of leopards to the region. Bar the elderly male at a privately owned wildlife park in NZ (likely a generic), there was no leopards in the region following the phase out the Persian subspecies. Historically, Indian leopards were common in our region’s zoos, but these too are now gone. We’re so used to seeing species phased out, it was exciting to see leopards make a come back.

From a conservation perspective, Sri Lankan leopard are Endangered; Snow leopard are Vulnerable. Throw in their respective suitabilities to the Australian climate and it’s obvious why some facilities favour the former. Yes, the climate can be remediated, but that’s all added expense. Whether that in turn is balanced out by visitor interest is arguable and I agree there’s few species that match the allure of a Snow leopard.

I for one am looking forward to seeing Wellington Zoo exhibit Snow leopard, Nepalese red panda and Himalayan monal in the near future and would love to see a combination of Himalayan species at Perth. Australasian zoos focus heavily on South East Asia precincts, there’s surely scope for a South Asian precinct as a point of difference.

 

[Grant Rhino]

I for one am looking forward to seeing Wellington Zoo exhibit Snow leopard, Nepalese red panda and Himalayan monal in the near future and would love to see a combination of Himalayan species at Perth. Australasian zoos focus heavily on South East Asia precincts, there’s surely scope for a South Asian precinct as a point of difference.

As soon as Asha and Manju have settled in and are consistently on display, I'm buying air tickets and heading over to see them in their new home! I've already got the pink tote bag (from Wellington Zoo) with them on it!

The Wellington Himalayan precinct you mentioned is absolute proof that a Himalayan section is a viable option and should seriously be considered!

 

[steveroberts]

@Grant Rhino

Yeah thanks Grant. I agree with some parts of what you're saying, on a couple of others have a bit of a different opinion mindset.

Leopards are a widespread species and I'm a firm believer that there should be a myriad of zoos over the world (there's enough accredited zoos now, not as many as would personally like...but a lot nevertheless). I believe as has been common practice over the last ~45 years that there should be specific co-operative breeding programs that manage them on subspecies level (ie African, Arabian, Persian, Indian, Sri Lankan, Amur, Javan and Indochinese) that's just my opinion but feel strongly about it.

Also think the same thing with Tigers and their broad range and all five remaining subspecies are all endangered and or critically endangered. Better to save on a subspecies level as nature has dictated they become. But believe there should be rescue centres for animals of mixed origins.

There are other species that am less stickler-ish about subspecies crossing..but think there's a fair few like Leopards and Tigers where that's the best approach in ex-situ conservation.

Have never intended to refer to Sri Lankan Leopards as a species as have always known they are of course a subspecies and have known for 25 years. Plenty of subspecies gets mentioned on these forums and as we're all animal intellectuals dont necessarily have to add a bracket reminding are talking about a subspecies here and there but sometimes might be misinterpreted as that is what a subspecies is being spoken about like.

Yeah a lot of visitors like the biggest species of felids. But much like Servals and Caracals the Temminick's Golden Cat is an exceptionally impressive sizes smaller wild felid that is strikingly beautiful and captivates the public on the days it is less illusive in their exhibits and appear in view of visitors. Believe there are some smaller felids that are actually appreciated by a lot of the general public: Golden Cats, Fishing Cats, Pallas Cats/Manual, Leopard Cats, Jaguarundis, Caracals and Serval to name some (personally think Clouded Leopards, Lynxes, Bobcats and Ocelots are moreso in a medium sized wild felid category). Even Sand Cats and Rusty-Spotted Cats are in their own charismatic category for being so small that actually being more miniature than the average per domestic house cat may in fact intrigue visitors in an different way to the awe of big felids.

ps enjoy your posts and knowledge and thoughts btw, not intended as a snarky reply, just wanted to offer a varying opinion.

 

[Grant Rhino]

@Grant Rhino

Yeah thanks Grant. I agree with some parts of what you're saying, on a couple of others have a bit of a different opinion mindset.

Leopards are a widespread species and I'm a firm believer that there should be a myriad of zoos over the world (there's enough accredited zoos now, not as many as would personally like...but a lot nevertheless). I believe as has been common practice over the last ~45 years that there should be specific co-operative breeding programs that manage them on subspecies level (ie African, Arabian, Persian, Indian, Sri Lankan, Amur, Javan and Indochinese) that's just my opinion but feel strongly about it.

Also think the same thing with Tigers and their broad range and all five remaining subspecies are all endangered and or critically endangered. Better to save on a subspecies level as nature has dictated they become. But believe there should be rescue centres for animals of mixed origins.

There are other species that am less stickler-ish about subspecies crossing..but think there's a fair few like Leopards and Tigers where that's the best approach in ex-situ conservation.

Have never intended to refer to Sri Lankan Leopards as a species as have always known they are of course a subspecies and have known for 25 years. Plenty of subspecies gets mentioned on these forums and as we're all animal intellectuals dont necessarily have to add a bracket reminding are talking about a subspecies here and there but sometimes might be misinterpreted as that is what a subspecies is being spoken about like.

Yeah a lot of visitors like the biggest species of felids. But much like Servals and Caracals the Temminick's Golden Cat is an exceptionally impressive sizes smaller wild felid that is strikingly beautiful and captivates the public on the days it is less illusive in their exhibits and appear in view of visitors. Believe there are some smaller felids that are actually appreciated by a lot of the general public: Golden Cats, Fishing Cats, Pallas Cats/Manual, Leopard Cats, Jaguarundis, Caracals and Serval to name some (personally think Clouded Leopards, Lynxes, Bobcats and Ocelots are moreso in a medium sized wild felid category). Even Sand Cats and Rusty-Spotted Cats are in their own charismatic category for being so small that actually being more miniature than the average per domestic house cat may in fact intrigue visitors in an different way to the awe of big felids.

ps enjoy your posts and knowledge and thoughts btw, not intended as a snarky reply, just wanted to offer a varying opinion.

No issue at all - I never read that as a snarky reply I totally respect differing and varying opinions

And I agree that there is certainly a place for small cats in zoos - who doesn't love cats? I personally really love Pallas' Cats.

 

[Zoofan15]

No issue at all - I never read that as a snarky reply I totally respect differing and varying opinions

And I agree that there is certainly a place for small cats in zoos - who doesn't love cats? I personally really love Pallas' Cats.

Two of my favourites among the small cats are the Temminck’s golden cat and the Leopard cat. Neither are crowd pullers and it’s amazing how well the former can hide given it’s size - which mean the average visitor will find it an uninspiring exhibit. I saw them at the Singapore Zoo Night Safari, which offered a close up view of this crespecular speices.

The Serval and the Caracal on the other hand are bordering on enabling. Wellington’s individuals have always been highly active on my visits and attract reasonable crowds. They’re confident felids that clearly have no issue with being on display. I’ll note their Serval are handraised, but mother raised Serval at other zoos have behaved similar.

 

[steveroberts]

No issue at all - I never read that as a snarky reply I totally respect differing and varying opinions

And I agree that there is certainly a place for small cats in zoos - who doesn't love cats? I personally really love Pallas' Cats.

@Grant Rhino
Oh cool, yeah me too man (my stupid autocorrect algorithm changed manul their alternate name on the post above to 'manual' lol)

@Zoofan15

Yeah Serval do really seem to be the most showy and confident of all the smaller felids hey, and their particularly long legs give them an especially larger kind of look to them, definitely on the larger side of smaller felids. Have never been fortunate to see a Caracal in person but was curious if in your experience they were showy and confident too?

That's so cool about Singapore Night Zoo, the species there seem amazing. Apparently Perth Zoo's Striped Hyena pair were amongst the original Striped Hyenas at the Night Zoo. Think they were flown there from Perth just as the 1.2 Spotted Hyenas Annie, Ferret and Vinnie were arriving in Perth from California in Aug '91.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15

Yeah Serval do really seem to be the most showy and confident of all the smaller felids hey, and their particularly long legs give them an especially larger kind of look to them, definitely on the larger side of smaller felids. Have never been fortunate to see a Caracal in person but was curious if in your experience they were showy and confident too?

That's so cool about Singapore Night Zoo, the species there seem amazing. Apparently Perth Zoo's Striped Hyena pair were amongst the original Striped Hyenas at the Night Zoo. Think they were flown there from Perth just as the 1.2 Spotted Hyenas Annie, Ferret and Vinnie were arriving in Perth from California in Aug '91.

The Caracal pair I saw at Wellington Zoo were the most active felids I’ve seen in any zoo. They were on the go the whole time I was there, exploring every inch of the exhibit. I would actually rate them more active than Serval, though I’ve also seen them active at every zoo I’ve visited that’s held them.

 

[steveroberts]

@Grant Rhino

Hey just to provide an example that think does kind of underline your point with what appeals to the majority of visitors in terms of felids and the general crowd appeal of larger ones versus the smaller species:

In the last 40 years Perth Zoo has had two smaller felids residents.

*Mungo the male Serval who arrived at Perth Zoo from Taronga in 1985 aged 2 and died in March 2003 aged nearly 20 and spent 17&half years at PZ (sorry you guys don't need help doing the maths lol, just am impressed with his time record). He lived in an exhibit in the Lesser Primates complex from 1985-1996 (surprised his presence didn't distress the Pygmy Marmosets, Common Marmosets or Red-Handed Tamarins who's wire fronted enclosures faced his wire fronted enclosure). Then he moved to a mock rock and glass fronted exhibit in the Savannah precinct for his last six-seven years (resident Meerkats in the exhibit next door were soon moved after one tunneled its way into Minho's exhibit and was made into a meal by Mungo) on the whole would say Mungo had medium range crowd appeal, I personally was very fond of him and my grandmother was as she remembers seeing a wild Serval growing up in Zimbabwe so was one of the rarer visitors of the era who didn't need to check his sign post to see what species he was. (in video footage shared on youtube of a 1991 visit to PZ you can see Mungo resting in his first exhibit in the LP complex and hear a kid call out ''it's a Leopard'' lol).

*a male Fishing Cat (possibly Berenang from Taronga though had read somewhere they received a Fishing Cat from Adelaide Zoo). Arrived at Perth Zoo sometime in mid 2004 (public display from 1 October 2004) in what is now Raja the Komodo Dragon's exhibit. He (the Fishing Cat) died in either 2008 or 2009. Perth Zoo took to identifying him as an 'Asian Fishing Cat' (lol they are an exclusively Asian species as we all know so found the naming slightly funny). On the whole would say he probably did not capture the general public's interest very much. On the other hand I think Taronga has done quite well with this species and have succeeded in giving their individual Fishing Cats an (arguably) medium level range of interest to visitors (success with birthing kittens has helped with that think probably) you're so right Zoofan15, that it is impressive Fiddle had kittens in the old complex so close to Temmick's Golden Cats next door (one of whom like you mentioned previously attacked poor Fiddle through the wire resulting in a leg amputation, I wonder which Golden Cat that was? Was surprised to hear that could happen in that complex as thought there still were dividing walls between not just wires).
*side note: Perth Zoo has not held any other smaller felids since the male Fishing Cat died 14 years ago, and since their last Cheetah 0.1 Kifani died in April 2015 have only kept two felid species (Sumatran) Tiger and (African) Lion.

 

[Grant Rhino]

@Grant Rhino

Hey just to provide an example that think does kind of underline your point with what appeals to the majority of visitors in terms of felids and the general crowd appeal of larger ones versus the smaller species:

In the last 40 years Perth Zoo has had two smaller felids residents.

*Mungo the male Serval who arrived at Perth Zoo from Taronga in 1985 aged 2 and died in March 2003 aged nearly 20 and spent 17&half years at PZ (sorry you guys don't need help doing the maths lol, just am impressed with his time record). He lived in an exhibit in the Lesser Primates complex from 1985-1996 (surprised his presence didn't distress the Pygmy Marmosets, Common Marmosets or Red-Handed Tamarins who's wire fronted enclosures faced his wire fronted enclosure). Then he moved to a mock rock and glass fronted exhibit in the Savannah precinct for his last six-seven years (resident Meerkats in the exhibit next door were soon moved after one tunneled its way into Minho's exhibit and was made into a meal by Mungo) on the whole would say Mungo had medium range crowd appeal, I personally was very fond of him and my grandmother was as she remembers seeing a wild Serval growing up in Zimbabwe so was one of the rarer visitors of the era who didn't need to check his sign post to see what species he was. (in video footage shared on youtube of a 1991 visit to PZ you can see Mungo resting in his first exhibit in the LP complex and hear a kid call out ''it's a Leopard'' lol).

*a male Fishing Cat (possibly Berenang from Taronga though had read somewhere they received a Fishing Cat from Adelaide Zoo). Arrived at Perth Zoo sometime in mid 2004 (public display from 1 October 2004) in what is now Raja the Komodo Dragon's exhibit. He (the Fishing Cat) died in either 2008 or 2009. Perth Zoo took to identifying him as an 'Asian Fishing Cat' (lol they are an exclusively Asian species as we all know so found the naming slightly funny). On the whole would say he probably did not capture the general public's interest very much. On the other hand I think Taronga has done quite well with this species and have succeeded in giving their individual Fishing Cats an (arguably) medium level range of interest to visitors (success with birthing kittens has helped with that think probably) you're so right Zoofan15, that it is impressive Fiddle had kittens in the old complex so close to Temmick's Golden Cats next door (one of whom like you mentioned previously attacked poor Fiddle through the wire resulting in a leg amputation, I wonder which Golden Cat that was? Was surprised to hear that could happen in that complex as thought there still were dividing walls between not just wires).
*side note: Perth Zoo has not held any other smaller felids since the male Fishing Cat died 14 years ago, and since their last Cheetah 0.1 Kifani died in April 2015 have only kept two felid species (Sumatran) Tiger and (African) Lion.

Yeah - that's a fair point. I think I've probably underestimated the small cats by comparing them too much to the big cats, rather than looking at them on their own merits and focusing on their own individual strengths and assets. I think I've probably looked too much at what they don't have and not enough about what they do have.

 

[steveroberts]

@Grant Rhino

It's definitely pretty much a fact that the big cats will always be the biggest crowd pullers. I just like that a lot of larger zoos opt to have several smaller felids too for those of us who love seeing the non A-Z household name familiar animal species. Well I say larger zoos but in our region at present it's the smaller private zoos who are at the forefront of the smaller felid keeping and displaying in the last decade (credit to some big zoo examples like how Taronga still has Fishing Cats, I guess they forked out enough money building a specific exhibit for them in their Wild Asia/Rainforest Trail precinct to give up on them that easily thank goodness).

One of our ZC amigos mentioned that Temmick's Golden Cats make a good alternative at some zoos to Pumas/Cougars..sort of like a smaller tropical Asian version of them. Definitely love Pumas to bits too and are immediately striking and beautiful. Just weighing up that Golden Cats come with a slightly more threatened in the wild tag too than Pumas presently, save for the Florida subspecies. In Tarongas case I think when they took their Pumas off display in 1989 or 1990 (and sent to a budding Mogo Zoo a couple of years later) it was like their absence was filled first by the arrival of their Snow Leopards, but then also (arguably/imo) to a certain extent by the Golden Cats arriving shortly after.

Ideally I wish more zoos had a felid collection in the double digits of species like Melbourne Zoo had in recent decades, but know the reality is more like 3-8 (well a zoo with more than 4 species at present is still impressive in the current era). DDZ and 'Canberra' Zoo take the gold medal for number of felid species in Aus' zoos at present I think (perhaps Tasmania Zoo too especially since they received their Snow Leopard, Caracal etc).

 

[Grant Rhino]

@Grant Rhino

Ideally I wish more zoos had a felid collection in the double digits of species like Melbourne Zoo had in recent decades, but know the reality is more like 3-8 (well a zoo with more than 4 species at present is still impressive in the current era). DDZ and 'Canberra' Zoo take the gold medal for number of felid species in Aus' zoos at present I think (perhaps Tasmania Zoo too especially since they received their Snow Leopard, Caracal etc).

I appreciate that people may want to see more species, but the most important factor to me is that they are displayed well:

The 'Small Cat Alley' section at Melbourne Zoo was a great exhibit at the time (as was the Big Cat Alley), but I don't think that same exhibit would be good enough these days. There simply wasn't enough space for the cats.

Animal welfare is extremely important to me, and I firmly believe that a bad exhibit is not only bad for the animals in it,but is also a very bad look for the zoo itself (and even for zoos in general). Bad zoo exhibits simply give the AR crowd more ammunition.

I can't comment on DDZ - as I've never been there.

National Zoo (Canberra) displays 4 (lion, tiger, leopard, serval) but more importantly they display them well - in large appropriate enclosures. That is a tick from me.

I'm more sceptical about Tasmania Zoo though: I've been once (in around 2013 or thereabouts) and I honestly didn't like it. I felt that far too many of the enclosures were totally unacceptable for the species in them. Some examples included Mandrill, Gibbon, and Sulwesi Crested Macaque to name a few. That was roughly ten years ago, so I understand that things may have changed quite a bit since then - but from what I read on Zoochat, this zoo is accumulating a lot of new species, and I am really curious / skeptical / concerned that they don't have the money or resources to display them in an acceptable manner. I honestly hope that I'm wrong and that my concerns are unfounded - but I can only go by my one visit there.

That said, I am hoping to get back there soon and see it for myself. Ten years is a long time, and I'm happy to have a new, positive view of the place if I see it again.

Back to the topic though: If a zoo has the money, space and means to display a small cat species in an appropriate and beautiful enclosure then I will support it by all means!

 

[Zoofan15]

*a male Fishing Cat (possibly Berenang from Taronga though had read somewhere they received a Fishing Cat from Adelaide Zoo). Arrived at Perth Zoo sometime in mid 2004 (public display from 1 October 2004) in what is now Raja the Komodo Dragon's exhibit. He (the Fishing Cat) died in either 2008 or 2009. Perth Zoo took to identifying him as an 'Asian Fishing Cat' (lol they are an exclusively Asian species as we all know so found the naming slightly funny). On the whole would say he probably did not capture the general public's interest very much. On the other hand I think Taronga has done quite well with this species and have succeeded in giving their individual Fishing Cats an (arguably) medium level range of interest to visitors (success with birthing kittens has helped with that think probably) you're so right Zoofan15, that it is impressive Fiddle had kittens in the old complex so close to Temmick's Golden Cats next door (one of whom like you mentioned previously attacked poor Fiddle through the wire resulting in a leg amputation, I wonder which Golden Cat that was? Was surprised to hear that could happen in that complex as thought there still were dividing walls between not just wires).
*side note: Perth Zoo has not held any other smaller felids since the male Fishing Cat died 14 years ago, and since their last Cheetah 0.1 Kifani died in April 2015 have only kept two felid species (Sumatran) Tiger and (African) Lion.

Perth Zoo has only ever held one Fishing cat (the male you mention). His name was Wayan and he was born 24/11/1997 at Melbourne Zoo. He transferred along with his brother (Jharna) to Adelaide Zoo in 2000; before transferring to Perth Zoo 27/07/2004. He died at Perth Zoo 12/08/2008 and they have not held the species since.

It’s difficult to say which Temminck’s golden cat attacked Fiddle, especially not knowing what year it occurred. Nugi, who was there from 1992 to 2002 is a strong possibility. His brother, Hari, also lived at Taronga Zoo from 1992 to 2000. He was noted to be unusually placid for a male of his species (when introduced to Auckland’s female), though I doubt that would extend to turning down an opportunity to attack a smaller felid.

 

[steveroberts]

@Zoofan15

Ok cool have a name and date on the Fishing Cat. Poor Wayan did not live as long as some of his fellow Fishing Cats can live to. His exhibit remained empty afaik until Raja the Komodo arrived in 2013.

Interestingly he'd been at Perth Zoo over two months before he went on public display.

Ok yes was an email from Perth Zoo who mentioned they had a male Fishing Cat who came from Adelaide Zoo (they didn't share any details to me beyond that, think they've seen how much have posted on ZC in the past lol, or that could just be a mistaken assumption I've made that anyone at PZ even keeps tabs on this site).

Edit: Apologies, on 21 June 2021 emailed to myself an article of zoo news from the waybackmachine archived version of the Perth Zoo website thar was publish 01/10/04 that names Wayan and his coming from Adelaide, forgot about that. I know those two refurbished ex-Bear exhibits would of debuted publicly on Friday 1 October 2004 or a day or so after (mentions the Crested Macs including young Indah entered that exhibit that morning) as happened to be in Perth at the time and visited on Thursday September 30, 2004 and was not open yet (but was a sign blocking the entries naming the species).

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15

Ok cool have a name and date on the Fishing Cat. Poor Wayan did not live as long as some of his fellow Fishing Cats can live to. His exhibit remained empty afaik until Raja the Komodo arrived in 2013.

Interestingly he'd been at Perth Zoo over two months before he went on public display.

Ok yes was an email from Perth Zoo who mentioned they had a male Fishing Cat who came from Adelaide Zoo (they didn't share any details to me beyond that, think they've seen how much have posted on ZC in the past lol, or that could just be a mistaken assumption I've made that anyone at PZ even keeps tabs on this site).

Edit: Apologies, on 21 June 2021 emailed to myself an article of zoo news from the waybackmachine archived version of the Perth Zoo website thar was publish 01/10/04 that names Wayan and his coming from Adelaide, forgot about that. I know those two refurbished ex-Bear exhibits would of debuted publicly on Friday 1 October 2004 or a day or so after (mentions the Crested Macs including young Indah entered that exhibit that morning) as happened to be in Perth at the time and visited on Thursday September 30, 2004 and was not open yet (but was a sign blocking the entries naming the species).

Yes, it appears only Taronga and Melbourne ever bred Fishing cat. The former bred only one litter of 1.1 in 2002, while Melbourne bred multiple litters. They presumably achieved this success via off display exhibits like those used for their Temminck’s golden cat.

Melbourne breeding Fishing cat coincided with the death of their elderly female Temminck’s golden cat in 1997 and their breeding male in 1998, which would have freed up space.

Perth and Adelaide were apparently happy to hold non breeding males rather than import female Fishing cats and attempt to breed, which is a shame.

 

[steveroberts]

@Zoofan15

Thanks for the info bruv, yeah that makes sense with Cassandra's passing in 1997 (great innings at 20 years old for a Golden Cat she achieved, and her daughter Cim with similar impressive longevity). Was it Mike Brocklehurst who wrote the insightful paper on breeding Temminick's Golden Cats at Melbourne Zoo? remember being so surprised when read how little space they needed to keep the mating pair in off-display when read the article in 2020 after you mentioned it.

It's a shame that quite honestly don't really think Perth Zoo will ever really consider holding Fishing Cats again (let alone a breeding pair). But wonder if perhaps Adelaide Zoo may in fact be open to having them again (and possibly be open to the idea orb trying to hold a breeding pair too? for now it's good they are planning for Snow Leopards.)

Am hoping Perth Zoo truly is receptive in the future though to keeping a third wild felid species again..but their new masterplan makes no mention of any indication of doing so which think is a real shame. Yes they're a smaller city zoo, but do have some extra space to work with still, not much..but enough for one or two medium sized new species if they ever changed their minds.

(Edit: PZ may feel am overly critical of their directives which can understand..but comes from a place of love for that zoo, and a deep desire to see it reach its full potential).

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15

Thanks for the info bruv, yeah that makes sense with Cassandra's passing in 1997 (great innings at 20 years old for a Golden Cat she achieved, and her daughter Cim with similar impressive longevity). Was it Mike Brocklehurst who wrote the insightful paper on breeding Temminick's Golden Cats at Melbourne Zoo? remember being so surprised when read how little space they needed to keep the mating pair in off-display when read the article in 2020 after you mentioned it.

It's a shame that quite honestly don't really think Perth Zoo will ever really consider holding Fishing Cats again (let alone a breeding pair). But wonder if perhaps Adelaide Zoo may in fact be open to having them again (and possibly be open to the idea orb trying to hold a breeding pair too? for now it's good they are planning for Snow Leopards.)

Am hoping Perth Zoo truly is receptive in the future though to keeping a third wild felid species again..but their new masterplan makes no mention of any indication of doing so which think is a real shame. Yes they're a smaller city zoo, but do have some extra space to work with still, not much..but enough for one or two medium sized new species if they ever changed their minds.

(Edit: PZ may feel am overly critical of their directives which can understand..but comes from a place of love for that zoo, and a deep desire to see it reach its full potential).

Yes, Mike Brocklehurst wrote that excellent paper. It was a great way to share husbandry advice, which though based on commonsense, had otherwise been ignored by many other zoos trying to breed golden cats. I’m glad when Auckland Zoo imported a young female from Singapore a few years later, they had the sense to follow this advice and subsequently bred four litters.

Perth Zoo need to be realistic about what felid species they can accomodate. They’re not a huge zoo, so Clouded leopard and Fishing cat are both great choices. Cheetah were always a poor choice and it’s no surprise they don’t plan to house them in the future. They’ve made the space to house lions and tigers (a wise decision given their popularity); but don’t realistically have the space to breed the latter.

If Perth can accomodate Snow leopard or Sri Lankan leopard, I’d urge them to make this work. Snow leopard alone would be a greater drawcard than every ungulate they currently exhibit combined.

 

[Zorro]

Yes, Mike Brocklehurst wrote that excellent paper. It was a great way to share husbandry advice, which though based on commonsense, had otherwise been ignored by many other zoos trying to breed golden cats. I’m glad when Auckland Zoo imported a young female from Singapore a few years later, they had the sense to follow this advice and subsequently bred four litters.

Perth Zoo need to be realistic about what felid species they can accomodate. They’re not a huge zoo, so Clouded leopard and Fishing cat are both great choices. Cheetah were always a poor choice and it’s no surprise they don’t plan to house them in the future. They’ve made the space to house lions and tigers (a wise decision given their popularity); but don’t realistically have the space to breed the latter.

If Perth can accomodate Snow leopard or Sri Lankan leopard, I’d urge them to make this work. Snow leopard alone would be a greater drawcard than every ungulate they currently exhibit combined.

The biggest drawback for them is not having an open range zoo like the other states!

 

[Zoofan15]

The biggest drawback for them is not having an open range zoo like the other states!

Agreed. It would be of great benefit to transfer out the giraffes and rhinos. The former have a decent sized exhibit at Perth, which otherwise could have accommodated several smaller species. Giraffes are nice, but they’re not crowd pullers on the level of great apes or large carnivores; and a larger herd could be held at an open range zoo.

 

[steveroberts]

@Zorro @Zoofan15

Have long hatched big ideas about if had multi millions of dollars to create a secondary zoo near Perth that is open range; and while not owned by the same board like Werribee with Melbourne, Monarto with Adelaide or WP with Taronga, it would be sort of like how Sydney Zoo was setup as a secondary zoo in greater Sydney to Dubbo, but not in competition with Perth Zoo the way Sydney Zoo is with Taronga; think more along the lines of Altina or Orana.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zorro @Zoofan15

Have long hatched big ideas about if had multi millions of dollars to create a secondary zoo near Perth that is open range; and while not owned by the same board like Werribee with Melbourne, Monarto with Adelaide or WP with Taronga, it would be sort of like how Sydney Zoo was setup as a secondary zoo in greater Sydney to Dubbo, but not in competition with Perth Zoo the way Sydney Zoo is with Taronga; think more along the lines of Altina or Orana.

Even if they didn’t come under the same board, I’d hope the two zoos would work together. Perth Zoo isn’t suited to holding large ungulates, so an acceptance these would be better off held at the open range zoo would serve them well; as well as allowing Perth to exhibit species that wouldn’t be held at the open range zoo e.g Clouded leopard.

The three sister zoos of Australia’s open range zoos all hold lions, which is one of the few double ups I’d expect to see. The general public have expectations about what constitutes a zoo and they’d be foolish to think nobody would notice their absence. Giraffes are arguably in the same category, though my opinion is they take up too much space in a city zoo.