Some members on here can tend to say things that aren’t entirely truthful and are solely based on individual opinion.
North American Asian and African Elephant Populations: Discussion and Speculation
- Thread starter IndianRhino
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Cows can conceive into their late 40’s and 50’s, so it was never really ‘highly unlikely’ imo. The birth gap (from her last calf) is on the higher end, but was still feasible. She conceived just a decade after her last calf.
I personally think it was worth the go to AI her at her age. She’s a valuable female, and only has one son who’s not yet proven himself as a breeder. The concerns would’ve surrounded her having a birth at her age, but cows in the wild mother into their 40’s and there’s multiple cases of cows in captivity who have successfully done so too without any issues.
I think the main concern here would not just be her age but her birthing interval. As stated her last calf was 10 years ago whereas cows in the wild her age would have more regular intervals between calves of 2-4 years.
That being said, no one except her keepers and veterinarians know her reproductive health. If at her age she was deemed healthy enough to undergo no only the AI itself, but healthy enough to carry a calf to term and survive the birthing process then why not. No vet, keeper, or decent human would jeopardize an animals health for the sake of having a baby.
I don’t think it was ever about her reproductive health, the facility that supplied the Sperm @PSO had said their was bad blood between them and the Toledo Zoo in addition had also said he was told that the zoo wouldn’t pay for another insemination.
I don't think Toledo have announced who the father of the calf is though? And I don't think money would be a factor there.
Another reason why Toldeo would've been keen to get Ranee pregnant is for her social needs too. She's kept separately from Twiggy, and it would be best for her to have a calf (not only for genetics) but for companionship as well.
Money and bad blood were absolutely factors when I first made my statements. I am also interested who they received the semen from. And this is complete speculation @John Marchwick but getting her pregnant would be a stop gap to figure out what Toledo ultimately wants to do with elephants.
If bad blood was a factor than obviously it seems Toledo has managed to find a new suitor?
Breeding Renee again seems to indicate Toledo are still interested in maintaining the species. If Renee births a daughter, the herd could probably be carried on through her daughter down the line (if Toledo are still interested in elephants). I imagine that’s the goal.
Toledo Zoo facebook page already announced the father, Renee is pregnant via AI. Titan at Sedgewick County Zoo in Wichita Kansas is the father.
That would be exciting if so as Titan's also an equally valuable male.
Is there a link?
I must admit, this is rather interesting news for me that Titan is a potential or confirmed father of two separate AI pregnancies. He’s very much on the young side, and looking at photos of him, even recent ones, he’s a fairly small elephant still, and presents the look of a juvenile animal. The fact he was fertile enough to provide viable semen samples also 2 years ago honestly blows my mind.
Honestly it’s probably the reason why Sedgwick hasn’t had any pregnancies yet either. Titan is obviously fertile, he’s probably just too small to actually breed the cows, lol. (And I’m only half joking about that one).
Honestly it’s probably the reason why Sedgwick hasn’t had any pregnancies yet either. Titan is obviously fertile, he’s probably just too small to actually breed the cows, lol. (And I’m only half joking about that one).
Isn’t the breeding bull at Sedgwick County Zoo Ajani? Im kind of surprised he hasn’t had any calves yet however he might this year for all we know.
Ajani is an older bull who lives at Sedgwick, yes, but thus far, he has not become their “breeding bull”.
Not yet anyway unfortunately. Hasn’t been the issue their though with Ajani meaning that he kind of had a poor upbringing as I think remember hearing he might be a non behavioral breeding bull.
No, his upbringing was fine. He lived at Indianapolis from birth up until he was 11 years old, before he was transferred into bachelor holding at Birmingham for seven years, before going to Sedgwick in 2018. By all accounts, he *should* make for an excellent breeder. If what I’ve heard was true, they were successful in collecting semen samples from him at one point or another in the past, so he’s obviously fertile as well.
Despite what should’ve been a fairly ideal upbringing, some bulls simply don’t have the knack for natural breeding. Or it could even be the cows at Sedgwick, or just some assorted combination of the animals as well.
Despite what should’ve been a fairly ideal upbringing, some bulls simply don’t have the knack for natural breeding. Or it could even be the cows at Sedgwick, or just some assorted combination of the animals as well.
I see. Well, hopefully they are successful with breeding sooner than later. For all we know the 2 other African Elephants that are due in 2023 could very well be at Sedgwick.
Titan would be about 13/14 years old now, so it's not surprising to see he was able to provide viable semen two years ago. Gung a bull in Australia, conceived naturally for the first time at the age of seven, and I'm sure there's other bulls out there who've done the same.
I agree, Titan is quite a small animal, and that can obviously mean he can't reach some of the taller girls; which is probably why he's been used for AI in the meantime. But the girls (besides his mother) are around his age; so should be smaller animals too. In saying that, Titan should be able to reach the girls at least by now.
I'm assuming Sedgewick may have been waiting for their younger girls to reach amiable age for a first time calf (which would be about now). Titan obviously can't breed with his mother, but perhaps she's been grouped with Ajani without any success as of yet.