I gather that having a cage-like appearance is considered a drawback. Interestingly enough, early plans for Taronga's current lion exhibit imply that the glass viewing bay would have originally been meshed, and constructed further to the west, to give the impression of the humans being caged. While there can be glare at times in photos, I much prefer the finished product.
Taronga Zoo Future of Taronga Zoo (Speculation / Fantasy)
- Thread starter Zoofan15
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I gather that having a cage-like appearance is considered a drawback. Interestingly enough, early plans for Taronga's current lion exhibit imply that the glass viewing bay would have originally been meshed, and constructed further to the west, to give the impression of the humans being caged. While there can be glare at times in photos, I much prefer the finished product.
That's the impression I was given as to why Melbourne wanted to get rid of the enclosure and start over. The 'cage' aspect was becoming an eyesore to some unfortunately, and having visited in its final years I can probably agree. A lot could've been changed to make it better eg. implementing a moat, but Zoos Vic probably would've found it more cost effective to start from scratch and build a better purpose built facility.
The Carnivores precinct also accommodates multiple species (as opposed to the Lion Park, which housed one). It’s construction followed on from the demolition of Big Cat Row, which was popular but also outdated. The Snow leopard exhibits are fantastic, but the lion exhibit isn’t that exciting when it just houses two males.
I feel like the Lion exhibit could easily be spiced up by giving them access to the next door enclosure (which currently holds Dingo), and introducing an overhead crossing.
I too would've preferred if Melbourne's exhibit held more than the two males; but it seems it is designed for two or three males lions at max which is a shame. Unless there's an expansion (like I mentioned above), we're unfortunately stuck with this reality going forward. A coalition of four or five brothers would be far more interesting imo.
Either turning the Dingo exhibit into an African lion exhibit; or using it as a rotational exhibit are both great ideas. The Dingo were of little interest to the visitors when I’ve visited and could predominantly live off display as they previously did.
Either a large coalition of males or a non-breeding pride of 2.2 or 2.3 would make for a far more engaging exhibit. A lot of visitors enjoy comparing a lion and a lioness in any case. Everyone at Auckland Zoo keeps asking if they’re gonna get a male lion.
Unfortunately their hands were tied: they had to demolish it before it turned 50 years old - otherwise they risked being forced to keep it (ie stuck with it) if the National Trust deemed it untouchable due to its heritage or historical value…
In some ways it’s a no win situation but it’s food for thought for any zoo going forward…
Especially considering the Cassons, Lubetkin Penguin Pool and other listed buildings in London Zoo or the monument buildings in Blijdorp...
In many ways, the Lion Park represents a rare conundrum. Some exhibits are looking dated after the first decade; others within 20-30 years and a new exhibit is needed to reflect advances in animal welfare and husbandry practices. For the most part, the Lion Park aged well.
The dedication of so much space to a single species was rare in the 1960’s, but clearly lions were identified as a main drawcard and therefore it was justifiable. Imagine if they’d done the same for elephants!
It’s my belief that the elephants will be going sooner than we originally anticipated. The opportunity to transfer Taronga’s cows to Monarto is a no-brainer (as I discussed in more detail in the Monarto thread) and it’s difficult to imagine Taronga not taking it. Also to factor in is the urgency to get Thong Dee and Pak Boon breeding due to the interval since their last births in 2016 and 2017 respectively.
If we’re correct in our assessment of Taronga’s cows going to Monarto, I imagine they could be transferring as early as 2025. Bearing in mind, any decisions have likely been made by now as to whether this will eventuate and that leaves Taronga with around two years to plan for a redevelopment of the elephant paddocks.
With the innovation of aerial pathways, orangutans are the perfect ambassadors for the modern zoo. Through in their charismatic demeanour and critically endangered status and what more do you want? It’d be great to see Taronga import Bornean orangutan and if the stagnation of the Sumatran orangutan breeding programme in the region is anything to go by (while the Bornean colony at Auckland flourishes), I don’t doubt they could be species of choice.
Taronga (Updated Masterplan)
As mentioned in the 2022/2023 annual report, Taronga are developing a masterplan to oversee the development of Taronga Zoo over the next quarter of a century (up to 2050).
I don’t doubt many of us are excited to see what this revised masterplan entails. The last masterplan was released in 2015 (see spoiler below) and since then we’ve seen adherence to several items on the list including the Sumatran tiger complex, Australian precinct, African precinct, Reptile and Amphibian Centre and Wildlife Hospital. Outstanding items include the Congo precinct, Orangutan complex and elephant trail.
Taronga Zoo - 10 Year Development Plan (2015)
1. Sumatran Tiger Adventure
An Indonesian-themed exhibit where visitors can get close to the mysterious Sumatran Tigers, and learn why choosing sustainable palm oil products can help preserve their native habitat.
2. Australia
An up-close animal habitat experience including a walk-through exhibit where visitors can interact with and explore iconic and unknown Australian fauna.
3. Wildlife Hospital
State-of-the-art upgrades to the Taronga Wildlife Hospital and wildlife clinic to continue the excellence of zoo animal care and wildlife rehabilitation.
4. African Savannah
A multi-species habitat including a lion breeding facility, expanded savannah for giraffes, zebras and Fennec Foxes, and a specialised meerkat exhibit and encounter space.
5. Welcome to the Wild
A unique multi-media experience that will engage and inspire visitors for a shared future for wildlife and people.
6. Congo Forest
A lush forest exhibit for the growing gorilla family, adjoining Pygmy Hippo pools and a tree-filled landscape for the rare Bongo antelope.
7. Elephant Trail
A scenic path traversing the zoo where Elephants will walk.
8. Serpentarium
Upgraded specialist exhibits for an amazing array of Reptiles and Amphibians including critical breeding facilities to support zoo-based conservation programs.
9. New Orang-utan exhibit
Drawing from their native Indonesian habitat, this facility has a range of climbing structures complete with an overhead canopy playground for these fascinating primates.
1. Sumatran Tiger Adventure
An Indonesian-themed exhibit where visitors can get close to the mysterious Sumatran Tigers, and learn why choosing sustainable palm oil products can help preserve their native habitat.
2. Australia
An up-close animal habitat experience including a walk-through exhibit where visitors can interact with and explore iconic and unknown Australian fauna.
3. Wildlife Hospital
State-of-the-art upgrades to the Taronga Wildlife Hospital and wildlife clinic to continue the excellence of zoo animal care and wildlife rehabilitation.
4. African Savannah
A multi-species habitat including a lion breeding facility, expanded savannah for giraffes, zebras and Fennec Foxes, and a specialised meerkat exhibit and encounter space.
5. Welcome to the Wild
A unique multi-media experience that will engage and inspire visitors for a shared future for wildlife and people.
6. Congo Forest
A lush forest exhibit for the growing gorilla family, adjoining Pygmy Hippo pools and a tree-filled landscape for the rare Bongo antelope.
7. Elephant Trail
A scenic path traversing the zoo where Elephants will walk.
8. Serpentarium
Upgraded specialist exhibits for an amazing array of Reptiles and Amphibians including critical breeding facilities to support zoo-based conservation programs.
9. New Orang-utan exhibit
Drawing from their native Indonesian habitat, this facility has a range of climbing structures complete with an overhead canopy playground for these fascinating primates.
Since 2015, we’ve seen the decision made to transfer out Taronga’s cows (recently speculated to tie in with the construction of Monarto’s complex); which almost certainly spell the end for elephants at the site Taronga (the alternative is they hold bulls). In alignment with the decision by multiple city zoos in the region to phase out elephants, I’m confident Taronga will follow suit.
Orangutans have been suggested to replace the elephants and information reported by others on here suggests this is a strong possibility. This would however be a revision of the 2015 plan given elephants were still factored into the equation back then.
The Congo precinct is the great unknown and the revised masterplan will either refine plans to proceed with this; or drop it from the plans altogether. The lack of discussion around it in the current masterplan makes me think it could be abandoned, with Okapi being a considerable challenge to import and no clear indication of Taronga’s long term commitment to gorillas.
It will be interesting to see what the new master plan will have. The last major development, the reptile house has had a lot of criticism thrown tarongas way from a lack of species and concrete zoo stand point.
So it will be interesting whether they continue on with the current mostly human space with a few animals mixed in or actually go back to holding a decent collection again. Especially with Sydney zoo on a much smaller site, with much more species diversity with growing popularity.
Im early 30's and all of my friends in and around Sydney have stopped going to Taronga with the kids and now go to Sydney zoo and say how much better it is. If this is a common theme, I wonder wether it will influence Taronga to actually do something about its declining collection.
So it will be interesting whether they continue on with the current mostly human space with a few animals mixed in or actually go back to holding a decent collection again. Especially with Sydney zoo on a much smaller site, with much more species diversity with growing popularity.
Im early 30's and all of my friends in and around Sydney have stopped going to Taronga with the kids and now go to Sydney zoo and say how much better it is. If this is a common theme, I wonder wether it will influence Taronga to actually do something about its declining collection.
I don’t doubt Sydney Zoo, which is effectively competition, will be on the minds of management as they plan for the ongoing development of Taronga Zoo. Taronga is one the region’s most prestigious zoos, with high quality exhibits; but Sydney Zoo has multiple popular species Taronga lacks such as Spotted hyena, African wild dog and Sumatran orangutan and will likely be able to add elephant to that list within the not too distant future.
Taronga really need to take stock of what species bring in the visitors; as well as aligning with their conservation values of breeding endangered species etc.
The biggest thing I have heard about Taronga from fiends, family and work colleagues is that the zoo lacks animals. The Sumatran tiger exhibit is the best example of this. Instead of using space to add in a smaller species like a monkey/langur species. They put a plane, a village and a shop that no ones uses or takes not of anymore. My last visit people skipped this part and went strait to the animals then left.
While education is important connection with animals from different species is the main goal of zoos. And Taronga is failing in this regard quite miserably. I work in health and especially when kids are involved and animals/zoos come up. Sydney zoo is a clear winner because you can see so many animals. Where Taronga is loosing this element.
It will be interesting to see if the new plan addresses this, especially with the elephants leaving. No one species will be able to match them in popularity, if the zoo continues on with 1 species and more cafes and kids play areas. The zoo will really start to decline sooner then later.
Thinking about it, there’s no reason the Sumatran tiger complex can’t be remodelled to replace the non-animal components with exhibits. Taronga’s management need to take a realistic look at what the public want (as well as what’s worked and what hasn’t).
With the precinct fully functional, I doubt this would be a priority project. If the elephants leave, Taronga (like Melbourne, Perth and Auckland) will need to address a significant gap in their collection; but it’s certainly something they could consider for the future.
Construction noises are stressful to tigers, so an ideal time for a remodel could be when their eldest three tigers (1.1 born 2011; 1.0 born 2013) have passed, which statistically speaking could be around the end of the decade. If the younger trio (1.2 born 2019) remain at Taronga, they could be transferred to Dubbo for a year while the renovations took place if they don’t feel they’d tolerate the disruption to their routine.
As has been mentioned before here on the forum it appears that Taronga is losing its way the number on animal species and overall number of animals seems to be on the decline for some time now.
For a major zoo who seems to hold themselves up as the top zoo with the region its disappointing.
My own view is that Taronga use to hire Directors that were actually animal savvy people where the animals/species appeared to come first but now for some time the angle appears to be more focused on having managers that are more business focused where it becomes a money making "first" operation before all else.
As one of the long time members had mentioned here a couple of years ago they were just leaving Taronga Zoo behind a groups of families and over heard them saying that "there not much to see in there", This is hardy the best impression to give if your hoping to get them to return another day and attract more visitors into the zoo.
Another point is that because they are basically government funded there's an attitude that's is just a 9 to 5 job and the money is always going to be there because of it. I have seen this in my own work life among any type of government organisation there is a complacent attitude.
loganjmuir
Well-Known Member
Will the Lions be sent to other facilities? I heard from a keeper that the Tigers had moves away from Taronga lined up for when they hit a certain age but nothing has happened as of yet, so I’m wondering if the same will happen with the Lions, seeing as they are being rotated in groups you would think this would be a way of moving the two teenage boys out of the group potentially to other facilities without causing a stir in the pride that remains. Also, I’m assuming the younger lionesses will stay on at Taronga, rather than have them leave and let Ato sire another litter and instead create a multigenerational non-breeding pride of sort.
The best case scenario would be to just send the two younger males to another facility but obviously there needs to be a facility that will be able to accommodate them.
Taronga previously kept Johari (the male cub born back in 2003) with his parents and sister for a decade before he was eventually sent down to Werribee to breed. I wouldn't be surprised if Taronga are aiming to do a similar thing here.
From what I was told Ato and Maya would remain a non breeding pair from now on going forward and will probably live out their lives with their offspring. None of their cubs are very valuable so will all probably remain in non breeding situations imo.
Also, interesting to hear that re. the tigers I also recall hearing about a similar thing. The tiger cubs are in the same boat as the lions - they aren't really that valuable to the regional/global population. At best, I can see Taronga potentially breeding from one of the girls going forward to continue the family tree but that's about it.
loganjmuir
Well-Known Member
I totally agree with you, best case scenario would include the two boys moving to another facility(in my opinion Melbourne) and having the girls stay along with Ato and Maya as Taronga just doesn’t have the space required for another litter. In the originally proposed plan there was two seperate exhibits, one at the wooden shade structure and one at the current backstage behind the main viewing point. Had Taronga gone ahead with these plans there could have been a conversation around holding two litters, or at the very least a seperate male enclosure like the Congo Gorilla area proposes.
As for the Tigers, I personally enjoy having all the cubs roaming around with their parents, it makes for a pretty special encounter. I can never seem to remember, is there 3 or 4 cubs? They move around so much—luckily— that I can’t count them regularly, especially with the thick foliage covering most of the outer exhibit layer. It would make most sense to keep them there until their parents eventually pass away and then maybe look at renovating the precinct to give them more room or bring in a breeding pair to accomodate them.
Osedax
Well-Known Member
There are three tiger cubs, one male named Pemanah and two females named Mawar and Tengah. They are usually kept with their mother, Kartika.
Taronga’s tiger litter really have very little application to our breeding programme at this point in time. Due to their wild born paternal grandmother, they’d be far more valuable to the North American breeding programme; but considering they turn five years old next month, I feel like we would have seen an export by now if that was on the cards.
Taronga planned to loan a pair from Ragunan Zoo in Indonesia for five years from the late 2010’s. This would have been a valuable asset to the regional breeding programme, but sadly fell through.
As things stand, I anticipate we’ll see either the male or one of the females paired with a cub from Auckland’s pair down the line. There’s really no other bloodline which isn’t a close relation (first cousin, second cousin etc).