Panda loans don't actually benefit panda conservation

One thing I never fully understood is how does a zoo's will to acquire pandas articulate with its country's government?

For instance, the thing about the Prague zoo deciding not to acquire pandas because they don't want to condone the Chinese government's actions... was this really the zoo itself or rather the Czech government?

From what I understand, the zoo has to make a demand to its own government, which then makes the demand to China... at least that's how it worked in the case of Beauval, apparently.

Also in the case of Europe, there seems to be this rule that there can only be 1 zoo per country with pandas, but I don't know how that really works... At one point, there were like 4 US zoos with pandas. Both the US and Japan currently have 2 facilities with pandas.
 
Bit of an odd piece of journalism too. Although I have no doubt that the agenda of the Chinese is not to increase funds for conservation, the claim that the money is not spend on conservation can never be made.

It assumes that you can “follow” an individual dollar, which is impossible. The only way you can claim this, is proving that China does not spend at least 16 million USD on “panda conservation” (or activities that could be labelled as such) and I’m pretty sure China can label enough expenses as such.

The only other thing a journalist can claim is that conservation expenses have not increased since the panda loans, but China can easily rebut that by saying it was intending to decrease conservation efforts but the income enabled them to keep up the level.

The article in the end only states that the expenses were not accounted for. I’m sure that if China is forced to substantiate 50 million on panda conservation over the last 40 years, it could easily do so.
 
Apparently US zoos were quite aware of the situation, but chose to keep quiet about it, for fear of losing their pandas.

Which is where it becomes extremely clear that the pandas are a status symbol, not a conservation oriented holding. The information revealed in the article is a bad look for all four zoos recently involved with pandas as well as the AZA, given that the organization has also overlooked it and the current director is the one who saved the loan program from collapsing.

"We hope that our guests realize when watching such a special, yet endangered, animal that we are destroying the world and that we can do something against that together"

Hollow words when the zoo hemorrhages money on pandas loaned by one of the least conservation-oriented large countries. The money spent could bring in multiple endangered species that aren't tied down.

Soon to be 17 with the SFZ and more collections could still try to acquire the animals.

San Francisco is still very much up in the air, and hopefully it stays that way. They still have zero money raised, are trying to figure out where to grow bamboo, and continue to face the increasing music of their own questionable choices. The money the zoo wants to spend on pandas could be used far far better on what they already have.

For zoos, money-making opportunity turned dubious, because multiple zoos lost money on panda rental, as the result of extravagant fixed cost of the rental and upkeep

Not just loosing money, more like throwing it away. Multiple zoos have canceled their loans because they could not afford to keep the bears. Zoos pour money in and yet few if any actually make it work financially. Calgary had just gotten their turn of the pair in Canada when the covid shutdowns loomed and they bailed extremely quickly, knowing full well having the bears with the uncertainty might well bankrupt them. Memphis and I believe Atlanta too both offset costs of theirs by getting major companies to sponsor the loans and other parts of the expense.

And it became clear that ambitions of Western zoos largely drive the Chinese moneymaking on pandas - if Western suckers want to pay, we will rent pandas for an enormous price

San Francisco being a prime example - the zoo has zero business spending that much money on pandas or having the bears in general. It was a politically oriented pet project of the now out-going mayor and the director of the zoo went for it as well. By all accounts the staff are unhappy and continue to attempt removal of the director, the zoo is now undergoing full audit from the city, and they continue to experience issues with their animals - and yet higher-ups want to dig in to bringing in pandas? Ludicrous to bring in pandas.

Re the whole money towards conversation topic, since when does China care about conservation if it doesn't benefit them? Just last month Indonesian authorities seized 1.2 tons of pangolin scales that were bound for China, estimated to be from a whopping six thousand pangolins. The US exports turtles by the thousands to China because virtually all of China's turtles are clinging by a thread. The country still leads in shark fins and seahorses. Tiger and bear bones, Rhino horn, and other such "medicinal" items remain in demand. Where is the Chinese Paddlefish? The Baiji and the Yangzte Finless Porpoise cling to existence. Chinese Alligator, Scaly-sided Merganser, the giant Salamanders, Blue-crowned Laughingthrush and more remain severely imperiled. China continues to block or ignore attempts to increase protections for endangered species on a global level. Maybe the panda once stood for conservation through the World Wildlife Fund, but I find it hard to believe they still do when China is turning panda breeding centers into giant attractions.
 
Which is where it becomes extremely clear that the pandas are a status symbol, not a conservation oriented holding. The information revealed in the article is a bad look for all four zoos recently involved with pandas as well as the AZA, given that the organization has also overlooked it and the current director is the one who saved the loan program from collapsing.



Hollow words when the zoo hemorrhages money on pandas loaned by one of the least conservation-oriented large countries. The money spent could bring in multiple endangered species that aren't tied down.



San Francisco is still very much up in the air, and hopefully it stays that way. They still have zero money raised, are trying to figure out where to grow bamboo, and continue to face the increasing music of their own questionable choices. The money the zoo wants to spend on pandas could be used far far better on what they already have.



Not just loosing money, more like throwing it away. Multiple zoos have canceled their loans because they could not afford to keep the bears. Zoos pour money in and yet few if any actually make it work financially. Calgary had just gotten their turn of the pair in Canada when the covid shutdowns loomed and they bailed extremely quickly, knowing full well having the bears with the uncertainty might well bankrupt them. Memphis and I believe Atlanta too both offset costs of theirs by getting major companies to sponsor the loans and other parts of the expense.



San Francisco being a prime example - the zoo has zero business spending that much money on pandas or having the bears in general. It was a politically oriented pet project of the now out-going mayor and the director of the zoo went for it as well. By all accounts the staff are unhappy and continue to attempt removal of the director, the zoo is now undergoing full audit from the city, and they continue to experience issues with their animals - and yet higher-ups want to dig in to bringing in pandas? Ludicrous to bring in pandas.

Re the whole money towards conversation topic, since when does China care about conservation if it doesn't benefit them? Just last month Indonesian authorities seized 1.2 tons of pangolin scales that were bound for China, estimated to be from a whopping six thousand pangolins. The US exports turtles by the thousands to China because virtually all of China's turtles are clinging by a thread. The country still leads in shark fins and seahorses. Tiger and bear bones, Rhino horn, and other such "medicinal" items remain in demand. Where is the Chinese Paddlefish? The Baiji and the Yangzte Finless Porpoise cling to existence. Chinese Alligator, Scaly-sided Merganser, the giant Salamanders, Blue-crowned Laughingthrush and more remain severely imperiled. China continues to block or ignore attempts to increase protections for endangered species on a global level. Maybe the panda once stood for conservation through the World Wildlife Fund, but I find it hard to believe they still do when China is turning panda breeding centers into giant attractions.
Amen!! Well said, mate. When will people open their eyes? wait, they are blind by a black-and-white ball of fur. China uses the pandas as greenwashing while still being one of the countries that contributes the most, negatively, to endangered species worldwide.
 
Last edited:
For instance, the thing about the Prague zoo deciding not to acquire pandas because they don't want to condone the Chinese government's actions... was this really the zoo itself or rather the Czech government?

Prague zoo is 100% owned by City Prague. And while the zoo director Bobek was wery interested in pandas and wanted to get them at any cost, but the then mayor of the City, when asked by Chinese ambassador to sign the "One China policy", refused to do so. The mayor was a young man whose original profession was a doctor. And during his studies of medicine he did uni exchange and spent some time in Taiwan. He thus had some understanding of modern China history and relationship between mainland government and Taiwan. And he just couldnt sign a document to de facto condoning possible future military invasion of Taiwan. China has retaliated immediatelly - visa of Czech people who wanted to do cultural events in China got cancelled (musicians etc.), also bussiness deals of firms Prague-seated got cancelled, Chinese customs started to boycott and refuse to let through Czech goods on border and many more. Possible panda deal was one of the casualties.
 
Prague zoo is 100% owned by City Prague. And while the zoo director Bobek was wery interested in pandas and wanted to get them at any cost, but the then mayor of the City, when asked by Chinese ambassador to sign the "One China policy", refused to do so. The mayor was a young man whose original profession was a doctor. And during his studies of medicine he did uni exchange and spent some time in Taiwan. He thus had some understanding of modern China history and relationship between mainland government and Taiwan. And he just couldnt sign a document to de facto condoning possible future military invasion of Taiwan. China has retaliated immediatelly - visa of Czech people who wanted to do cultural events in China got cancelled (musicians etc.), also bussiness deals of firms Prague-seated got cancelled, Chinese customs started to boycott and refuse to let through Czech goods on border and many more. Possible panda deal was one of the casualties.
And they got Pangolins from Taiwan instead. And the zoo managed to make it into an icon species. Much clever in my opinion! I definitely would trust more the taiwanese government than the chinese one.
 
Maybe the monkeys are China's contingency Plan B once the Giant panda business has run its course in Western zoos.
Ahah, I would say that it is already a successful plan among zoochatters. Beauval will become a pilgrimage site.
 
Bit of an odd piece of journalism too. Although I have no doubt that the agenda of the Chinese is not to increase funds for conservation, the claim that the money is not spend on conservation can never be made.

It assumes that you can “follow” an individual dollar, which is impossible. The only way you can claim this, is proving that China does not spend at least 16 million USD on “panda conservation” (or activities that could be labelled as such) and I’m pretty sure China can label enough expenses as such.

The only other thing a journalist can claim is that conservation expenses have not increased since the panda loans, but China can easily rebut that by saying it was intending to decrease conservation efforts but the income enabled them to keep up the level.

The article in the end only states that the expenses were not accounted for. I’m sure that if China is forced to substantiate 50 million on panda conservation over the last 40 years, it could easily do so.

The full article is much longer than it let me quote, these are some of the relevant passages about how they found out the money is not spent for conservation:

The Times used two decades of financial reports, internal correspondence, photos and archival records to track more than $86 million from American zoos to a pair of organizations run by the Chinese government. Zoos elsewhere in the world have contributed tens of millions of dollars more. In wildlife conservation, that is a huge sum, far larger than what zoos have spent in overseas donations for any other species.

Zoos approve which projects get financed and then list them in annual reports to the Fish and Wildlife Service. Those records show that funds were allocated to build apartment buildings far from nature reserves. China also bought computers and satellite television for local government offices and built at least three museums with the money, according to the records.

And American money helped transform a panda breeding center in western China into a bustling attraction that, according to an architect’s plans, may soon welcome as many visitors as Disneyland.

Those payments represent only what was documented. Zoo administrators have at times struggled to persuade their Chinese partners to disclose the spending.


“You had to take their word,” said David Towne, who until 2016 was the director of a foundation representing American zoos with pandas. “China felt it was not our business — that we got the pandas, and we shouldn’t tell them how to spend the money.”

Early agreements gave zoos the right to verify funding on the ground. But contracts signed recently by the National Zoo in Washington and by the San Diego Zoo make no mention of checking how money is spent

American zoo administrators have acknowledged, in letters to regulators, that the numbers do not always add up.

Zoos in Europe, which also rent pandas, reached a similar conclusion. At Edinburgh Zoo, where two pandas lived until last year, an administrator said in 2021 that its money couldn’t be tracked because “the funds from all zoos are pooled,” according to meeting minutes. As a result, the Scottish zoo could not identify any “specific works, projects or outcomes” that it had funded.

This has been a problem for decades. When Fish and Wildlife officials asked Memphis Zoo in 2007 to identify which Chinese areas would benefit from $875,000 allocated for panda monitoring, the zoo had no answer. It wrote in an annual report that its Chinese partner had provided “NO ADDITIONAL INFORMATION.”

In a statement to The Times, the zoo acknowledged problems.

“Memphis Zoo was not able to control the funding that was sent to China as, once it was there, it was no longer in the hands of Memphis Zoo officials,” the statement said. “And there was not always information provided regarding the funding once in China.”

Melissa Songer, a conservation biologist at the National Zoo, which recently welcomed two new pandas, said that China had put donor money to good use. “They have done so much in terms of setting aside protection and doing all the right things — stopping logging, investing,” she said. “And part of that money is coming from zoos around the world.”

The National Zoo did not answer written questions about funding. The San Diego Zoo declined to comment. China’s national forestry bureau and its zoo association, which together oversee panda exchanges, also did not respond to questions.


China has indeed expanded its network of nature reserves, and some American money was allocated for patrol trucks, small ranger stations, equipment and other items needed to protect land, records show. Mr. Stansell, the former regulator, said that, on visits to China, he did see some conservation projects. And Mr. Towne, the former panda foundation director, said that, even in the absence of hard evidence, he saw signs of progress, including more professional staff working in the reserves.

But pandas live on only a portion of that land, and their habitat is shrinking. China has built roads and developed tourism in and around nature reserves, piercing the natural habitat and leaving pandas isolated in ever-smaller populations, Chinese and American scientists have concluded.

Their report estimated that wild pandas have less territory to roam than they did in the 1980s, before the influx of funds from foreign zoos.

“It’s in everybody’s interest to portray these conservation efforts as great successes,” said Kimberly Terrell, who traveled to China while working as director of conservation at Memphis Zoo.

“There was never any real evaluation of the programs,” she added. “In some cases, it was really hard to see the connection between those programs and giant panda conservation.”


(Dr. Terrell, now a scientist at Tulane University in Louisiana, settled an unrelated gender discrimination lawsuit against the zoo in 2018.)

The Fish and Wildlife Service said it takes federal law “very seriously” and requires “sufficiently detailed financial accounting data” from zoos with pandas.

Dan Ashe, the agency’s former director, called the funding disagreement between China and the United States “a technical matter.” Mr. Ashe said that he had approved new reporting standards to maintain a program that he felt significantly benefited conservation. “We had to come up with a solution,” he said.

Mr. Ashe now heads the industry association for American zoos.

A Secret Compromise
In 2010, Mr. Ashe led a delegation of senior American wildlife officials to China for a high-stakes meeting.

The panda-rental program was on the verge of falling apart, records show. If he could not reach an agreement with his Chinese counterparts, pandas in Atlanta, Memphis, San Diego, and Washington might have to return to China.


The program’s finances had been rocky from the start.

Early money had gone to what Zoo Atlanta called a “drastic expansion and construction” of a panda breeding center in Chengdu, western China. Millions more went toward infrastructure in and around nature reserves, including roads, buildings, and water hookups — money that regulators questioned. One National Zoo project, a mixed-use building with apartments and office space, was 30 miles from a nature reserve.

“While we understand the need for establishment of an infrastructure in China, we feel strongly that construction of facilities alone will not accomplish the goal of enhancing the survival of pandas in the wild,” regulators at the Fish and Wildlife Service wrote to the National Zoo.

The zoo industry pushed back. “Conservation activities in the wild cannot occur if the infrastructure does not exist,” the industry group currently headed by Mr. Ashe, now called the Association of Zoos and Aquariums, responded.

The Fish and Wildlife Service ultimately approved most of the funds.

Then, in 2003, regulators froze money to China because of a lack of documentation, records show. But they soon gave in to Chinese demands for less detailed reporting.


“The service thought that was a reasonable way to move forward to keep the program going,” Mr. Stansell, the former agency official, said.

Back and forth it went for years, with the Chinese groups sometimes withholding information or spending money on projects with only loose connections to conservation, and American regulators periodically freezing funds.

Zoo Atlanta submitted a funding proposal for a 27,000-square-foot building, 48 sets of office furniture and 50 miles of road, along with computers and a copy machine, for “nature reserve infrastructure projects” in the northwestern Chinese province of Gansu, records show. Zoo Atlanta declined to comment, saying it did not have information on old projects.

So, when Fish and Wildlife officials landed in Beijing in 2010, years of money issues were coming to a head. The Chinese groups had stopped reporting their spending altogether, and the American regulators had frozen $12 million in payments over two years, according to internal National Zoo documents.

The zoo’s employees acknowledged that they couldn’t verify spending and fretted about losing their pandas. “The goal is to find a compromise,” they wrote.

[]

Ultimately, the zoos got the compromise they wanted. Fish and Wildlife regulators agreed to reduce oversight. Going forward, zoos could approve Chinese funding proposals directly, rather than sending them to the agency for review, Mr. Ashe said in an interview.

“What it did was put the accountability in the right place,” he said. The zoos are “accountable to demonstrate that they are reporting significant and meritorious conservation projects, not the Chinese.”

Panda Disneyland
Even with more lax reporting requirements, problems persisted.

Three of the zoos paid for office equipment for local government forestry bureaus.

Other money went to captive pandas, rather than to pandas in the wild. Memphis Zoo earmarked hundreds of thousands of dollars for animal enclosures, bamboo and veterinary facilities at Shanghai Zoo.
 
Is anyone shocked about this? I always thought it was an open secret that since the money never had to be proven for what it was used for, that it was just for China to add to the nations funds. I am hoping that this report does change things, either for China to actually send the money to conservation or we just stop displaying pandas. The later will be more likely, but I won't hold my breath.
 
Research by the New York Times indicates that all the millions paid in annual loans by all zoos outside China that keep giant pandas aren't for the biggest part actually used for conservation purposes, but rather for infrastructure projects and other expenses that have nothing to do with conservation. Apparently US zoos were quite aware of the situation, but chose to keep quiet about it, for fear of losing their pandas.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/11/29/world/asia/china-panda-money-us-zoos.html

An excerpt from the article is included below:
Does anyone hold a copy of the full article (we Europeans cannot read it and it is behind a paywall / ad blocker (news should be free access ....)?
 
The link works for me - I'll send you (and anyone else who needs it) the full text via PM :)
@TLD, thanks for sending it on. Very much appreciate your gesture!

I remain on the look out for the hard data and underlying financials.... The journey continues!

Personally, I think it is nice to see giant pandas - the brand for WWF internationally - in overseas zoos outside PR China, for the budding masses that lest not travel to the country and see giant pandas in the wilds or some of the major zoos breeding the species in PR China.
 
Also in the case of Europe, there seems to be this rule that there can only be 1 zoo per country with pandas, but I don't know how that really works... At one point, there were like 4 US zoos with pandas. Both the US and Japan currently have 2 facilities with pandas.

I want to mention that for example in Czechia, Zoo Zlín wanted to acquire pandas, but when the Prague Zoo announced they'll hold them, Zlín stopped trying to reach for them. But that is also because the rent is very expensive and in the end, the zoo belongs to just a relatively small sized town. And Czechia is quite a small country in the end, we don't really need to have pandas in two zoos. Though, Prague Zoo called off getting pandas in the end anyway, so the current Zlín situation is that they're not trying to get these bears, but the director mentioned that if they were given the opportunity, they would probably accept/consider it.
 
Ouwehands Dierenpark, the only Dutch zoo to keep giant panda, admits they were unaware how all the millions were used, despite an apparent agreement at least 80% would go towards conservation.

I asked Zoo Vienna for this topic and i got a similar answer. Their contract settle the way how the money is used. 70% are for In-situ conservation. 20% are used for research and the Chinese panda station. The remaining 10% are for the administration, which seems like a pretty weird amount of money, for an animal, that is sent abroad for 10 or 15 years? (Although i do not know how much fee Vienna is paying).

However, if the money is used like they figured it out with the contract, is not controlled by the Austrian zoo. So at the end of the day, Schönbrunn have no idea, if the money is used as it should be used.
 
Back
Top