Australasian Western Lowland Gorilla Population

[Jambo]

It’s testament to Motaba that he successfully mated with four socially deficient females, including two of which were previously rejected from Mzuri’s troop (and one of which was later fatally injured by Otana). Youth and inexperience of the silverback has been attributed to those incidents; but Motaba’s youth transcended any expectation we could have had of him.

If Julia and G Anne were in fact introduced to Motaba when he was by himself, this would have surely helped their chances with being accepted by him who was surely missing the companionship of other gorillas.

Following Buluman's passing in early 98, this trio would've been reintroduced to the main group of four (Betsy, Yuska, Buzandi and Bambuti). All three females (with the exception of Betsy now in her 40's) would then conceive within a year of the re-establishment of this troop.

 

[Zoofan15]

Kimya (2005-2025)

Some very sad news from Melbourne Zoo:

Melbourne Zoo is devastated to announce the sudden passing of 20-year-old Western Lowland Gorilla, Kimya.

Kimya passed away unexpectedly this morning, and vets are undertaking a necropsy to determine the cause of death.

Kimya arrived at Melbourne Zoo from Taronga Conservation Society in 2013 and quickly bonded with 24-year-old male, Otana. In 2015, they became parents to Kanzi, the first gorilla born at Melbourne Zoo in 15 years.

Melbourne Zoo's primate keeping team remember Kimya as intelligent, observant and independent. She was a loving mother, who gently showed Kanzi all the skills she needed as a gorilla, whilst reminding visitors of the plight facing her species in the wild through campaigns such as They're Calling On You.

A firm favourite of members and visitors to Melbourne Zoo, our thoughts are with the whole team, and in particular her dedicated keepers, many of whom worked with Kimya for over a decade.

 

[Jambo]

From a welfare perspective, this requires urgent action to provide Kanzi with additional females as is the natural social order. Unless one of Taronga’s females is to move across (highly unlikely), the only option is to import from overseas.

Absolutely. I have a few thoughts on potential options going forward;

An option here is for Taronga to fully focus on being a bachelor facility within their current exhibit; sending the three girls to Melbourne. Of course, there is risks here, especially surrounding Johari. But integrating her with two other, socially competent females may be her best bet.

If Taronga aren't open to sending females across maybe the best course will be to send Kanzi there for welfare purposes. The young males could then be sent across and be attempted to be grouped with Otana here in a bachelor group.

Othwerise, this may be the perfect time to re-generate if your Melbourne. Send Kanzi to Taronga (or Mogo) and Otana to Orana where he could have the chance to integrate with their males. This would obviously mean Melbourne would be without gorillas for a period, but hopefully this would mean they'd look at importing an entirely new group from overseas and start over.

 

[marmolady]

Devastating news, shedding a lot of tears for Kimya.

 

[Zoofan15]

Absolutely. I have a few thoughts on potential options going forward;

An option here is for Taronga to fully focus on being a bachelor facility within their current exhibit; sending the three girls to Melbourne. Of course, there is risks here, especially surrounding Johari. But integrating her with two other, socially competent females may be her best bet.

If Taronga aren't open to sending females across maybe the best course will be to send Kanzi there for welfare purposes. The young males could then be sent across and be attempted to be grouped with Otana here in a bachelor group.

Othwerise, this may be the perfect time to re-generate if your Melbourne. Send Kanzi to Taronga (or Mogo) and Otana to Orana where he could have the chance to integrate with their males. This would obviously mean Melbourne would be without gorillas for a period, but hopefully this would mean they'd look at importing an entirely new group from overseas and start over.

The other possibility could be to send Mbeli (a prime aged, socially competent female) to Melbourne, retaining the other two females with Kibale.

Mbeli has had two offspring now with Kibale, so this would pave the way for a new pairing; and for both zoos then to import at least one new female each.

Kibale is a genetically valuable male and his three adolescent sons will likely form a bachelor troop, so it would be a shame to effectively retire him with them at this point in time.

 

[Patrick Keegan]

The other possibility could be to send Mbeli (a prime aged, socially competent female) to Melbourne, retaining the other two females with Kibale.

Mbeli has had two offspring now with Kibale, so this would pave the way for a new pairing; and for both zoos then to import at least one new female each.

Kibale is a genetically valuable male and his three adolescent sons will likely form a bachelor troop, so it would be a shame to effectively retire him with them at this point in time.

I think another option could be sending both Mbeli and Joahari to Melbourne Johari while a behavioural non breeder would at least provide support in the troop as they would otherwise be set with a single breeding Pair, Kanzi transfers to Taronga and potentially waits a few more years to breed with Taronga potentially importing an additional female during this time frame when frala may have already passed on with Melbourne potentially also doing the same and having two breeding females.

 

[Zoofan15]

I think another option could be sending both Mbeli and Joahari to Melbourne Johari while a behavioural non breeder would at least provide support in the troop as they would otherwise be set with a single breeding Pair, Kanzi transfers to Taronga either waits a few more years to breed with Taronga potentially importing an additional female during this time frame when frala may have already passed on with Melbourne potentially also doing the same and having two breeding females.

That’s also an excellent idea. Mbeli and Johari previously had a close relationship, with Mbeli’s obsession with Kibale coming between them following their introduction at Taronga. However, especially with Otana’s indifference to females, it’s not hard to imagine their bond being reinvigorated by a transfer out of Kibale’s troop and into Otana’s.

Frala would still need to be accommodated with females, but could potentially go to Mogo, who are need of females.

Long story short, the region needs more female gorillas!

 

[Jambo]

The other possibility could be to send Mbeli (a prime aged, socially competent female) to Melbourne, retaining the other two females with Kibale.

Mbeli has had two offspring now with Kibale, so this would pave the way for a new pairing; and for both zoos then to import at least one new female each.

Kibale is a genetically valuable male and his three adolescent sons will likely form a bachelor troop, so it would be a shame to effectively retire him with them at this point in time.

To be honest, I'm not sure where the narrative of Kibale being 'genetically valuable' comes from. He has four full siblings and eight half siblings (via his father). I don't think there will be any harm in retiring him with his sons. As a group of four they could easily move one of the males (perhaps Fabumi being the most valuable via his maternal line) into a breeding group down the line.

I also don't see the point of either facility staying half and half. We're at the point where we can't keep on sharing gorillas evenly; we really only have enough females right now for a single breeding group. And there's young males at Taronga who will soon need to be separated too. It makes sense with two facilities for one to focus on breeding and the other to focus on holding the males (at least in the meantime).

 

[Jambo]

Extremely sad news indeed. But how could a major zoo let one of its major drawcards get to this point?, it does not just happen over night?

Melbourne have been left without many choices to be fair. It started with their troop being founded on socially inadequate gorillas and then proceeding to produce offspring that needed to be hand raised.

Just when things were looking better, the incident between Otana and Julia occured and unfortunately Melbourne have had to deal with the possibility of there being huge risks involved in integrating any new females to the group. The fact that Otana effectively killed and then rejected another female also reduced Melbourne's gorilla troop to just four.

So I wouldn't go so far as to blame Melbourne; they've done the best they can up until this point and will now have to make some tough decisions going forward.

 

[Zoofan15]

Melbourne have been left without many choices to be fair. It started with their troop being founded on socially inadequate gorillas and then proceeding to produce offspring that needed to be hand raised.

Just when things were looking better, the incident between Otana and Julia occured and unfortunately Melbourne have had to deal with the possibility of there being huge risks involved in integrating any new females to the group. The fact that Otana effectively killed and then rejected another female also reduced Melbourne's gorilla troop to just four.

So I wouldn't go so far as to blame Melbourne; they've done the best they can up until this point and will now have to make some tough decisions going forward.

Well said. It’s pointless to complain about what should have been done, especially when Melbourne worked wonders to deal with the hand they were dealt.

Ultimately, they (and Taronga) have each had highs and lows and all that can be done is learn lessons where possible and look to the future with regards to management of the two troops.

 

[Zorro]

Melbourne have been left without many choices to be fair. It started with their troop being founded on socially inadequate gorillas and then proceeding to produce offspring that needed to be hand raised.

Just when things were looking better, the incident between Otana and Julia occured and unfortunately Melbourne have had to deal with the possibility of there being huge risks involved in integrating any new females to the group. The fact that Otana effectively killed and then rejected another female also reduced Melbourne's gorilla troop to just four.

So I wouldn't go so far as to blame Melbourne; they've done the best they can up until this point and will now have to make some tough decisions going forward.

I agree it is time to move upward and forward perhaps they can look at getting some of the surplus females from the EEP?. I guess one of the limiting factors over the years has been for a long time it was only Taronga and Melbourne zoo that were holders of a breeding group, If Adelaide went ahead with their plans that would of worked out better for the species overall. Having Mogo zoo with a up and coming breeding group now should be a plus for the future now.

 

[Jambo]

I agree it is time to move upward and forward perhaps they can look at getting some of the surplus females from the EEP?. I guess one of the limiting factors over the years has been for a long time it was only Taronga and Melbourne zoo that were holders of a breeding group, If Adelaide went ahead with their plans that would of worked out better for the species overall. Having Mogo zoo with a up and coming breeding group now should be a plus for the future now.

That is fair. I do feel like part of the reason why Adelaide didn't elect to continue with their plans for gorillas is that there wasn't any demand for an additional breeding group regionally.

We barely have enough females to supply our current breeding groups as it is so having an additional holder on board would've only complicated things even more. Any females imported need to go to the facilities we already have!

Looking at the state of our current population another facility dedicated to bachelor groups would've been preferable, especially to accommodate Taronga's young males who will need to move out soon.

Taking into account lifespans it's often recommended to balance out breeding facilities with bachelor facilities these days. Right now we have three breeding facilities but only two designated bachelor facilities. Another bachelor facility would greatly enable more breeding efforts regionally going forward without having to stop/start breeding due to not being able to place offspring.

 

[Zorro]

That is fair. I do feel like part of the reason why Adelaide didn't elect to continue with their plans for gorillas is that there wasn't any demand for an additional breeding group regionally.

We barely have enough females to supply our current breeding groups as it is so having an additional holder on board would've only complicated things even more. Any females imported need to go to the facilities we already have!

Looking at the state of our current population another facility dedicated to bachelor groups would've been preferable, especially to accommodate Taronga's young males who will need to move out soon.

Taking into account lifespans it's often recommended to balance out breeding facilities with bachelor facilities these days. Right now we have three breeding facilities but only two designated bachelor facilities. Another bachelor facility would greatly enable more breeding efforts regionally going forward without having to stop/start breeding due to not being able to place offspring.

I would be surprised if there were not a couple of regional zoos willing to start a bachelor group, It might be worth the zoos among the ZAA to have a meeting regarding the future. As mentioned, US zoos and European zoos have reached capacity a while ago hopefully they can send a few this way!
I had wondered how things would have panned out some years ago when SeaWorld (Gold Coast) wanted to open a "African Jungle" exhibit, they even obtained a female river Hippo that ended up at Dubbo, Part of the idea was to obtain a group of Gorillas from the USA.

 

[Trua]

I had wondered how things would have panned out some years ago when SeaWorld (Gold Coast) wanted to open a "African Jungle" exhibit, they even obtained a female river Hippo that ended up at Dubbo, Part of the idea was to obtain a group of Gorillas from the USA.

Most of it was nothing more than a pipe dream lol. At one point they scrapped everything else besides the hippos and that is when they obtained the female river hippo from Cairns. They soon realised there was little in point investing in just a single female especially as the sole attraction of the exhibit.

 

[Swanson02]

Absolutely. I have a few thoughts on potential options going forward;

An option here is for Taronga to fully focus on being a bachelor facility within their current exhibit; sending the three girls to Melbourne. Of course, there is risks here, especially surrounding Johari. But integrating her with two other, socially competent females may be her best bet.

If Taronga aren't open to sending females across maybe the best course will be to send Kanzi there for welfare purposes. The young males could then be sent across and be attempted to be grouped with Otana here in a bachelor group.

Othwerise, this may be the perfect time to re-generate if your Melbourne. Send Kanzi to Taronga (or Mogo) and Otana to Orana where he could have the chance to integrate with their males. This would obviously mean Melbourne would be without gorillas for a period, but hopefully this would mean they'd look at importing an entirely new group from overseas and start over.

It came at a horrible time. My thoughts are with the Melbourne keepers and Kanzi

Being without both elephants and Gorillas would kill Melbourne imo

Two biggest drawcards gone in the space of a year. We Zoochaters complain about phase outs and dwindling species numbers alot. But the general public doesn't really notice/care.

Losing both Elephants and Gorillas in one year would definitely be noticeable to the public. So much so Melbourne's visitor numbers could drop.

 

[Jambo]

It came at a horrible time. My thoughts are with the Melbourne keepers and Kanzi

Being without both elephants and Gorillas would kill Melbourne imo

Two biggest drawcards gone in the space of a year. We Zoochaters complain about phase outs and dwindling species numbers alot. But the general public doesn't really notice/care.

Losing both Elephants and Gorillas in one year would definitely be noticeable to the public. So much so Melbourne's visitor numbers could drop.

100% agree. Your arguably losing the two biggest drawcards to Melbourne Zoo. Really two of the only species I'd say that Melbourne has where normal members of the public could name a fair few of the animals themselves too.

There's limited options when you consider the current situation - either Melbourne sends both gorillas away to other facilities. This could allow them to renovate the current complex (which is now 35 years old) before welcoming new individuals from overseas. Or, they could exchange individuals with Taronga, whether that's receiving males and sending Kanzi out or receiving females.

 

[Zorro]

Most of it was nothing more than a pipe dream lol. At one point they scrapped everything else besides the hippos and that is when they obtained the female river hippo from Cairns. They soon realised there was little in point investing in just a single female especially as the sole attraction of the exhibit.

Reference can still be found online about this going back to 2012

 

[Zorro]

100% agree. Your arguably losing the two biggest drawcards to Melbourne Zoo. Really two of the only species I'd say that Melbourne has where normal members of the public could name a fair few of the animals themselves too.

There's limited options when you consider the current situation - either Melbourne sends both gorillas away to other facilities. This could allow them to renovate the current complex (which is now 35 years old) before welcoming new individuals from overseas. Or, they could exchange individuals with Taronga, whether that's receiving males and sending Kanzi out or receiving females.

That actually sounds like a very good idea to renovate the exhibit and now with some extra space perhaps expand it to carry two troops for future proof. Perhaps possibly send the female to Mogo?

 

[Jambo]

That actually sounds like a very good idea to renovate the exhibit and now with some extra space perhaps expand it to carry two troops for future proof. Perhaps possibly send the female to Mogo?

Realistically in this scenario, Mogo would be the best place for her. Not only is it a group in need of an additional female (just to support numbers wise), but she'll also meet G Ann again, of whom she knew she may remember from when she was little

Kipenzi would also effectively be joining her family of which she's never known; her maternal grandmother (Kriba), aunty (Kipenzi) and cousins in Kaius and the new infant.

 

[Zorro]

Realistically in this scenario, Mogo would be the best place for her. Not only is it a group in need of an additional female (just to support numbers wise), but she'll also meet G Ann again, of whom she knew she may remember from when she was little

Kipenzi would also effectively be joining her family of which she's never known; her maternal grandmother (Kriba), aunty (Kipenzi) and cousins in Kaius and the new infant.

Hopefully Melbourne zoo might consider that?