Australasian Western Lowland Gorilla Population

[Zoofan15]

This would be probably the best stop gap, especially since Melbourne seem to have shown no interest with breeding. Making them a bachelor facility until they can work out what comes next would be the best way forward for them. It would also give Taronga a second breeding female, that is a facility that is interested in breeding. Hopefully if they move the males on they can restart breeding and have a few females born.

It would have been so valuable to have had Sydney Zoo and Adelaide Zoo come onboard to hold this species. Had that materialised (and Orana imported the breeding troop they had planned), it would have enabled continued breeding at Taronga and Melbourne.

Considering Werribee has an ageing bachelor troop, forming a younger bachelor troop at Melbourne now means they could also have the option to switch back to breeding within 20 years (with the younger troop transferred to Werribee to replace their males as they inevitably pass on).

 

[Tiger91]

It'll be interesting to see what Kimya cause of death was, and whether keeping her in the current troop that isnt ideal had anything to do with it i.e stress. Primates tend to suffer cardiac conditions like humans and continued stress can cause it.

Hopefully this will be the wake up call the zoo management need. They have sat on this issue for far too long and done nothing about it. Just like Taronga, gorillas are a majour draw card and one they can't afford to loose now elephants have jumped ship.

 

[Jambo]

This would be probably the best stop gap, especially since Melbourne seem to have shown no interest with breeding. Making them a bachelor facility until they can work out what comes next would be the best way forward for them. It would also give Taronga a second breeding female, that is a facility that is interested in breeding. Hopefully if they move the males on they can restart breeding and have a few females born.

Right now I do think Taronga is waiting to off load the males to another facility before re-pairing their current pair.

Kibali's quite a valuable male too (both his parents coming from relatively unrepresented lines). If we are to assume his sons will be in a bachelor group for the immediate future it would be good to get at least a daughter or two from him. In the event Kanzi is sent across, she'd allow more breeding recommendations to be given to Kibali.

 

[Zoofan15]

It'll be interesting to see what Kimya cause of death was, and whether keeping her in the current troop that isnt ideal had anything to do with it i.e stress. Primates tend to suffer cardiac conditions like humans and continued stress can cause it.

Hopefully this will be the wake up call the zoo management need. They have sat on this issue for far too long and done nothing about it. Just like Taronga, gorillas are a majour draw card and one they can't afford to loose now elephants have jumped ship.

A common cause of death in prime aged female gorillas is reproductive related issues, so something like pyrometra/a uterine infection wouldn’t surprise me. It’s difficult to diagnose and can quickly become fatal.

You’re correct that urgent action will need to be taken. Whether that’s sourcing new females or transferring Kanzi out. She can’t remain in a 1.1 pair and being father/daughter, there’s no option for breeding.

 

[Jambo]

Considering Werribee has an ageing bachelor troop, forming a younger bachelor troop at Melbourne now means they could also have the option to switch back to breeding within 20 years (with the younger troop transferred to Werribee to replace their males as they inevitably pass on).

That would be my ideal plan if Melbourne do have plans to renovate the whole complex and improve it. A decent sized indoor exhibit would be nice, although I acknowledge there really isn't much space for this in the current location.

In this scenario, once Motaba passes on, my preference too would be to see the younger Taronga males sent to Werribee with Yakini then sent to Melbourne to head up the new breeding troop. Ganyeka could then stay and be introduced to the younger males or head to Orana (whichever situation is percieved as being best for him).

 

[Tiger91]

It would have been so valuable to have had Sydney Zoo and Adelaide Zoo come onboard to hold this species. Had that materialised (and Orana imported the breeding troop they had planned), it would have enabled continued breeding at Taronga and Melbourne.

Considering Werribee has an ageing bachelor troop, forming a younger bachelor troop at Melbourne now means they could also have the option to switch back to breeding within 20 years (with the younger troop transferred to Werribee to replace their males as they inevitably pass on).

Even once the old male at Werribee who I can never remember the name of, once he passes trying to integrate his older sons with the younger Taronga males at Werribee would be a great idea.
Even if Werribee had two exhibits, or Back of house facilities where they could rotate the troops on and of display. They could take the males from Taronga, use them as a stop gap while they organise a future breeding group/ plane there imports. Then send the Taronga male to Werribee.

Taronga has western plains with no real primate outside of a few aging gibbons. They have plenty of exhibits that have filler animals in them these days from lost species over the years. There is no reason they should not be taking and building a gorilla exhibit. The zoo would benefit tremendously from it. Equally if taronga focusses on there gorillas as there next project and redevelops there site into a gorillas complex that can house the breeding troops and a bachelor troop. The zoo has the space, and they are arguably one of there most popular species, chuck in pygmy hippo enclosures and colobus enclosures near by and they have there Congo precinct. All the while hugely benefiting gorillas at the same time even from a breeding/population management position.

 

[Zoofan15]

Even once the old male at Werribee who I can never remember the name of, once he passes trying to integrate his older sons with the younger Taronga males at Werribee would be a great idea.
Even if Werribee had two exhibits, or Back of house facilities where they could rotate the troops on and of display. They could take the males from Taronga, use them as a stop gap while they organise a future breeding group/ plane there imports. Then send the Taronga male to Werribee.

Taronga has western plains with no real primate outside of a few aging gibbons. They have plenty of exhibits that have filler animals in them these days from lost species over the years. There is no reason they should not be taking and building a gorilla exhibit. The zoo would benefit tremendously from it. Equally if taronga focusses on there gorillas as there next project and redevelops there site into a gorillas complex that can house the breeding troops and a bachelor troop. The zoo has the space, and they are arguably one of there most popular species, chuck in pygmy hippo enclosures and colobus enclosures near by and they have there Congo precinct. All the while hugely benefiting gorillas at the same time even from a breeding/population management position.

Motaba, yes. He’s born 1983 so is getting on in years and will inevitably leave behind his two sons, who are also now in their mid-20’s.

Another option could be for the bachelor troop to be formed at Taronga Zoo. The adolescents would inhabit the main exhibit; with Otana in the annex. The ideal scenario would be a full integration; but worst case scenario, he’d be housed in the immediate vicinity of these males if they couldn’t be successfully introduced.

Australasian Gorilla Population (2025)

Taronga Zoo:

1.0 Kibali (25/03/2001) Yaounde x Moseka; Imported 2012
0.1 Frala (14/06/1981) Bongo x Mintha; Imported 1996
0.1 Johari (26/04/2000) Motoba x Julia
0.1 Mbeli (05/02/2003) Kibabu x Mouila
1.0 Mjukuu (30/10/2014) Kibali x Mbeli
1.0 Fabumi (13/05/2015) Kibali x Frala
1.0 Mwamba (02/09/2017 Kibali x Mbeli

Melbourne Zoo:

1.0 Otana (28/01/2001) Kouillou x Tamba; Imported 2013
0.1 Kanzi (14/03/2015) Otana x Kimya

Werribee Open Range Zoo:

1.0 Motaba (23/12/1983) Jambo x Nandi; Imported 1990
1.0 Yakini (28/11/1999) Motoba x Yuska
1.0 Ganyeka (29/04/2000) Motoba x G-Ann

Mogo Zoo:

1.0 Kisane (18/08/2006) Djanghou x Sanki; Imported 2019
0.1 G-Ann (08/06/1979) Moemba x Fern; Imported 1997
0.1 Kriba (09/08/1979) Bongo x Mouila; Imported 1996
0.1 Kipenzi (14/01/2011) Kibabu x Kriba
1.0 Kaius (21/10/2022) Kisane x Kipenzi
0.0.1 Unnamed (10/02/2025) Kisane x Kipenzi

Orana Wildlife Park:

1.0 Fataki (24/05/2003) Kibabu x Frala
1.0 Fuzu (08/12/2007) Kibabu x Frala

Total regional population: 12.7.1

 

[Jambo]

Motaba, yes. He’s born 1983 so is getting on in years and will inevitably leave behind his two sons, who are also now in their mid-20’s.

Another option could be for the bachelor troop to be formed at Taronga Zoo. The adolescents would inhabit the main exhibit; with Otana in the annex. The ideal scenario would be a full integration; but worst case scenario, he’d be housed in the immediate vicinity of these males if they couldn’t be successfully introduced.

Australasian Gorilla Population (2025)

Taronga Zoo:

1.0 Kibali (25/03/2001) Yaounde x Moseka; Imported 2012
0.1 Frala (14/06/1981) Bongo x Mintha; Imported 1996
0.1 Johari (26/04/2000) Motoba x Julia
0.1 Mbeli (05/02/2003) Kibabu x Mouila
1.0 Mjukuu (30/10/2014) Kibali x Mbeli
1.0 Fabumi (13/05/2015) Kibali x Frala
1.0 Mwamba (02/09/2017 Kibali x Mbeli

Melbourne Zoo:

1.0 Otana (28/01/2001) Kouillou x Tamba; Imported 2013
0.1 Kanzi (14/03/2015) Otana x Kimya

Werribee Open Range Zoo:

1.0 Motaba (23/12/1983) Jambo x Nandi; Imported 1990
1.0 Yakini (28/11/1999) Motoba x Yuska
1.0 Ganyeka (29/04/2000) Motoba x G-Ann

Mogo Zoo:

1.0 Kisane (18/08/2006) Djanghou x Sanki; Imported 2019
0.1 G-Ann (08/06/1979) Moemba x Fern; Imported 1997
0.1 Kriba (09/08/1979) Bongo x Mouila; Imported 1996
0.1 Kipenzi (14/01/2011) Kibabu x Kriba
1.0 Kaius (21/10/2022) Kisane x Kipenzi

Orana Wildlife Park:

1.0 Fataki (24/05/2003) Kibabu x Frala
1.0 Fuzu (08/12/2007) Kibabu x Frala

Total regional population: 12.8

Motaba also has a heart condition that he's been treated for for more than two decades now. I believe this was part of the reason why bachelor life was chosen for him so soon, viewed as a form of retirement for him to lessen his stresses (which his sons haven't done much better at non contributing too). At 41 now he is in his twilight years so Zoos Vic as a whole may also be keeping this in mind when making decisions on Melbourne's troop now.

If Otana was to be moved into a bachelor facility, the best choice would be Orana imo. They have an an additional outdoor enclosure that can be utilised in the event he isn't able to be integrated with their two males. Since the two brothers have also fought a fair bit since Mahali's death it would also be beneficial to add another male into the mix to balance things out.

 

[Tiger91]

Motaba, yes. He’s born 1983 so is getting on in years and will inevitably leave behind his two sons, who are also now in their mid-20’s.

Another option could be for the bachelor troop to be formed at Taronga Zoo. The adolescents would inhabit the main exhibit; with Otana in the annex. The ideal scenario would be a full integration; but worst case scenario, he’d be housed in the immediate vicinity of these males if they couldn’t be successfully introduced.

Australasian Gorilla Population (2025)

Taronga Zoo:

1.0 Kibali (25/03/2001) Yaounde x Moseka; Imported 2012
0.1 Frala (14/06/1981) Bongo x Mintha; Imported 1996
0.1 Johari (26/04/2000) Motoba x Julia
0.1 Mbeli (05/02/2003) Kibabu x Mouila
1.0 Mjukuu (30/10/2014) Kibali x Mbeli
1.0 Fabumi (13/05/2015) Kibali x Frala
1.0 Mwamba (02/09/2017 Kibali x Mbeli

Melbourne Zoo:

1.0 Otana (28/01/2001) Kouillou x Tamba; Imported 2013
0.1 Kanzi (14/03/2015) Otana x Kimya

Werribee Open Range Zoo:

1.0 Motaba (23/12/1983) Jambo x Nandi; Imported 1990
1.0 Yakini (28/11/1999) Motoba x Yuska
1.0 Ganyeka (29/04/2000) Motoba x G-Ann

Mogo Zoo:

1.0 Kisane (18/08/2006) Djanghou x Sanki; Imported 2019
0.1 G-Ann (08/06/1979) Moemba x Fern; Imported 1997
0.1 Kriba (09/08/1979) Bongo x Mouila; Imported 1996
0.1 Kipenzi (14/01/2011) Kibabu x Kriba
1.0 Kaius (21/10/2022) Kisane x Kipenzi
0.0.1 Unnamed (10/02/2025) Kisane x Kipenzi

Orana Wildlife Park:

1.0 Fataki (24/05/2003) Kibabu x Frala
1.0 Fuzu (08/12/2007) Kibabu x Frala

Total regional population: 12.7.1

With Melbournes lack of actually trying to breed gorillas. Do we really want to send the females down to them. Since 2014 Taronga has had 4 infants from 2 females. While mebourne has had 1 infant from 1 female in the same time frame. You can't say they dont have the space to have kept breeding and have had at least another infant. Even with the 3 gorillas there exhibit is practically empty.

At this point keeping the females together at a facility that is actively trying to breed gorillas will be the best thing regionally until they decide what is going to happen. Whether we import new females or the regional coordinators decide to sit and try and breed more females. This puts Melbourne in a position where they can attain 3 gorilla and possibly have a troop of 4 by attaining the Taronga boys. Which would appear to sit with what they are wanting. Let's not beat around the bush if they wanted to continue breeding or expand the troop above the 3 they would have done it in the last decade.

 

[Zoofan15]

With Melbournes lack of actually trying to breed gorillas. Do we really want to send the females down to them. Since 2014 Taronga has had 4 infants from 2 females. While mebourne has had 1 infant from 1 female in the same time frame. You can't say they dont have the space to have kept breeding and have had at least another infant. Even with the 3 gorillas there exhibit is practically empty.

At this point keeping the females together at a facility that is actively trying to breed gorillas will be the best thing regionally until they decide what is going to happen. Whether we import new females or the regional coordinators decide to sit and try and breed more females. This puts Melbourne in a position where they can attain 3 gorilla and possibly have a troop of 4. Which would appear to sit with what they are wanting. Let's not beat around the bush if they wanted to continue breeding or expand the troop above the 3 they would have done it in the last decade.

Melbourne have certainly had the space, but bear in mind that Otana began by heading up a troop of three females, two who were designated as non-breeding from the outset. That straight away limited the output of their troop compared to Taronga, who had two successful breeders; and a third young female they attempted (unsuccessfully) to breed from.

I agree what Melbourne really needed was adolescent or young adult females to join there troop. This would have ensured a cohort of young and gave options for creating a bachelor troop with Otana; supplying other zoos with young females etc.

 

[Jambo]

With Melbournes lack of actually trying to breed gorillas. Do we really want to send the females down to them. Since 2014 Taronga has had 4 infants from 2 females. While mebourne has had 1 infant from 1 female in the same time frame. You can't say they dont have the space to have kept breeding and have had at least another infant. Even with the 3 gorillas there exhibit is practically empty.

At this point keeping the females together at a facility that is actively trying to breed gorillas will be the best thing regionally until they decide what is going to happen. Whether we import new females or the regional coordinators decide to sit and try and breed more females. This puts Melbourne in a position where they can attain 3 gorilla and possibly have a troop of 4 by attaining the Taronga boys. Which would appear to sit with what they are wanting. Let's not beat around the bush if they wanted to continue breeding or expand the troop above the 3 they would have done it in the last decade.

Melbourne's had the unfortunate luck of having just a single breeding female; Taronga practically had three (although one never conceived).

I think it's also important to note Melbourne may have been unwilling to risk breeding from Kimya again due to Otana's previous behaviour following Kanzi's birth. Especially since they still had an elderly Yuska in the troop, who by all means wasn't the most socially competent gorilla.

I do agree that it's best at this point that we direct all of our breeding resources to one specific facility (Melbourne or Taronga). Inevitably, Taronga's males will need placement regionally. So why not fix all these issues at the same time!!

 

[Tiger91]

Melbourne have certainly had the space, but bear in mind that Otana began by heading up a troop of three females, two who were designated as non-breeding from the outset. That straight away limited the output of their troop compared to Taronga, who had two successful breeders; and a third young female they attempted (unsuccessfully) to breed from.

I agree what Melbourne really needed was adolescent or young adult females to join there troop. This would have ensured a cohort of young and gave options for creating a bachelor troop with Otana; supplying other zoos with young females etc.

In the last decade since their last birth, they have well and truly had the space to have had at least another birth. Mogo has a larger troop and of memory a smaller overall area and yet have now had two births in essentially two years. Who ever is coordinating gorillas at Melbourne has been coordinating them poorly for some time. Two of there elderly females have passed, and still no movement of either importing females or trying to breed up numbers, even when kimya was kept in not entirely ideal social situations. Instead kimya was/has been kept on contraceptives as some have reported. To me sending the females to Melbourne is the same decision making that was sending that male hippo overseas instead of retaining him or removing Thong dee from the breeding program for elephants. The idea at an individual level isnt bad, but it doesn't bode well for a fruitful future.

 

[Tiger91]

Melbourne's had the unfortunate luck of having just a single breeding female; Taronga practically had three (although one never conceived).

I think it's also important to note Melbourne may have been unwilling to risk breeding from Kimya again due to Otana's previous behaviour following Kanzi's birth. Especially since they still had an elderly Yuska in the troop, who by all means wasn't the most socially competent gorilla.

I do agree that it's best at this point that we direct all of our breeding resources to one specific facility (Melbourne or Taronga). Inevitably, Taronga's males will need placement regionally. So why not fix all these issues at the same time!!

Even in the last decade/11 years. Taronga has had 2 offspring for every breeding female. Melbourne has had one. If Otana is the reason they held of from breeding a second infant. That right there is a majour red flag to not send reproductive females to Melbourne and send Kanzi to Taronga to breed.

 

[Jambo]

In the last decade since their last birth, they have well and truly had the space to have had at least another birth. Mogo has a larger troop and of memory a smaller overall area and yet have now had two births in essentially two years. Who ever is coordinating gorillas at Melbourne has been coordinating them poorly for some time. Two of there elderly females have passed, and still no movement of either importing females or trying to breed up numbers, even when kimya was kept in not entirely ideal social situations. Instead kimya was/has been kept on contraceptives as some have reported. To me sending the females to Melbourne is the same decision making that was sending that male hippo overseas instead of retaining him or removing Thong dee from the breeding program for elephants. The idea at an individual level isnt bad, but it doesn't bode well for a fruitful future.

Very true but I feel like your missing the point here. Otana is perhaps the reasoning why management has been so cautious with acquiring new females for Melbourne's group. Looking at how he's reacted to females in the past; there would be a lot of risk involved. And do Melbourne really want to place a specific gorillas welfare in jeopardy just for breeding purposes. I think that's where they draw the line in the sand.

Also it's important to remember Melbourne themselves don't make these decisions. They can provide 'recommendations' to the studbook coordinator but effectively it's the coordinator who makes decisions on breeding and transfer recommendations based on advice from the European program too (of whom our region operates as an extension too).

 

[Zoofan15]

In the last decade since their last birth, they have well and truly had the space to have had at least another birth. Mogo has a larger troop and of memory a smaller overall area and yet have now had two births in essentially two years. Who ever is coordinating gorillas at Melbourne has been coordinating them poorly for some time. Two of there elderly females have passed, and still no movement of either importing females or trying to breed up numbers, even when kimya was kept in not entirely ideal social situations. Instead kimya was/has been kept on contraceptives as some have reported. To me sending the females to Melbourne is the same decision making that was sending that male hippo overseas instead of retaining him or removing Thong dee from the breeding program for elephants. The idea at an individual level isnt bad, but it doesn't bode well for a fruitful future.

When I visited in November 2023, I was told there likely hadn’t been a repeat breeding recommendation due to Kimya being from a well represented line (Otana also). Yes the same could be said about Kipenzi, but Kisane is more valuable genetically and a second infant will be invaluable to the troop’s social structure.

Like @Jambo said though, there could also have been an underlying reason such as the potential for a subsequent infant in Melbourne’s troop causing Otana to direct aggression towards Yuska. Socially, the troop was at least stable during that time, which was an improvement on the previous issues with Otana/Julia.

 

[Tiger91]

I havent missed the point with Otana being an issue, but it proves the point Melbourne should not be the facility we send reproductive females to. Especially with our current numbers and need to concentrate females for breeding.

SSP coordinators work with zoo's, if they wanted to shift him to a bachelor facility or out for breeding. Especially if Melbourne can find a zoo willing to take him the SSP won't hinder the effort. Just as zoo's can breed outside of recommendations as Adelaide did with the tigers. They however have to take responsibility for housing the resulting offspring for life as the SSP may never have a use for them.

ETA: Either way mebourne is in a very precarious position if they wish to continue with gorilla they have few moves on the chess board left.

 

[Jambo]

Even in the last decade/11 years. Taronga has had 2 offspring for every breeding female. Melbourne has had one. If Otana is the reason they held of from breeding a second infant. That right there is a majour red flag to not send reproductive females to Melbourne and send Kanzi to Taronga to breed.

Exactly and to be fair, Melbourne and the coordinator will have to assess the current situation and look at what's best for the gorillas themselves.

Importing from overseas is a whole exercise as many of us know. In the possible case Otana rejects the females coming across, there would be a huge issue. Sending them back would not be advisable and regionally we don't have many back up options. There's plenty of things that would need to be considered; more than just the surface level.

 

[Tiger91]

Exactly and to be fair, Melbourne and the coordinator will have to assess the current situation and look at what's best for the gorillas themselves.

Importing from overseas is a whole exercise as many of us know. In the possible case Otana rejects the females coming across, there would be a huge issue. Sending them back would not be advisable and regionally we don't have many back up options. There's plenty of things that would need to be considered; more than just the surface level.

Unfortunately he isnt on the older side either. But I agree having him as the silverback isnt ideal.

 

[Zoofan15]

Exactly and to be fair, Melbourne and the coordinator will have to assess the current situation and look at what's best for the gorillas themselves.

Importing from overseas is a whole exercise as many of us know. In the possible case Otana rejects the females coming across, there would be a huge issue. Sending them back would not be advisable and regionally we don't have many back up options. There's plenty of things that would need to be considered; more than just the surface level.

That in itself raises an interesting point that if there is a plan for Taronga to acquire an additional female/females, they may wait until any females Melbourne import are settled into Otana’s troop. This gives a contingency of transferring them on to Taronga should they not be accepted.

 

[Jambo]

New I havent missed the point with Otana being an issue, but it proves the point Melbourne should not be the facility we send reproductive females to. Especially with our current numbers and need to concentrate females for breeding.

SSP coordinators work with zoo's, if they wanted to shift him to a bachelor facility or out for breeding. Especially if Melbourne can find a zoo willing to take him the SSP won't hinder the effort. Just as zoo's can breed outside of recommendations as Adelaide did with the tigers. They however have to take responsibility for housing the resulting offspring for life as the SSP may never have a use for them.

Due to his temperament and history it would be incredibly difficult to place him in a bachelor facility. This is the issue they have had for a while as they could've easily switched him out for a new male if he was perceived to be an inadequate silverback.

However with the situation Melbourne are now in they may be forced to have to try and integrate new females with him. Sometimes risks need to be taken, which can lead to positive results. In the case the Taronga girls aren't accepted Melbourne could at least hang their hats in trying.