Lowland gorillas in Europe 2009
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Thank you Pertinax, I had overlooked Kibabu, who has certainly been a success story - but I did remember Djomie who was not (although the circumstances were different).
Presumably they will be looking to replace Kijo, but otherwise they do not need as many blackbacks as they have.
Alan
I didn't include Jomie on the list as he was always owned by London, so they could recall him when they wanted- as you said, different circumstances.
I also think it may be some while before they replace Kijo- as I believe someone said that a female(Dihi?) was pregnant to him posthumously. When they do, they have ten adult and nearly adult silverbacks to choose from + Djala's two eldest sons(Jaja & Dishi) coming along as well. Djala's group currently has as 'natural' a composition as you can see anywhere in captivity.
Kolmarden Zoo new baby
Have just seen photos on Flickr taken on 11th July, showing a baby Gorilla with its mother. Website says the baby was born 20th May, is a male, mother Naomi, father Efata (as stated, but it could still be the younger male 'Nasibu' who was sent to Lisbon in December). To my knowledge they have still not tested the older baby 'Enzo' to determine his paternity for sure.
Have just seen photos on Flickr taken on 11th July, showing a baby Gorilla with its mother. Website says the baby was born 20th May, is a male, mother Naomi, father Efata (as stated, but it could still be the younger male 'Nasibu' who was sent to Lisbon in December). To my knowledge they have still not tested the older baby 'Enzo' to determine his paternity for sure.
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According to the gorilla studbook on gorilla haven, Yola at La Palmyre zoo has given birth to her third offspring and it seems this baby is finally making it AND it`s mother-reared too! Here is a picture in a french zoo board:
Les zoos dans le monde • Afficher le sujet - Les bébés 2009
That`s great news, a mother-reared gorilla is always good news, but especially in La Palmyre, since they had nothing but back luck with their baby gorillas in the last years and the parents are genetically important, too. Father Bongo has only one living relative (full brother Jock in Bristol, who has only 2 living offspring at the moment), and mother Yola is one of the few offspring from the Berlin gorillas.
Les zoos dans le monde • Afficher le sujet - Les bébés 2009
That`s great news, a mother-reared gorilla is always good news, but especially in La Palmyre, since they had nothing but back luck with their baby gorillas in the last years and the parents are genetically important, too. Father Bongo has only one living relative (full brother Jock in Bristol, who has only 2 living offspring at the moment), and mother Yola is one of the few offspring from the Berlin gorillas.
Lets hope they are successful with this one. I believe father 'Bongo' killed at least one of the previous ones when it was born. La Palmyre have had a bad Gorilla history with a lot of deaths over the years, both adults and young, and only a few surviving infants.
taun
Well-Known Member
Is this just bad luck? or is there an underlying problems in the group?
They have had a lot of different gorillas over the years and a lot of deaths.
They have lost(in succession) at least three different breeding silverbacks including Balu the father of their existing male(and Jock) and all their original adult females too.
I haven't been there but I think they have pretty poor 'open' enclosures leading to a lot of stress. Also the breeding 'group' is only the male Bongo and two females, and previously was only one female.
There are two 'bachelor' silverback brothers called Mike & Nyuki who live seperately in a 'grotto' style enclosure and are probably stuck there for life as they aren't good mixers.. All in all its not an ideal settup.
taun
Well-Known Member
There are two 'bachelor' silverback brothers called Mike & Nyuki who live seperately in a 'grotto' style enclosure and are probably stuck there for life as they aren't good mixers.. All in all its not an ideal settup.
These bachelor gorilla's near the breeding "group"? As this would also add to the stress.
I don't think they can see each other.
I think the whole setup just isn't very good but maybe better now the male/female 'group' is more than a 1.1 situation..
taun
Well-Known Member
Thanks,
Going off topic but still on Gorillas does anyone know Chester's likely source of Gorillas for heart of Africa?
Could be from any of the EEP Gorilla-holding zoos which have suitable animals(i.e.animals that need to leave or can be spared from their groups) available at the time to become the founders of a new group at Chester.
Bearing in mind this is several years away yet, two UK candidates could be male Kesho(Dublin) & female Namoki(Bristol) and perhaps one or two more females sourced from Europe. That's provided they have breeders, not bachelors- which I hope is the case.
I have never been in La Palmyre and dont have any details about their breeding group, but I`d say that if a silverback repeatedly kills and attacks his own offspring, something is not right.. the first surviving offspring of the current breeding group, male Monza, is being handreared in Stuttgart after Bongo injured him badly.
Enclosure-wise, things have thankfully improved for all great apes this spring - La Palmyre just openend a new great ape facility for orang utans, chimps and the 2 gorilla groups. You can find a lot of pictures here:
Les zoos dans le monde • Afficher le sujet - Complexe grands singes du Zoo de La Palmyre
The old gorilla enclosures were terrible and totally inadequate for apes (too small and waaay too open, without climbing structures ect.). The new facility has 4 rather large islands and the layout looks at lot like Leipzig`s Pongoland, so space-wise it seems good now, unfortunately both indoor and outdoor enclosures are way too open and lack climbing opportunties and hiding space. The whole facility could be world-class if the enclosures were better equipped and had more trees/shrub/climbing structures and 100x more ropes and hammocks. In the current state, the chimp island is pretty bad and while the other islands are better (some big trees), there is much to improve...
I very much hope Bongo is less stressed in the new enclosure, and therefore more relaxed and less agressive against his family.
Enclosure-wise, things have thankfully improved for all great apes this spring - La Palmyre just openend a new great ape facility for orang utans, chimps and the 2 gorilla groups. You can find a lot of pictures here:
Les zoos dans le monde • Afficher le sujet - Complexe grands singes du Zoo de La Palmyre
The old gorilla enclosures were terrible and totally inadequate for apes (too small and waaay too open, without climbing structures ect.). The new facility has 4 rather large islands and the layout looks at lot like Leipzig`s Pongoland, so space-wise it seems good now, unfortunately both indoor and outdoor enclosures are way too open and lack climbing opportunties and hiding space. The whole facility could be world-class if the enclosures were better equipped and had more trees/shrub/climbing structures and 100x more ropes and hammocks. In the current state, the chimp island is pretty bad and while the other islands are better (some big trees), there is much to improve...
I very much hope Bongo is less stressed in the new enclosure, and therefore more relaxed and less agressive against his family.
It certainly looks much, much better than the old enclosures for all their Apes. The outdoor areas are much more spacious but still open. The tall Rocks in the enclosures are rather strange- they remind me of 'Stonehenge'(ancient prehistoric monoliths) in the Uk.
Also the funny 'mushroom' things for the gorillas to hide in-they obviously recognise their need for covered places but more vegetation would perhaps be a more natural & better idea? Hopefully more stuff will grow and the open 'newness' will wear off with time. They could still add more climbiing equipment particularly for the Orangutans.
I suspect Bongo will be less stressed in this environment and he now has two females rather than just the one-so they may be able to keep him 'under control' better too.
Also the funny 'mushroom' things for the gorillas to hide in-they obviously recognise their need for covered places but more vegetation would perhaps be a more natural & better idea? Hopefully more stuff will grow and the open 'newness' will wear off with time. They could still add more climbiing equipment particularly for the Orangutans.I suspect Bongo will be less stressed in this environment and he now has two females rather than just the one-so they may be able to keep him 'under control' better too.
Very sad to hear this. But maybe Wuppertal will now get a new male that will breed- I never understood why TamTam didn't....
How sad.
I remember seeing him as a baby at Basel. It makes me feel old
Alan
I remember seeing him as a baby at Basel. It makes me feel old
Alan
I'm sure you know all this Alan, but in case anyone else is interested; TamTam was Goma's only offspring- fathered by her brother Jambo before he went to Jersey. Despite being handraised herself, Goma raised TamTam perfectly. As an adult male he looked exactly like Jambo.
Being mother-raised and with a good social background, I felt sure TamTam would breed at Wuppertal, but he never has. Very mysterious. Infertile?
Being mother-raised and with a good social background, I felt sure TamTam would breed at Wuppertal, but he never has. Very mysterious. Infertile?
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New baby at Howletts.
Baby born 7th July at Howletts to mother Dihi. Dihi is in Kijo's old group so this baby probably represents his final offspring. Dihi originally came from Apenheul.
With this new baby in the group its likely to be a long while yet before they consider adding a new male.
Baby born 7th July at Howletts to mother Dihi. Dihi is in Kijo's old group so this baby probably represents his final offspring. Dihi originally came from Apenheul.
With this new baby in the group its likely to be a long while yet before they consider adding a new male.
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