The future of Birds in Zoos in Aust and NZ

tetrapod

tetrapod

Well-Known Member
15+ year member
I'm sure somebody on this forum will know - how did Melbourne Aquarium import birds (the penguins) from NZ? Knowing full well about the strict import laws, does this mean that birds/eggs can be moved across the Tasman?

Also given that Auckland imported flamingo eggs from the UK several years ago, does this give Australia (and NZ) some hope for improving both the current precarious populations of exotic species and possibly new species that are targeted by the ASMP? It just sounds a bit like an easy (relatively) loophole that could be used.
 
tetrapod said:
Also given that Auckland imported flamingo eggs from the UK several years ago, does this give Australia (and NZ) some hope for improving both the current precarious populations of exotic species and possibly new species that are targeted by the ASMP? It just sounds a bit like an easy (relatively) loophole that could be used.
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sorry I'm a bit late to the party... Anyway, regarding the flamingoes they weren't imported as eggs but as juvenile birds. The eggs were laid by the Slimbridge flock but had to be artificially incubated and the chicks then hand-raised in isolation. Before export they underwent all the usual health checks and then once in NZ went into quarantine again.

NZ zoos can import both eggs and adult birds (unlike private aviculturists who no longer can thanks to certain people doing dodgy things) but there's a lot of red tape, especially with the new biosecurity laws so no zoo is willing to fork up with the time and money except for something like flamingoes.
 
In one of the ARAZPA newsletters there is a story on the Auckland flock and that they have been laying unfertile eggs and it said that they are hoping to breed them.
 
jay said:
I heard that wewre no plans to breed from the flamingo flock?
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where was that? i only ever heard that they DO want to breed them. though flamingos are a very long lived species - its been many years now and i still have heard nothing....
 
I think it was mentioned on here by someone from NZ who seemed to know what was going on in the zoos over there. I'll try to find the thread.
 
Not sure why anybody would say no to breeding flamingoes given the import cost and scarcity in the region! Is there a renewed interest from the Australian zoos? Certainly a bird species (or family) that zoos might consider worth the expense of quarantine and import.
 
tetrapod said:
Not sure why anybody would say no to breeding flamingoes given the import cost and scarcity in the region! Is there a renewed interest from the Australian zoos? Certainly a bird species (or family) that zoos might consider worth the expense of quarantine and import.
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It drives me crazy that we don't have any toucans, hornbills, birds-of-paradise, crowned cranes or reproductive-aged flamingoes in Australia. All birds that are, to some degree, zoo staples overseas and would make great exhibits.

I know people talk about how expensive they are - does anyone actually have figures on how much, say, the Auckland importation of flamingoes cost? I get the feeling that the costs would pale in comparison to the Thai elephants. Now, I'm not suggesting that hornbills match elephants in terms of visitor interest, but still...
 
australian zoos have submitted an IRA for greater flamingoes and crowned cranes with biosecurity australia.

some years back i was told via correspondence with adelaide zoo - that an exotic bird import (or imports as it probably may be) for zoos was being discussed. prioritised were birds already in the import list and included most species here in need of mates or new blood.

from memory it included....

andean condor
razor billed currasow
victoria crowned pigeon
grey crowned crane
greater flamingo
white-cheeked turaco
white rumped shama

and possibly rhea, but i'm not suer about that one..

now obviously there are no toucans or hornbills on that list - but you can't much complain with that! shamas are a bit of a waste of effort and money. they are not the most attractive of birds and already four other asian (some singing) softbill species are available in aviculture in australia.

turacos are as spectacular to me as any hornbill. so i am UBER excited about the prospect of those!

personally i prefer the lesser flamingoes - but i'm probably alone there.

i'd add golden breasted glossy starlings, blyth's horbills and a bird of paradise species and i'd be pretty much happy with that making up our exotics.

werribee has a lagoon in the centre of the entrance precinct that is just begging for crowned cranes and a flamingo flock. (i'd throw in a few egyptian geese as well)
 
phoenix said:
australian zoos have submitted an IRA for greater flamingoes and crowned cranes with biosecurity australia.

some years back i was told via correspondence with adelaide zoo - that an exotic bird import (or imports as it probably may be) for zoos was being discussed. prioritised were birds already in the import list and included most species here in need of mates or new blood.

from memory it included....

andean condor
razor billed currasow
victoria crowned pigeon
grey crowned crane
greater flamingo
white-cheeked turaco
white rumped shama

and possibly rhea, but i'm not suer about that one..

now obviously there are no toucans or hornbills on that list - but you can't much complain with that! shamas are a bit of a waste of effort and money. they are not the most attractive of birds and already four other asian (some singing) softbill species are available in aviculture in australia.

turacos are as spectacular to me as any hornbill. so i am UBER excited about the prospect of those!

personally i prefer the lesser flamingoes - but i'm probably alone there.

i'd add golden breasted glossy starlings, blyth's horbills and a bird of paradise species and i'd be pretty much happy with that making up our exotics.

werribee has a lagoon in the centre of the entrance precinct that is just begging for crowned cranes and a flamingo flock. (i'd throw in a few egyptian geese as well)
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Looking at the species you've mentioned, you appear to have the same priority that I do - the ability to display mixed-species aviaries from each of Papua New Guinea, Asia, Africa and South America.

I do think that toucans - probably toco and keel-billed - would be a crowd pleaser... and you wouldn't limit yourself to just one hornbill and bird of paradise species. Surely an IRA would cover all of them and you'd make applications for a number of species established in captivity to be added to the list for import.

A big part of me wants scarlet ibis, though I'm aware that glossy ibis are the recommended species. But they'd go well in a South American aviary. Also - to complement the flamingoes and crowned cranes in an "African wetlands" exhibit, hamerkop and shoebills (I know the chances of actually getting these in the near future would be dim, but there's no reason not to get the regulatory environment amenable in advance) would be excellent.
 
CGSwans said:
Looking at the species you've mentioned, you appear to have the same priority that I do - the ability to display mixed-species aviaries from each of Papua New Guinea, Asia, Africa and South America.
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precisely! since we have parrots finches, and even doves covered for all these regions - its about topping up what we have with some star species that show the diversity of global birdlife. its hilarious that you mention scarlet ibis - they are one species i didn't mention that i always also include on my imaginary list. mixed with locally sourced cattle egrets (and some wild-looking muscovy ducks) and you have a south american wetland.

i could talk about this all day. but this is probably the wrong thread. you should have a dig around for some old ones that discusses all this...and we can continue the conversation there.
 
phoenix said:
precisely! since we have parrots finches, and even doves covered for all these regions - its about topping up what we have with some star species that show the diversity of global birdlife. its hilarious that you mention scarlet ibis - they are one species i didn't mention that i always also include on my imaginary list. mixed with locally sourced cattle egrets (and some wild-looking muscovy ducks) and you have a south american wetland.

i could talk about this all day. but this is probably the wrong thread. you should have a dig around for some old ones that discusses all this...and we can continue the conversation there.
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It'd probably be better for a moderator to split this thread in two, from the point where we started talking about flamingoes. Easier that way, and comments don't get lost along the way.

Other species that would be particularly useful would be king vultures, Andean cocks-of-the-rock and hummingbirds from South America. Do we have any species of weaver bird from Africa? I think we have red bishops in aviculture?

What needs to happen (after an Avian IRA of course) is for one of the zoos, possibly one of the private ones, to decide that they will make their bird collection a point of difference from competitors. Or at least, to actually perceive other zoos in the country as competitors.

One of the mostly unrecognised reasons that we have such falling diversity of zoo-fauna in this country is that the major zoos - those that could afford to import species - act in almost a cartel-like fashion through ARAZPA. I remember reading as one of the justifications of regional planning by ARAZPA the point that most people will only visit one or two zoos in their lifetime, so they don't expect or need strong differences between the country's various collections. The basic premise being that each zoo has its own intrinsic visitor base, and that zoos won't (perhaps shouldn't?) compete with each other for those visitors. I don't accept that premise.
 
CGSwans - you have to remember that we probably have less zoos in all of australasia than there are in a single US state. and given the expense and difficulty in importing/acquiring species - expecting zoos to maintain both diversity within their collections and diversity from one another is pretty unrealistic.

what i want to see is a high range of diversity at individual zoos but regionally next to none. its a bit of a fallacy that australian zoos have diminished collections. we don't (especially up until a couple of year ago). there are beavers, sloth, squirrels, 3 types of bears, plenty of antelope, both types of hippo, all 3 types of rhino held in captivity, both asian and african elephants and most of the primates and big cats for example.

what we don't have is sustainable populations of these.

now one of my issues is that, whilst i agree rationalising the collection is one way to combat the problem - i also believe that zoos are consistently failing to address a more proactive solution which is to hold more members of each given species.

instead they keep pouring cash into immersion exhibit that take up even more space for less animals (both individuals and species).

add the pressure of maintaining different species to one another - and things become painfully unrealistic. don't get me started on unproductiveness that is taronga importing dhole or francois langurs and the backflipping on commitments that goes on within ARAZPA's major member zoos...

so i'm afraid i totally disagree with you on that issue and feel quite the opposite.

zoos can compete in the way they exhibit the same species. but really, i don't need two types of sloth to be happy. geeze - i'd be happy if we could just maintain one!
 
I remember hearing it would cost $500 per day per flamingo for quarantine overseas. I heard this from a keeper at Adelaide and that was the reason they didn't want to get more, that was two years ago.
 
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