Melbourne Zoo Melbourne Zoo Developments

patrick said:
fill the moats with water, similar to the taronga exhibit or build high walls similar to tarongas chimp or orang exhibit.

its acyually a bit of a creative challange as i see it and could eventually be an awesome exhibit. especially if that red "mock rock" work got a facelift.
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1. I'm always fearful of water with Apes, even if they've been used to it before(melbourne's haven't). But over and above that, it uses up valuable spatial area which the animals could otherwise use.

2. Creative challenge- absolutely- I don't mind what they do really but just hope they do something with it....

3. The 'Ayers Rock' rockface simply needs recoating a better colour?
 
Grantsmb, what you want is actually the current plan. ie: the moats infilled, the rockwork reduced with a glass viewing wall around where there is public access. I think the whole thing is on hold until the new 'stories of the sea' precinct is completed. People get really annoyed when there's construction going on all over the place and the current job is pretty big.

Not all the grottos interconnect from the front or public part of the exhibit. With some of the end ones you have to go to the night dens (which interconnect) and come back out again.

...not sure about the long term plan for the baboons.....there won't be much breeding going on at all - I'm pretty sure all the males have been desexed so there's little hope of a group of 50. I hope they're not being phased out.

.....tiger cubs turn one next Sunday.....
 
there is pretty big population of hamadryas baboons in australia some of the smaller zoos have them and i belive they are even bred by some institutions for as a research animal. i don't think there are any plans to phase them out.

tell me zookiah63 - whats the long-term plan for the tiger cubs? do any have plaements in other zoos arranged? i assume the clouded leopard moved to make space for some of the cubs in the big cats complex, is that correct?

is the filling in of the lake opposite the tigers a gibbon (given)? thats a really dumb decision in my books. especially since there is space opposite the current tiger enclosure.

any other whispers going round?
 
I agree with grantsmb that a really LARGE groups of baboons would look great. And the corner of the zoo where the baboons are currently located is the most uninteresting corner of the property. I think macaques are bred for research as well (doesn't Monash have some?)

The red pandas are difficult to see (too high up in the trees). The goodfellows tree kangaroo is only being housed opposite the baboons temporarily and the Little Penguins (can't call them Fairy Penguins any more.....it's politically incorrect) will be relocated to the new precinct when it's completed. I haven't heard anything about what they'll be doing to that part of the zoo but it seems they're definitely making room for something.

The clouded leopard is being moved to make room for a new snow leopard male that's coming in....not sure when....he'll be introduced to the young female and the two that are already together will stay where they are. They're getting really old (16+) and the female is losing her sight which is why there are no plans to move them.

The binturongs have already relocated to the old otter enclosure and there's an animal watch on at the moment.

I think the female has already been allocated somewhere (i haven't even bothered to ask about that ....... that's very irresponsible of me) but nothing firm......you know how these things change. The cubs won't be going anywhere for another twelve months - they're hardly cubs any more - they're almost as big as their mum.

The lake probably will be filled in because there'll be a new lake to which the pelicans, cormorants and herons will be relocated and the current lake is really stinky.

If I hear anything - you'll be the first to know!
 
its really stinky because the pelicans, herons and cormorants live in it and fill it with guanao! if they move them no doubt the water would clear and stop smelling.

as i've said before it would take very little effort to make the two islands highly suitable for displaying gibbons and langurs. the fact that two sides of the lake have raised boardwalks affording elevated views of the tall trees on the isands makes them seem ideal to me. neither melbourne's white-cheeked or javan langurs are allocated very much space in the treetop apes and monkeys exhibit. which seems a little absurd since even without developing the islands in the asia precinct there are two other suitable islands with primate cages built on them sitting empty around the zoo.

but thats just my opinion.

nonetheless, nothing seems better a better centrepeice to an asian rainforest themed zoo precinct that an ornamental lake. they have never utilised that space as well as they could but with the large waterbirds gone, it could become avery attractive asian watergarden.
 
I know why that lake stinks......

it would be great to have the WC Gibbon on the island opposite the orangs/siamangs.....excellent idea...not sure if the langurs are staying (I thought they were being phased out).

The island with the primate cage probably won't be used for primates in future.
 
Sorry Zoo Boy - nearly forgot about you. The otters are now in the enclosure that used to house the pygmy hippo (that went to Taronga) and yes, it has been said before....but that's OK.
 
the javan langurs are being phased-out, but most likely being replaced with francois langur. take into account teh lifespan of monkeys and the zoo has no reason to not develop appropriate accomodation for is current javan langurs, knowing that that the enclosure will always be utilised by langurs, albeit even if they are a different species in the long term.
 
zookiah63 said:
Grantsmb, what you want is actually the current plan. ie: the moats infilled, the rockwork reduced with a glass viewing wall around where there is public access.
Not all the grottos interconnect from the front or public part of the exhibit. With some of the end ones you have to go to the night dens (which interconnect) and come back out again.
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Well, that's really pleasing to hear. As I said before, they may be wise to keep the grottoes as seperate enclosures, perhaps accessed by doors in the dividing walls- just in case they have to split the males up at maturity. Not a very attractive thought but silverbacks often don't get along together!
 
zookiah63 said:
I agree with grantsmb that a really LARGE groups of baboons would look great. And the corner of the zoo where the baboons are currently located is the most uninteresting corner of the property.
I can promise you they would. Although not 'endangered' they do make one of the best/active and most interesting primate exhibits a Zoo can exhibit. I expect even in those grotty cages, they still show an interesting range of behavior. The only thing they can't do really is 'travel' around the enclosure as they do in bigger exhibits. (The bear enclosure would be fine for them..;))
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the future for baboons.......

looking at the plan for hamadryas baboons there are some interesting issues. it seems adelaide want out of keeping baboons, but fortunately are planning on developing exhibits for two breeding groups in the very near future at monarto. crocdylus park also are listing an intention to hold a much needed batchelor group. this is allowing melbourne to send their desexed batchelors to darwin and then a whole bunch of transfers between the other zoos will result in the establishment of new breeding groups in all the zoos with melbourne mainatining just one.

auckland will aslo be receiveing some animals from these transfers who will be integrated into a group with the non-breeding chacma baboons, the longterm plan being the gradual phase-in of a purebred breeding group of hamadryas there also.

so it good news for hamadryas baboons, for those of you worried of a phase-out. and a downgrade in troop size for melbourne will definately be a good thing considering they house one of the largest groups in the region in probably the worst facilities.

i still hope there is a long-term plan to move for the species to werribee however, since melbourne already displays a baboon species (though the situation for mandrills is not looking good at all at present and they very well could switch to becoming a phase-out species....)
 
Pat, what's happening with M<andrills. Are they a species that cannot be imported? Are they not breeding as well as would be hoped? Or are they all closely related? Do no other zoos want them?
Currently there are 4 males and 8 females in two zoos, with a birth at Melbourne fairly recently.
 
today only two zoos keep mandrill in australia, in contrast with past decades when twice as many zoos kept the species. to make matter worse melbourne DNA confirmed a long-held suspicion that five of its mandrills were indeed drill/mandrill hybrids. that reduced the amount of mandrill bloodlines in their collection and they phased out those animals. as a result of no compliancy with requests to integrate melbourne and adelaide into either the european or american mandrill programs the two zoos have found it very difficult to source animals and imports have been minimal, the result being that they have had to interbreed their troops to a high degree and now almost all animals are related.

unfortunately unless other zoos like perth and taronga can show a wilingness to participate, these guys are being downgraded.
 
so pat, what do you personally think about bredding these hybrids (if any left), and the other pures carnt be intergratded in to the european or american programs, for display only? as melbourne has such a great setup (when they get a baby pygmy back). are the to troops relatedc closely?
 
Do we (that is, Australian zoos) NEED to integrate with the european or american mandrill program? Can't we carry out exchanges with, say, Sth. african zoos, or even asian zoos that might hold the species?
 
zooboy, i answered all your questions in my post. yes the two troops at melbourne adelaide are closely related and no i don't believe melbourne still have hybrid animals. certainly they are not listed as such on isis and these animals were definately removed from the breeding program. even if they still existed and were of breeding age, i certinaly do not support cross-species hybridisation in zoos (im not even a fan of subspecies mixing if it can be avoided).

ara, well your probably right, and its may very well be why melbournes breeding male it imported came from israel (if memory serves correct), though you might find the israelis are part of the EEP. pretty sure a few SEAZA zoos keep mandrills and not only for them but numerous asoian and exotic fauna it would be benificial for ARAZPA and SEAZA to maintain group programs. they have had group conferences and its something that is probably been discussed, but thats another whole topic of conversation....

in any case the jist i got was that in order to import into australia currently it is required to prove to DEH that the zoos have developed a coperative conservation program - something they can't do so long as only two australian zoos are involved and they are not linked to either the SSP or EEP. but zoopro will probably know the proper answer to that.
 
A great shame if Mandrills are going to be allowed to die out in Australia. A really classic zoo species (and a favourite too for the publishers of zoo guidebooks and postcards!)

The situation could be remedied easily IF new animals could be imported from abroad. There are plenty in America and Europe. I think the ones in Israel probably originated in Europe too (Vienna?) Anyway, plenty of different bloodlines and absolutely no crossbreeding with drills(not nowadays anyways)

The way to go is for them to get animals(e.g. 2.2) from several different genetic sources and 'sprinkle' them among the two existing groups, or start a third group and transfer offspring later. Of course that's hypothetical if you CANNOT import, but it would be a great shame to lose this species in your region. I'm biased off course- as they're one of my favourite primates...:)
 
DEH is a bit too self-important and "heavy", if you ask me!
If it was drills I could understand the necessity to prove association with other serious conservation zoos, but mandrills.............?
 
not at all - do you know how many zoo "breeding programs" have fizzled out because of lack of effective co-operation and good managemnet by zoos?!!!

i read an american article a few years ago that listed all the endangered old-world primates who's populations had died out in US zoos due to, essentially laziness on the zoos part.

we can't have a managed regional breeding program in australia with only two zoos participating, not unless they each hold a second troop as a bare minimum.

i think having to prove to DEH that you have a proper conservation breeding program planned before you are allowed import of any endangered exotic a good thing.
 
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