Great British Circus 2010 without their Elephants?

ChesterGemsbok

ChesterGemsbok

Well-Known Member
Hi,
I've just visited "The Great British Circus" website and their has been a change to their "Stars" and "Animals" pages. It seems that the Elephants and Lars and Christine Holscher (their trainers) have been removed and on the "Stars" page it states "The new line-up for our 10th anniversary tour will appear here in 2010" and a list of performers and the elephant trainers are not included! And on the "Animals" pages it lists the animals that are traveling, and dosen't include elephants! The circus have had a lot of trouble with "ADI" with their secret filming, and i really hope that this hasn't forced them to move! but it is possible that their somewhere training for a new performance, after one groom was fired, but for the whole of 2010? Dose anyone know anymore?
ChesterGemsbok
 
I did hear they were only there for a year at first, although I assumed they'd stay as they did seem pretty popular despite the C(r)APS junk they got.
 
I'm a little surprised that there are still elephants in British circuses, as many countries all over the world have banned the use of elephants in any kind of travelling menageries.
 
We haven't had them for over 10 years, probably due to pressure from antis as there wasn't a ban on it at all (at least as far as I know).
 
They were very popular with the public but, like all circus features, their booking was for one season.

Sometimes bookings are extended into subsequent seasons but this particular act had pre-existing bookings in mainland Europe following it's UK season.

That is not to say that they won't accept another UK booking following their other commitments.

Wait and see what GBC comes up with for their 2010 season!
 
snowleopard said:
I'm a little surprised that there are still elephants in British circuses, as many countries all over the world have banned the use of elephants in any kind of travelling menageries.
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"Bans" come and go.

They usually have very little to do with animal welfare and everything to do with political pressure.

Some local authorities in the UK are now overturning "bans" that, in some cases, had been in place for 20 years.

In the light of scientific evidence, they are finding that the propaganda that they had been fed by the antis was simply untrue.

Here in Australia the RSPCA ran a year long campaign against circuses and used hundreds of thousands of donated dollars to do so. At the end of the campaign FEWER councils had bans in place than when the campaign started! This was because councils were motivated by the campaign to re-examine their stance on circuses and discovered that they had been conned. The scientific evidence proved that animals were not disadvantaged by being in a circus - in fact many were better off than they would have been in some other facilities.
 
Exactly what I tried to put across in the other thread, I think you worded it a lot better though :) I must try and see GBC sometime next season, they never came near me this year (actually, last year lol :D)
 
Ash said:
Exactly what I tried to put across in the other thread, I think you worded it a lot better though :) I must try and see GBC sometime next season, they never came near me this year (actually, last year lol :D)
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Don't blame GBC for not going near you - I've just discovered that you came to Australia recently and didn't come near us! Shame on you.LOL!
 
I'm sorry but I had a free place to stay in Adelaide, I couldn't exactly pass that up :D
 
snowleopard said:
I'm a little surprised that there are still elephants in British circuses, as many countries all over the world have banned the use of elephants in any kind of travelling menageries.
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*Shoves on Devil's Advocate Hat* :)

Well, I hope this comes some day. As some of you will know I'm strongly against wild animals in circuses, based on off-show conditions I have seen in the past, and after doing my homework I'm still against them. And I don't see why they aren't, as the people I've spoken to all agree with me. I remember my RE teacher brought this up recentley, and all but two people thought that it was OK for elephants, big cats, bears, etc to be in circuses. And precisely for a reason I hate: Cos it's funny. Yep, in a zoo you're made to respect the animal, and be inspired. In a circus you're made to laugh at it like it's just another clown, a sad realisation of what we have turned some magnificent beasts of nature into.
I hope this'll evolve into some unethical thing of the past, like travelling menageries and (hoping the tories don't win, even though it seems pretty likely) foxhunting.
 
Zambar said:
*Shoves on Devil's Advocate Hat* :)

Well, I hope this comes some day. As some of you will know I'm strongly against wild animals in circuses, based on off-show conditions I have seen in the past, and after doing my homework I'm still against them. And I don't see why they aren't, as the people I've spoken to all agree with me. I remember my RE teacher brought this up recentley, and all but two people thought that it was OK for elephants, big cats, bears, etc to be in circuses. And precisely for a reason I hate: Cos it's funny. Yep, in a zoo you're made to respect the animal, and be inspired. In a circus you're made to laugh at it like it's just another clown, a sad realisation of what we have turned some magnificent beasts of nature into.
I hope this'll evolve into some unethical thing of the past, like travelling menageries and (hoping the tories don't win, even though it seems pretty likely) foxhunting.
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Have you never watched a sealion show at a zoo or safari park?
 
Zambar said:
*Shoves on Devil's Advocate Hat* :)

Well, I hope this comes some day. As some of you will know I'm strongly against wild animals in circuses, based on off-show conditions I have seen in the past, and after doing my homework I'm still against them. And I don't see why they aren't, as the people I've spoken to all agree with me. I remember my RE teacher brought this up recentley, and all but two people thought that it was OK for elephants, big cats, bears, etc to be in circuses. And precisely for a reason I hate: Cos it's funny. Yep, in a zoo you're made to respect the animal, and be inspired. In a circus you're made to laugh at it like it's just another clown, a sad realisation of what we have turned some magnificent beasts of nature into.
I hope this'll evolve into some unethical thing of the past, like travelling menageries and (hoping the tories don't win, even though it seems pretty likely) foxhunting.
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see, my class are genrally against animals in circuses, mainly becaus i am the animal and zoo kno-it-all of the school and what i say is (according to them) is right, so well agree with him!
 
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Zambar said:
*Shoves on Devil's Advocate Hat* :)

Well, I hope this comes some day. As some of you will know I'm strongly against wild animals in circuses, based on off-show conditions I have seen in the past, and after doing my homework I'm still against them. And I don't see why they aren't, as the people I've spoken to all agree with me. I remember my RE teacher brought this up recentley, and all but two people thought that it was OK for elephants, big cats, bears, etc to be in circuses. And precisely for a reason I hate: Cos it's funny. Yep, in a zoo you're made to respect the animal, and be inspired. In a circus you're made to laugh at it like it's just another clown, a sad realisation of what we have turned some magnificent beasts of nature into.
I hope this'll evolve into some unethical thing of the past, like travelling menageries and (hoping the tories don't win, even though it seems pretty likely) foxhunting.
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OK, two things:
  • Most of the "facts" you've probably done your homework to are from CAPS and the like (e.g- contrived out of date info).
  • Zoos do not "make" anyone respect animals. They certainly try, but 90% of visitors go just to try and make the "monkeys" (or chimps to us :p) throw sh*t at other visitors!
I agree with Steve, what he said was a very fair reasoning. And I fail to see how exotic animals are any worse off in a circus than domestic?
 
Yes, and I find them rather uncomfortable to watch. Then again, at least they aren't being dragged around in dusty cages.

I've purposely avoided CAPS for this reason, and I'm sorry, but the conspiracies that the videos on YT were made specifically by antis is just bullcrap: I don't think even they would go through the torture that they show on animals. And I think I explained the differences between wild and domestic animals in circuses in another thread, think it was the Southampton Zoo photo.
 
Zambar said:
Yes, and I find them rather uncomfortable to watch. Then again, at least they aren't being dragged around in dusty cages.
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Thank you for the reply, the reason I ask is that a) I think often people go a bit OTT on how zoos "engender respect in animals" whilst circuses "humiliate" them and b) to point out that if you watch such shows then you are just as ???bad??? as those who are not against it. Like I said, thank you for the reply.
 
Zambar said:
Yes, and I find them rather uncomfortable to watch. Then again, at least they aren't being dragged around in dusty cages.

I've purposely avoided CAPS for this reason, and I'm sorry, but the conspiracies that the videos on YT were made specifically by antis is just bullcrap: I don't think even they would go through the torture that they show on animals. And I think I explained the differences between wild and domestic animals in circuses in another thread, think it was the Southampton Zoo photo.
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Thanks for answering the question,just to say in all the years that I have been to circus with animals I have never seen any animal dragged round in dusty cages,in fact the worst conditions that I`ve seen animals been kept in have always been in zoo`s,also the worst looking animal health wise have been some in zoo`s and one of those was a badily dehydrated Monitor Lizard in a collection well known for its keeping of Reptiles and that was only about 18 months ago
 
Well, love them or hate them I think that we can all agree that exotic animals circuses will more than likely eventually become extinct. It is amazing how performing exotic animals (obviously not including dogs, pigs, ponies, horses, etc) have faded over time, just like chimpanzee tea parties, orangutan boxing matches and elephants dressed in tutus and standing on one leg. In many countries circuses with exotic animals are banned from many different cities and municipalities, and in general it is only specific nations that allow such practices to continue. Even in countries with circuses that feature exotic creatures, they are few and far between. My own impression is "thank goodness for that" and those that think it is okay to have travelling, performing menageries better rush out and see them now before they all evaporate into thin air.:)
 
snowleopard said:
Well, love them or hate them I think that we can all agree that exotic animals circuses will more than likely eventually become extinct. .:)
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Snowleopard - we can agree to disagree in our stance on this.

I am old enough to recall people [including media outlets] predicting the extinction of circuses for the past 50 or so years. It hasn't happened yet.

At the end of the day, there will always be people who will love to see the interaction between human and animal that can be seen in the circus. These circuses are not subsidised by the taxpayer - their only form of income is the ticket buying public. If the public decide not to buy tickets then these circuses will go broke and become "extinct". Hasn't happened yet!

On the other hand, there are people who loathe seeing animals in circuses but are happy to go to a circus type performance [usually called a "cirque" or something trendy like that] featuring only human performers. Curiously, such performances seem unable to achieve viability without taxpayer donated handouts through Arts Councils and the like. Patrons of these types of entertainment thus pay twice - once through their taxes and again when they buy a ticket. No doubt they are happy to do so to prove a point.

However, in a democratic society, neither side has the right to impose it's viewpoint on the other.
 
Zambar said:
*Shoves on Devil's Advocate Hat* :)

Well, I hope this comes some day. As some of you will know I'm strongly against wild animals in circuses, based on off-show conditions I have seen in the past, and after doing my homework I'm still against them. And I don't see why they aren't, as the people I've spoken to all agree with me. I remember my RE teacher brought this up recentley, and all but two people thought that it was OK for elephants, big cats, bears, etc to be in circuses. And precisely for a reason I hate: Cos it's funny. Yep, in a zoo you're made to respect the animal, and be inspired. In a circus you're made to laugh at it like it's just another clown, a sad realisation of what we have turned some magnificent beasts of nature into.
I hope this'll evolve into some unethical thing of the past, like travelling menageries and (hoping the tories don't win, even though it seems pretty likely) foxhunting.
Click to expand...

It is up to the parents of children to promote respect towards animals. The situation is alot worse in zoos. I am constantly telling children to put rocks and sticks down, it makes me nervous because these things usually end up being thrown into enclosuresn and parents are happy to let them do it. It's only after you say something that the parent or teacher steps in. I have never actually been to a circus where they perform "funny" behaviours. This may be different elsewhere. My experience with circuses has only been positive. In fact I wouldn't be as passionate about animals and conservation if it wasn't for one circus (maybe Steve can confirm which one, using Doug Ashtons Elphants after Ashton's stopped touring for a local show)

Gigi was turning around, stopped and looked stright at me. Something clicked inside me and I was gone. To me elephants are the most incredible creatures and if it wasn't for the circus I never would have had that experience.

Circus elephants often "freak" when sent to zoos to retire. They appear to miss the constant contact with handlers.
 
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