Lowland gorillas in Europe 2012
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Is the mother definately Grace? There seemed some doubt before about whether she was pregnant or able to breed.
This group has gone great guns since the arrival of male Buzandi from Australia, though it has had a few problems too. Initially Buzandi attacked females and injured an offspring of the previous male Arti- that is natural behaviour-before he settled down in the group. But he also more recently attacked one of his own offspring(I believe he killed it by throwing it against a wall?) The Zoo had noticed he became stressed by the attitude of several regular visitors who behaved by vocally remonstrating with him over his 'bad' behaviour and that this type of 'visitor confrontation' may have been the root of his hostility. So these visitors were asked by the zoo to alter their behaviour and to appear meek and submissive to him instead. This seems to have improved his attitude for the better.
Are Gorillas complex creatures or what?
Yeah, seems so...
Here's a clip of him from You Tube:
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mazfc
Well-Known Member
Thank you for the clip (they chose an interesting sound track!).
Definitely very interested in humans. You can see that he's constantly watching the public and seems on edge (though obviously this is only a short clip of his day). From what I've seen of other dominant males they do constantly watch but aren't as on edge as him. He must be a pretty sensitive chap even by gorilla standards. Hope he settles down as he continues to mature.
Definitely very interested in humans. You can see that he's constantly watching the public and seems on edge (though obviously this is only a short clip of his day). From what I've seen of other dominant males they do constantly watch but aren't as on edge as him. He must be a pretty sensitive chap even by gorilla standards. Hope he settles down as he continues to mature.
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Mataki AKA (Bonz) one of the 'big five' silverbacks at Port Lympne has been seperated from the other 3 as he was getting severely beaten up by Djimu and at one point the keepers thought he wasn't going to survive as he became extremely depressed after boumi's death and getting several wounds from Djimu. Although he has recovered well and is looking great getting his confidence back and building up his strength Which is good news. Unfortunately Mayumbah (Djala x Mumba) born april 2009 sadly died.
the sound track was a bit puzzling ;-) I wonder if his sensitivity is related to being human reared.. OJ at San Francisco zoo, who was also hand reared and re-integrated later on , behaves in a similar way.
Yes, Buzandi does looks very tense in most of this but they often do when a camera is pointed at them anyway. I know when he was first introduced into the group there were a lot of problems with his integratation to an established group of females(he replaced Arti who drowned) and he was described as a 'psycho' because of his aggressive behaviour toward them, but he has settled down a lot since that time. However I think his main problem is that he was handraised so is still interested in humans, but is also a successful breeder/group leader - so there is a state of flux between the two as he lives in 'two worlds' at the same time. Bokito at Rotterdam has a similar history and he even jumped the moat to get at a regular visitor with whom he had some sort of complex relationship.
I can see why regular visitors he knew well were asked to behave around Buzandi more submissively to prevent upsetting him, as it would cut down his aggression and reduce any that was redirected at his group(e.g. killing his own offspring, whih is very unusual behaviour for an established group leader). Unfortunately they can't ask every visitor to do that but presumably it was the 'regulars' attitude which upset him the most.
I think as he matures into middle-age that he will become quieter- they normally do.
He's(IMO) a very handsome male- looks like his Australian mother Betsi, rather than his father Motaba.
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I am rather concerned the dynamic of this group may break down entirely if/when they move to Holland, as either a change in the dynamics/heirarchy, and/or a location change can increase the levels of fighting in adult males which previously lived fairly harmoniously together so that they have to be split up permanently. Underlining the inescapable fact that these groups are not natural.
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the sound track is horrible.
I think you are right about the reason for his sensitivity(see my comments above)
Gigit
Well-Known Member
Buzandi
This reminds me of Paignton's 14 year old male, Kumbuka, who lives separately from the bachelor group. He was recently in the news over his stone, mud and stick-throwing antics:
Kumbuka the Paignton Zoo silverback makes his feelings known | This is South Devon
Ever since I started admiring him he has thrown things my way and I would be mortified to know that my presence was upsetting him. I do photograph him sometimes but doubt that he knows what a camera is, even though he was hand raised! Perhaps rather tellingly, when I had the opportunity to see him close up in the ape house, he wouldn't come near me
Having read all this, I'll be more circumspect when I watch him.
This reminds me of Paignton's 14 year old male, Kumbuka, who lives separately from the bachelor group. He was recently in the news over his stone, mud and stick-throwing antics:
Kumbuka the Paignton Zoo silverback makes his feelings known | This is South Devon
Ever since I started admiring him he has thrown things my way and I would be mortified to know that my presence was upsetting him. I do photograph him sometimes but doubt that he knows what a camera is, even though he was hand raised! Perhaps rather tellingly, when I had the opportunity to see him close up in the ape house, he wouldn't come near me
Having read all this, I'll be more circumspect when I watch him.I doubt any of them know what a camera actually does- but the lense 'stares' at them directly/intrusively and as you know they don't like being stared at- so I think that and the accompanying assertive posture of the photographer often causes an aggressive reaction, at least in some males.
He did it when I saw him last month, I thought he was actually displaying at a group of other people who were nearer to him than I was - but perhaps I was wrong. I was not using my big lens at the time and I will be very careful not to let him see it in the future.
Alan
He is the third 11/12 year old male from Europe to transfer to another group in the last few months after Badongo(to Jersey) and Kibale(to Taronga Park) both from the Romagne group in France.
Kidogo will join the two younger females at Krefeld, Oya and Muna, though both are already in their twenties.
Willard
Well-Known Member
Wuppertal births
Grace gave birth to a baby (as posted above) on March 16. The girl was named Vana. She has already arrived in the Stuttgart nursery where she joined Tano and Okanda.
Ukiwa gave birth to a babyboy a few days later, on March 23 (?). She also rejected her baby who hasn't been named yet AFAIK.
Both females were handraised, and they never had the chance to watch another female raise a baby.
Here is a comment from A.J. Haverkamp, the Dutch photographer:
"Immediate stop breeding with the current group. And indeed do as Artis did, get a family reared gorilla (like Binti in Artis, who was born in the Apenheul) and hope that she will be able to teach the other ladies how to raise a baby. It can take them a couple of years to arrange this, but it's the only solution. What's happening right know isn't good for the females and is very very bad for the babies. Hand rearing should only be done as a last resort.
Bringing one of the females, like Grace, to another group to stay for some time is also an option. Keep her on the pill and have her watch other females raise babies. But that's very stressful for everybody, risky with spreading deceases etc.
I do hope that the breeding coordinator will step in and help Wuppertal."
(Source: Ukiwa... | Flickr - Photo Sharing!)
(Artis is the colloquial name for the Amsterdam Zoo.)
Grace gave birth to a baby (as posted above) on March 16. The girl was named Vana. She has already arrived in the Stuttgart nursery where she joined Tano and Okanda.
Ukiwa gave birth to a babyboy a few days later, on March 23 (?). She also rejected her baby who hasn't been named yet AFAIK.
Both females were handraised, and they never had the chance to watch another female raise a baby.
Here is a comment from A.J. Haverkamp, the Dutch photographer:
"Immediate stop breeding with the current group. And indeed do as Artis did, get a family reared gorilla (like Binti in Artis, who was born in the Apenheul) and hope that she will be able to teach the other ladies how to raise a baby. It can take them a couple of years to arrange this, but it's the only solution. What's happening right know isn't good for the females and is very very bad for the babies. Hand rearing should only be done as a last resort.
Bringing one of the females, like Grace, to another group to stay for some time is also an option. Keep her on the pill and have her watch other females raise babies. But that's very stressful for everybody, risky with spreading deceases etc.
I do hope that the breeding coordinator will step in and help Wuppertal."
(Source: Ukiwa... | Flickr - Photo Sharing!)
(Artis is the colloquial name for the Amsterdam Zoo.)
Willard
Well-Known Member
Amnèville
Thanks for correcting my mistake. I had the info from Jim Davis' studbook and obviously it was wrong.
Thanks for correcting my mistake. I had the info from Jim Davis' studbook and obviously it was wrong.
I certainly agree its not a good situation. In the Artis case all three females were still quite young but when fully mature females like these two, aged 29 & 20, are involved I am not sure how successful providing an example of mother-raising will help them to do this themselves. I believe most of their learning to imitate others occurs during their formative(learning) years and after that I'm not sure it has the same desired effect.
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Artis gorilla Dafina was about 20 when she had her third (surviving) baby, the first one she was able to take care of herself. She did learn from Binti about one year before how to do it. I think even the 29 year old one might still be able to learn it.
I agree with A. Haverkamp on this subject by the way. Okay, it might not work, but what's the harm in trying it ;-)
I hadn't realised Dafina was already so old when she reared her first. Nothing's set in stone of course and I agree its worth a try as the current situation at Wuppertal is unlikely to change otherwise.
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