Noahs Ark.....its in the Netherlands!

[Chlidonias]

By the Great Green Arkleseizure, what a load of utter tripe. Utter, utter tripe and just flat out lies. The gall of these people is astonishing - they seem to rely on their readers being unrelentingly thick. Unfortunately, I suspect at least some of them are.

I've read quite a few Creationist books and in general they are actually really well written, in terms of them sounding convincing. You have to already know something about the subject to see that its all codswallop but of course most people don't know a lot about science and nature anyway, and because they are written for Creationists their readers do basically just believe everything they read because it supports what they want to believe. Noah's Ark is a brilliant example of this, because it is just so utterly unbelievable if you think about any part of it, but so many people of the faith think it is a literal truth and will distort any and all facts to make their belief in it fit.

 

[Maguari]

Not all Creationists are as stubborn and radical as this. There are plenty that beleive in things such as evolution, and do not take stories in the Bible and other books as hard facts. I am one of them. I just don't appreciate you labbeling the vast majority of the world as backwards nuts.

Firstly, I would heavily contest that Creationists are 'the vast majority of the world'! I think that's at best unproved.

Secondly, you're clearly no fool - not least because you've realised that the Bible is not a source of hard fact, for the most part at least - and I don't wish to offend anyone who isn't a fool, so I'm sorry if I did.

Thirdly, I'm afraid I don't see how Creationism can realistically be compatible with the scientific understanding of the world. The same scientific world that dates species from fossils up to hundreds of millions of years can also date the history of the Earth and the Universe. It's not infallible (and nor should it be) but the only fully compatible version would perhaps be to say 'God started the Big Bang' - but that's hardly Creationism, is it? (if I'm wrong, please correct me)

 

[Maguari]

Noah's Ark is a brilliant example of this, because it is just so utterly unbelievable if you think about any part of it, but so many people of the faith think it is a literal truth and will distort any and all facts to make their belief in it fit.

This is exactly the problem with most religion - it's all about prejudice (in the sense of simply having preconceived ideas rather than having a preconceived hatred/dislike). In religion you have your ideas from early on and adjust your world view to fit, rather than letting your view of the world form your ideas, which is a much healthier arrangement in my book.

 

[KCZooFan]

Firstly, I would heavily contest that Creationists are 'the vast majority of the world'! I think that's at best unproved.

Secondly, you're clearly no fool - not least because you've realised that the Bible is not a source of hard fact, for the most part at least - and I don't wish to offend anyone who isn't a fool, so I'm sorry if I did.

Thirdly, I'm afraid I don't see how Creationism can realistically be compatible with the scientific understanding of the world. The same scientific world that dates species from fossils up to hundreds of millions of years can also date the history of the Earth and the Universe. It's not infallible (and nor should it be) but the only fully compatible version would perhaps be to say 'God started the Big Bang' - but that's hardly Creationism, is it? (if I'm wrong, please correct me)

I was under the impression that creationists were religious people, so there is my largest mistake. However, wouldn't a religion that beleives in creation (Christianity, Islam, Judaism), be a creationist religion?

My personal beleif (don't hate me for it), is that a deity created Earth and the rest of the universe, not as it is today, but as it was billions of years ago, and set everything in motion. Wouldn't that be creationism? A deity creating the universe.

However, I am most loyal to logic and reason, and will not blindly follow any idea, and that is how I try not to be a religious fundamentalist.

 

[Maguari]

I was under the impression that creationists were religious people, so there is my largest mistake. However, wouldn't a religion that beleives in creation (Christianity, Islam, Judaism), be a creationist religion?

I'm no theologian, but I'm reasonably well-up on Creationism as it is something of a pet peeve. Plenty of Christians are not Creationists - they believe God has a hand or a place in the Universe/Earth without having created it. Their own beliefs are entirely their own business; I just object when people try to pass off demonstrable nonsense as support for their beliefs.

My personal beleif (don't hate me for it)

I wouldn't hate anyone for any beliefs that didn't cause them to impact negatively on other peoples' lives.

is that a deity created Earth and the rest of the universe, not as it is today, but as it was billions of years ago, and set everything in motion. Wouldn't that be creationism? A deity creating the universe.

I wouldn't call it traditional Creationism, in that that implies the Earth being directly created by a deity - perhaps the Old Testament 'hardest week's work in history' story or something similar. But perhaps a form of Creationism (a far more sensible one that doesn't ignore centuries of accumulated scientific understanding because a 1500-year old book says it was all magic!).

 

[Chlidonias]

moving on from Creation nonsense and back to the Dutch Ark (well, yes, more Creation nonsense), I don't have any problem with it as such. In fact its probably quite a good business idea. It may have cost him several million euros but once complete the ongoing costs must surely be quite low - apart for lighting costs would be largely for manual maintenance (cleaning, mending, etc) - and it will surely be quite a popular tourist attraction. In terms of subversion, I can't really see many/any visitors being turned into Creationists because they can see a bunch of plastic animals inside a life-size Ark.

 

[Maguari]

moving on from Creation nonsense and back to the Dutch Ark (well, yes, more Creation nonsense), I don't have any problem with it as such. In fact its probably quite a good business idea. It may have cost him several million euros but once complete the ongoing costs must surely be quite low - apart for lighting costs would be largely for manual maintenance (cleaning, mending, etc) - and it will surely be quite a popular tourist attraction. In terms of subversion, I can't really see many/any visitors being turned into Creationists because they can see a bunch of plastic animals inside a life-size Ark.

I have to say I'm slightly surprised he got a bank loan for this, but he must have had a good business model worked out. It'll certainly be an impressive sight if he does manage 1,600 species.

 

[Chlidonias]

Johan Huibers has completed his ark: Dutchman unveils full-size replica of Noah's Ark - Totaltravel

 

[ThylacineAlive]

Johan Huibers has completed his ark: Dutchman unveils full-size replica of Noah's Ark - Totaltravel

Now all he needs are millions of life-sized animals
The story of Noah's Ark is one of my favorites in the Bible but honestly there are many holes in the story. As mentioned before, what about subspecies? There were nine (eight depending on what you believe) subspecies of Tigers alone alive during that time yet we only have one on the boat. And why are there only two elephants on the boat when there are at least three species alive and the Asian Elephant does have a few subspecies as well. Also, no New World species? Yeah, that's what I thought. We don't even know everything that's living on Earth today so imagine how few actual species they knew about back then. No Australian species either unless you look at a modern version which has pictures depicting species unknown at the time of the story.

 

[Chlidonias]

there's a chap in America building an Ark as well! Imagine if he met the Dutch Ark-builder! They'd be all like "God told me to build my Ark", "no, God told me to build an Ark!"...oh the comedy that would ensue. It would be like an episode of Three's Company.

Anyway, this guy is a preacherman and he actually was told by God to build the Ark, unlike the Dutchman who just wants to raise awareness of, um, global floods or something. The main difference between the two is that the American started building his Ark in 1976 and after three million dollars and 36 years has only managed a bit of steel scafolding. Also there's no mention of animals on his Ark, only Bible schools and a 1700-seat auditorium.

Let's watch!
BBC News - Modern-day Noah rebuilding Ark in Maryland

 

[ThylacineAlive]

The thing is with Global Warming world-wide flooding isn't that crazy of an idea. I read a story a while back about a Christian museum that's planning to begin construction of an ark. They said they wanted to show people it was possible, I think it might do the opposite honestly.

Wait a minute, if God promised he'd never flood the Earth again then why is the Dutch guy building one for floods?

 

[Moebelle]

Not all Creationists are as stubborn and radical as this. There are plenty that beleive in things such as evolution, and do not take stories in the Bible and other books as hard facts. I am one of them. I just don't appreciate you labbeling the vast majority of the world as backwards nuts.

[i don't care if this is old] Yes thank you I was kind of getting offended as I read along. I bet most Christians and Catholics believe in evolution as I do, there is no denying it. We believe that Adam and Eve were just metaphors [or another similar term] that tells us that in some way somehow the first original sin occurred. We initially just believe overall that God created the universe and rules over all living things.

 

[Moebelle]

The thing is with Global Warming world-wide flooding isn't that crazy of an idea. I read a story a while back about a Christian museum that's planning to begin construction of an ark. They said they wanted to show people it was possible, I think it might do the opposite honestly.

Wait a minute, if God promised he'd never flood the Earth again then why is the Dutch guy building one for floods?

God destroyed the world because all the people were basically turning against him and committed evil acts and didn't like what he saw. After the flood the world was new and was cleansed from sin again. Anyways God promised never to "destroy the earth", as in completely wipe everybody out. To really answer your question I don't know. Maybe the guy really believes that God sees that the world is back to the way it was-filled with betrayal-and that God might destroy the world once again.

 

[ThylacineAlive]

God destroyed the world because all the people were basically turning against him and committed evil acts and didn't like what he saw. After the flood the world was new and was cleansed from sin again. Anyways God promised never to "destroy the earth", as in completely wipe everybody out. To really answer your question I don't know. Maybe the guy really believes that God sees that the world is back to the way it was-filled with betrayal-and that God might destroy the world once again.

I know the story and this is just saying the same as I did. If God promised never to do it again than why do they think he's going to do it again! Also, while I believe in God and The Bible, I do not think the story of Noah's Ark is fully possible. Do I believe that there was a major flood that flooded the world as they knew it (really the Mediterranean area)?- yes. But do I believe that every single living organism that needed to be on that ark could fit?- no. Even in modern versions they only have two elephants one the ark where, if the whole world flooded, about 20-22 elephants would have to be on there to accommodate for all the species and subspecies alive at the time. Also, 18 Tigers would have to have been on there. I could go on.

~Thylo

 

[Toddy]

Yes thank you I was kind of getting offended as I read along.

No reason to get offended. This is simply a discussion of logic and reason and is not offensive to anyone. If you don't like it, then simply don't read it.

 

[Chlidonias]

Huiber's website about his Ark: Ark van Noach | Kom aan boord van dit avontuur

 

[Chlidonias]

.....and another one (this one in Miami): Hidden Ark: 500-Foot Noah's Ark Replica Zoo Being Built Near Miami (VIDEO, PHOTOS)

Noah's Ark -- without all the flood and calamity -- is coming to Miami.

A group of four friends behind an unusual Biblical-themed zoo under construction in Hialeah hope to raise environmental awareness by building it almost to the exact specifications of its Old Testament inspiration: 500 feet long, shaped like a boat, and made out of wood.

Dubbed "Hidden Ark", the eventual tourist destination and online "ecological oasis" is meant to operate with an on-site veterinary clinic, stables, garden, petting zoo, coffee shop, and a mission.

"It is religious themed, because it’s Noah, and God teaches us to protect animals," Carolina Peralta of Hidden Ark told NBC 6. "That's our concern...animals, and the planet also."

A promotional video promises the group doesn't believe an Earth-covering flood is coming soon -- they just want to save the planet: "Regardless of their religion, Noah's Ark allegory has inspired the team behind Hidden Ark to conceive a revelatory concept that aspires to waken a warning in our consciousness and encourage us to reconsider our beloved earth, just like God made Noah aware of how to take care of those important elements that surrounded him."

.....etc etc