I included Shanthi- "...Smithsonian's male is Sri Lankan as is his mother..."
And I was unaware of the AI so, yes, I'd consider them breeding.
~Thylo
Asian & African elephants in the United states 2013 (Zoos only)
- Thread starter Spixii
- Start date
I included Shanthi- "...Smithsonian's male is Sri Lankan as is his mother..."
And I was unaware of the AI so, yes, I'd consider them breeding.
~Thylo
So is it 3.1 Indian, 0.1 Malaysian, 0.1 Bornean Pygmy, and 0.1 (Lily) MalaysianXIndian?
I know Oregon has the only Bornean Pygmy Elephant in the United States but does anyone know of any Sumatran Elephants in the U.S.?
~Thylo
I know Oregon has the only Bornean Pygmy Elephant in the United States but does anyone know of any Sumatran Elephants in the U.S.?
~Thylo
Rose-Tu, Rama, Sung Surin, and Packy are all Cambodian/Thai elephants.
AND sorry! I misread what you said about Kandula and Shanthi!
Is Tuffy an aggressive male?
I don't know I was just going of Loxo was saying
The director of Buttonwood Park Zoo said that while the elephant facility at the zoo is older, an improvement is planned for the near future, which might imply additional elephants, perhaps?
Buttonwood Park Zoo Director Says Their Elephants Are Well Cared For
Buttonwood Park Zoo Director Says Their Elephants Are Well Cared For
If true BZF, it seems we are building more Elephant facilities (and wasting the money going into them) than we have elephants.
What? Improved elephant centers are mainly built to give the already existing elephants more comfortable and naturalistic homes. The number of elephants that can comfortably fit in them is just a number and not at all a reality. Smithsonian's new elephant center, for example, has a capacity of 12 adult Asian Elephants. But will they have that much? No, they currently have 1.2 and will soon have 1.3. And where will this fourth elephant come from? A zoo that's getting rid of them. We aren't building more elephant facilities than elephants. If an elephant center is built it's to provide current elephants a better home and/or to provide a home for elephants that are known to be going to them. We don't build random elephant centers for the hell of it without having elephants to live in them, we build them for the elephants currently in existence. And don't forget that new elephants are being born. There are currently calves at St. Louis, Oregon, Lowry Park, ect. and there appears to be other expected mothers as well. And providing an amazing and highly endangered species with a better home is not a waste of money. Quite the opposite actually.
~Thylo
They've been talking about expanding/renovating their exhibit for years. Doing an Asian area for their girls and bringing in G O-H Rhinos as well. Lack of funding, things fell through. I believe their Director stepped down, too. All leading to things being left up in the air. The exhibit hasn't changed much since the late 80's, just the shade structure is new-ish. There's really no space to expand around the Ele exhibit. They're up for reaccreditation next year. I doubt they will keep their Eles, as funding will never happen to comply with the AZA changes. I just hope their girls can stay together.
What? Improved elephant centers are mainly built to give the already existing elephants more comfortable and naturalistic homes. The number of elephants that can comfortably fit in them is just a number and not at all a reality. Smithsonian's new elephant center, for example, has a capacity of 12 adult Asian Elephants. But will they have that much? No, they currently have 1.2 and will soon have 1.3. And where will this fourth elephant come from? A zoo that's getting rid of them. We aren't building more elephant facilities than elephants. If an elephant center is built it's to provide current elephants a better home and/or to provide a home for elephants that are known to be going to them. We don't build random elephant centers for the hell of it without having elephants to live in them, we build them for the elephants currently in existence. And don't forget that new elephants are being born. There are currently calves at St. Louis, Oregon, Lowry Park, ect. and there appears to be other expected mothers as well. And providing an amazing and highly endangered species with a better home is not a waste of money. Quite the opposite actually.
~Thylo
You missed my point Thylo, it seems every two bit zoo with a bad asian exhibit has decided to try and upgrade instead of consolidating bigger herds at the bigger and better zoos is my point. Just because the AZA is mandating 3 by 2015, I would ideally like to see fewer zoos with larger herds. I still think 3 is too small of a "herd" especially female herds. Now male africans should be maintained either by themselves or in 3-8 member bachelor herds but ideally in 20 years you would see fewer zoos with elephants and those zoos with the space ala North Carolina and Nashville having large natural sized female herds.
I see. Well it seems, as Gulo gulo just said, like a lot of zoos are sending elephants off because they don't have good enough exhibits for them. Philadelphia and Toronto got rid/are soon to get rid of their elephants and now it seems the Buttonwood Park Zoo will get rid of theirs soon enough. Even Bronx says they aren't going to continue keeping elephants after their three current females pass (though I wouldn't bet on that becoming a reality). And with zoos like Smithsonian and Oregon building new centers that can hold larger herds we may see just what you want (which I think would be nice also).
I have a question now, are there any zoos out there that actually keep family herds as what happens in the wild? It seems you don't see the family herds in elephants, bison, and fellow herd animals in captivity anymore.
~Thylo
I see. Well it seems, as Gulo gulo just said, like a lot of zoos are sending elephants off because they don't have good enough exhibits for them. Philadelphia and Toronto got rid/are soon to get rid of their elephants and now it seems the Buttonwood Park Zoo will get rid of theirs soon enough. Even Bronx says they aren't going to continue keeping elephants after their three current females pass (though I wouldn't bet on that becoming a reality). And with zoos like Smithsonian and Oregon building new centers that can hold larger herds we may see just what you want (which I think would be nice also).
I have a question now, are there any zoos out there that actually keep family herds as what happens in the wild? It seems you don't see the family herds in elephants, bison, and fellow herd animals in captivity anymore.
~Thylo
Well its not a zoo but my privately owned bison are raised "in a herd" as in my 3 bulls live on pasture with my females.
Disney's Animal Kingdom is the closest to a natural family group of elephants I know. Nashville and North Carolina both have the space to accommodate a full natural sized female elephant herd eventually. That is why birmingham is so vital, if you put large female herds at Nashville North Carolina the NEC Baton Rouge Dallas etc well draw all them in a circle and Birmingham is in the center of that circle making it the perfect location for the bachelor herd (aka AI semen source)
That's not exactly how it works. They didn't say after their three females pass. What they said is if two of their three elephants, or one of their three dies. If Happy, the antisocial elephant dies first, then the zoo will hold elephants for a little longer until either Patty or Maxine dies. However, if Patty or Maxine die, then they'll be phased out because Patty and Maxine get along, and Happy doesn't get along with them, so two elephants will be held individually.
uszoo
Well-Known Member
- The bronx zoo has mot said anything since they said this original statement in 2006. For all we know plans may have well changed. If the zoo is put in a position in which they send the elephants away there would be a huge public outcry. That is why i think a new exhibit for elephabts will be built eventually. I have sent the zoo an email regarding this topic.
Actually the contrary. Tuffy and Artie lived at the Riddle's elephant sanctuary in the company of at least four full grown African males. So, the two would probably thrive in a bachelor situation.
I've had suspicions regarding the Bronx zoo decision. As the economy, and the state of WCS improves I think the continued exhibition of elephants will become more feasible. Let us know what the zoo says in its response to your email!
filipinos
Well-Known Member
I was just following Zootierliste. Not sure if they even are correct.
uszoo
Well-Known Member
- That is what i was thinking. I will post a response when i get one.
@BZF, I wasn't saying they wouldn't phase-out their current elephants if/when the situations you described come true, I was saying I doubt they'd go elephant-less for long. They're a huge public attraction and with the WCS focusing on elephants for intensely then ever before I doubt they'd want to go ambassador-less for long. Also, I believe they've changed directors since they made that announcement in 2006.
@uszoo, why do you think/want a new elephant exhibit built? The current one is very nice and the elephants get everything they need in it- space, an elephant backscratcher, a large pool, a naturalistic environment, and real ground that has not only grass growing out of it, but trees!
~Thylo
@uszoo, why do you think/want a new elephant exhibit built? The current one is very nice and the elephants get everything they need in it- space, an elephant backscratcher, a large pool, a naturalistic environment, and real ground that has not only grass growing out of it, but trees!
~Thylo
uszoo
Well-Known Member
@BZF, I wasn't saying they wouldn't phase-out their current elephants if/when the situations you described come true, I was saying I doubt they'd go elephant-less for long. They're a huge public attraction and with the WCS focusing on elephants for intensely then ever before I doubt they'd want to go ambassador-less for long. Also, I believe they've changed directors since they made that announcement in 2006.
@uszoo, why do you think/want a new elephant exhibit built? The current one is very nice and the elephants get everything they need in it- space, an elephant backscratcher, a large pool, a naturalistic environment, and real ground that has not only grass growing out of it, but trees!
~Thylo
- The elephants are only viewable for 30 seconds and for 7 months a year. The exhibit may look nice but it has only a very small barn for the winter months. There is no logical way to connect it to the zoo as the area is far removed from the rest of the zoo. Also the monorail is an aging ride and I am not sure the zoo wants to replace it. I personally like the exhibit but it is not ideal viewing conditions for the elephants. My idea would be to replace the current himalayan tahr exhibit and wild asia parking with a new exhibit whcih is a 8 acre area.