ZSL London Zoo Future Of the Mappin terraces
- Thread starter JamesB
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johnstoni
Well-Known Member
Ituri - are there any Sri Lankan sloth bears in breeding situations still in the US/SSP?
I think to work in an old exhibit such as the mappins every day, the team there would have been actuely aware of any husbandry shortcomings, especially in terms of separation/den quarters, and I can quite imagine the desire to create something simple and easy to service, rather than an innovative twist on a very difficult concrete structure.
For whatever reason, ZSL did not see any need/possibility to incorporate the two cubs born at London into either the SSP or move them into breeding situations with any remaining Sri Lankan sloth bears of breeding age in Europe, and so were left with either the two cubs using the main exhibit, or Lanka, as she couldn't be mixed with them after a certain point. The result was Lanka was often restricted to one of the original bear enclosures, albeit with a little more natural substrate, for much of her time at London.
I don't think there were ever issues between the bears and langurs, as I have said before, the lar gibbons had a very brief stay on the mappins during this time, but soon left ZSL, so possibly an issue occurred here, and the ducks/peafowl/muntjac all soon vanished from the exhibit, suggesting pinioned birds would not work with bears, as well as the muntjac-eating incident also mentioned in this forum.
The whipsnade photos and anecdotal accounts of the behaviour of the bears in the new enclosures look and sound promising, apparently Lanka does actually have her own wooded paddock as well, but often chooses to sit in the yard nearer the other two.
The Sri Lankan subspecies of the sloth bear is critically endangered, these animals are the rarer than Andean bears, so I'm still fairly confused as to why ZSL has seemingly 'retired' two bears of breeding age alongside their mother. I hope what is really hapenning is that they are waiting until Lanka passes away before bringing in any unrelated animals to mate with either of their London-born siblings. The new facility would certainly be more conducive to a serious breeding effort....I guess that was the big drawback for the mappins exhibit).
I suspect the move happened to roughly coincide with the construction of a new large carnivore exhibit on the site of the current lion terraces within the next year or so....
I think to work in an old exhibit such as the mappins every day, the team there would have been actuely aware of any husbandry shortcomings, especially in terms of separation/den quarters, and I can quite imagine the desire to create something simple and easy to service, rather than an innovative twist on a very difficult concrete structure.
For whatever reason, ZSL did not see any need/possibility to incorporate the two cubs born at London into either the SSP or move them into breeding situations with any remaining Sri Lankan sloth bears of breeding age in Europe, and so were left with either the two cubs using the main exhibit, or Lanka, as she couldn't be mixed with them after a certain point. The result was Lanka was often restricted to one of the original bear enclosures, albeit with a little more natural substrate, for much of her time at London.
I don't think there were ever issues between the bears and langurs, as I have said before, the lar gibbons had a very brief stay on the mappins during this time, but soon left ZSL, so possibly an issue occurred here, and the ducks/peafowl/muntjac all soon vanished from the exhibit, suggesting pinioned birds would not work with bears, as well as the muntjac-eating incident also mentioned in this forum.
The whipsnade photos and anecdotal accounts of the behaviour of the bears in the new enclosures look and sound promising, apparently Lanka does actually have her own wooded paddock as well, but often chooses to sit in the yard nearer the other two.
The Sri Lankan subspecies of the sloth bear is critically endangered, these animals are the rarer than Andean bears, so I'm still fairly confused as to why ZSL has seemingly 'retired' two bears of breeding age alongside their mother. I hope what is really hapenning is that they are waiting until Lanka passes away before bringing in any unrelated animals to mate with either of their London-born siblings. The new facility would certainly be more conducive to a serious breeding effort....I guess that was the big drawback for the mappins exhibit).
I suspect the move happened to roughly coincide with the construction of a new large carnivore exhibit on the site of the current lion terraces within the next year or so....
I was at Regent's Park today. The enclosure looks well, but it seems rather empty with 3 emus near the front and a dozen wallabies lounging around near the back. I do agree that a mob of red kangaroos would make a much better display.
They seem to have reduced the width and depth of the pool, which may restrict its use for waterfowl. There was sign for radjah shelducks, but I didn't spot them (although I didn't look awfully hard - I was watching a rather late male emperor dragonfly who obviously reckoned the pool was a des res).
They could stick a net over the top and add a flock of galahs
Alan
They seem to have reduced the width and depth of the pool, which may restrict its use for waterfowl. There was sign for radjah shelducks, but I didn't spot them (although I didn't look awfully hard - I was watching a rather late male emperor dragonfly who obviously reckoned the pool was a des res).
They could stick a net over the top and add a flock of galahs
Alan
gentle lemur;67525. They could stick a net over the top and add a flock of galahs :rolleyes: Alan[/QUOTE said:That is actually not a bad idea...Galahs(or other cockatoo sp) are the true spirit of the Australian outback and they'd certainly improve the feel of the exhibit. Red Kangaroos would be far more suitable for the outback feel they've tried to create- bennett's wallabies are totally incorrect as you know.
No. There are none in captivity in the UK, and I think if there were, they would not be exhibited in such a way.
Kangaroos would be some improvement to the exhibit I think, as long as escape is not possible. I think a feral species like dromedary camels would be too damaging to foliage, and would put a lot of strain on the earth, but would be valuable as a educational tool regarding the non-native/native battle in Oz.
Not a chance. Only found at Perth Zoo (breeding program) and Alice Sprrings Desert Park (small display). If you think koalas and Tassie devils have management difficulties, then numbats beat them by a mile. For a start you need to have good access to a regular supply of a lot of termites... not exactly common in the UK.
Numbats are, or were extremely rare in the wild too. I think they are found in only one NP in Western Australia, hence Perth's involvement with them.
This is a species unlikely ever to be seen in a Uk zoo, as Tetrapod says, and if it ever was, it would be in e.g. a glass-fronted enclosure in the Clore pavilion as they're only Meerkat- sized.
This is a species unlikely ever to be seen in a Uk zoo, as Tetrapod says, and if it ever was, it would be in e.g. a glass-fronted enclosure in the Clore pavilion as they're only Meerkat- sized.
Rock wallabies would fit in, but they are rather too small to be easily visible. The enclosure is too dry and sandy for either type of goose - I'm not sure how happy the radjahs will be. Likewise brolgas (which I think someone suggested before) would prefer a damper environment. I can't think of anything else which is Australian and suited to the exhibit.
Alan
Alan
Whatever they put in it, some species wouldn't come from the same habitats in the wild. As its sandy, I should have thought Red Kangaroo was a 'must' to replace Wallabies though. ...
johnstoni
Well-Known Member
I would say that Magpie or Cereopsis geese are far more adapted to dry season waterholes and barren coastal scrub respectively, which is why they would be more suited possibly than the shelducks.
Rock wallabies are not particularly small as wallabies go, and combined with kangaroos would be visually more interesting than the red-necked wallaby, which as someone else mentioned are more likely to be found in more temperate wooded areas.
Rock wallabies are not particularly small as wallabies go, and combined with kangaroos would be visually more interesting than the red-necked wallaby, which as someone else mentioned are more likely to be found in more temperate wooded areas.
Rock wallabies are very attractive- the problem is they are nocturnal and being smaller and shyer than the big 'roo species, probably wouldn't show very well at all in the daytime. Red Kangaroo is a must for this exhibit really, I think and with Emus would make it work- though lets face it, its never going to be dynamic.
johnstoni
Well-Known Member
Many wallaby species are nocturnal in the wild in order to avoid predation, including the parma wallaby. In captive environments they tend to be as active during the day as they would be at night. Many collections hold parma, rock wallabies in duirnal situations. Some places even hold potoroos or bettongs in daylight enclosures and even these are regularly visible.
But I agree that the central mammal species should be red kangaroo, only London does best with 'community' enclosures where visitors spend time trying to spot the different species rather than going from window to window as soon as they have seen an animal in each enclosure.
But I agree that the central mammal species should be red kangaroo, only London does best with 'community' enclosures where visitors spend time trying to spot the different species rather than going from window to window as soon as they have seen an animal in each enclosure.
There are too many problems with the exhibit and too few Australasian species available for this to be zoogeographically and climatically correct. Many of the smaller species mentioned - numbats, potoroos and rock wallabys would just hide and never be seen in an exhibit this size. Cape barren geese aren't really a great example of the outback as they are found in cool coastal marshy areas in the south east and west of the continent. Brolgas are a touch better, but again are mostly swamp dwellers. I liked the galah idea, as they are the only other species besides reds and emus that are easily available and found in the desert. Unless you want to add cockatiels, zebra finches and budgerigars... Hey now ZSL could be on to a winner with that combination! Who needs endangered species?
johnstoni
Well-Known Member
I actually would love to see a collection attempt a community of this kind with a large netted flight aviary for a large flock of green budgerigars, zebra finches and cockatiels, I think it would open the eyes of thousands of visitors to the conditions they keep them in as pets.