Better names for animals

[Chlidonias]

I do admit to liking older names, I still prefer 'Celebes black ape' to 'Sulawesi crested macaque' - although neither name is perfect: modernising place names is a fool's errand (surely we don't want to move our Muscovy ducks to Moskva) and Celebes is a good deal easier to say than Sulawesi, likewise describing tailless monkeys as apes is a historic English usage and perfectly simple and rational, it should be encouraged (how many times have you heard zoo visitors describe anthropoid apes as 'monkeys'?), on the other hand moor macaques and Heck's macaques are black apes from Celebes too, and I suspect that there are other species - but I'm too lazy to look them up.

I like Celebes black ape too! But I call the island Sulawesi.

One solution is to stick to scientific names, but then we are at the mercy of taxonomists like Prof Groves who change animals' names as soon as you look the other way and compete to invent unspeakable new names (the currrent champion may be Swedish ichthyologist Sven Kullander whose masterpiece is Tahuantinsuyoa macantzatza ).
Moral: you can't win

I have some better ones: Krinikillus dymczeviczii and Turbo czjzeki. I win the internet.

 

[Chlidonias]

Yes - back on topic!

I would disagree with Alan in that I don't mind updating place names in common names where they are relevant, because I think that makes them more comprehensible (and of course, Muscovy Duck has no genuine association with Moscow so it's more akin to being named after a person than a place).

I also think I've heard more people get 'Celebes' wrong than 'Sulawesi', actually.

So yeah, Sulawesi Macaque, Amur Tiger, Taiwanese Sika - fine with those.

'Painted Dog' - don't like. African Wild Dog is what I use as standard, but I'll often use 'Hunting Dog' in conversation.

On the nomenclature angle of 'gnu' vs. 'wildebeest' - I shall add my standard weirdness that I refer to Connochaetes as 'wildebeest', and might use that word just in a general sentence ("Were the zebras still mixed with the wildebeest?") but if I'm giving a specific taxon name I'd always use 'gnu' (e.g. White-tailed Gnu rather than Black Wildebeest). I'm not sure that's entirely logical, but it's how I roll.

I like the way "Celebes black ape" sounds better than "Sulawesi black macaque" does (although I do actually use the latter over the former). I will never use "Amur tiger" unless in a reply to someone else who has used it, to avoid confusion ("Siberian tiger" otherwise). Like Celebes, I prefer the sound of Formosan sika but I guess I'd use Taiwanese; no, actually I'll use Formosan. So much nicer.

Would you say Myanmar python then?

 

[gentle lemur]

I have some better ones: Krinikillus dymczeviczii and Turbo czjzeki. I win the internet.

Never! Tahuantinsuyoa macantzatza has more letters and far more syllables (probably ). Turbo czjzeki is just a Latinised sneeze - plus a good joke of course*

Alan

* it's a snail

 

[Maguari]

Would you say Myanmar python then?

No, but that is a slightly different case because of the political implications that the two names of that country still have. Once the country agrees within itself on a name, I'll make that call!

Also, while I'm happy to follow changes once they are made, using a name no-one recognises out of pedantry is a step too far, even for me.

For comparison from an unrelated field: The earliest Doctor Who serials weren't given overall names on screen. Doctor Who Magazine insists on referring to the first three Doctor Who serials by the names on the original paperwork - '100,000 B.C.', 'The Mutants' and 'Inside the Spaceship' - despite the fact that all the available commercial releases and the majority of those with need to care use the titles 'An Unearthly Child', 'The Daleks' and 'The Edge of Destruction' (and the fact that there is a later story that is very definitely called 'The Mutants' on screen). They are being perhaps more faithful to the original intention, but their insistence on the former set of names just creates confusion, when everyone's DVDs use the latter set.

So, I guess what I'm saying is I tend to use whatever is most likely to be understood. Luckily all the names changed for (what I would consider) the wrong reasons (Painted Dog, Orca) have well-understood alternatives.

 

[Chlidonias]

Never! Tahuantinsuyoa macantzatza has more letters and far more syllables (probably ). Turbo czjzeki is just a Latinised sneeze - plus a good joke of course*

Alan

* it's a snail

not difficult to say, but definitely more letters and syllables: Parastratiosphecomyia stratiosphecomyioides

 

[Chlidonias]

No, but that is a slightly different case because of the political implications that the two names of that country still have. Once the country agrees within itself on a name, I'll make that call!

Also, while I'm happy to follow changes once they are made, using a name no-one recognises out of pedantry is a step too far, even for me.

what about the Czechoslovakian wolf-dog? Persian cat? Siamese cat? Rhodesian ridgeback?

Seriously though, I still use "Abyssinian" in certain animal names (e.g. Abyssinian ground hornbill).

 

[Maguari]

what about the Czechoslovakian wolf-dog? Persian cat? Siamese cat? Rhodesian ridgeback?

Seriously though, I still use "Abyssinian" in certain animal names (e.g. Abyssinian ground hornbill).

It's the '100,000 B.C.' thing again. Iranian or Thai Cat or a Zimbabwean Ridgeback or Ethiopian Ground Hornbill wouldn't be understood, because those names haven't changed. If all the zoos started using Ethiopian Ground Hornbill, I'd happily use it. As they haven't*, there's no point in me going on a one-man crusade of confusion-stirring, tempting though the excessive pedantry would be!



*I have seen 'Northern', though.

 

[Chlidonias]

northern and southern ground hornbills seem to be the names of choice nowadays. It'll always be an Abyssinian ground hornbill to me though.

Back on track, elephant shrew changing to sengi! Horrible! Completely meaningless to anyone who doesn't already know what it is, whereas elephant shrew tells you right away it looks like a giant shrew, possibly a giant shrew with a trunk.

Contrasting with that opinion though, I much prefer colugo to flying lemur. And I prefer bushbaby to galago (although neither tell you anything about what it is).

 

[KEEPER]

About painted dogs Lycaon pictus it's literally 'painted wolf' in Latin,
because this species has spots three colours.
In the other hand about the 'non pronounceable' scientific names, the Latin names must be pronounced like in Spanish or Italian but not like in English

 

[Pertinax]

I like the way "Celebes black ape" sounds better than "Sulawesi black macaque" does

I think a few zoos do too- I think there is more than one that keeps them mainly because of the connotation and possible drawing power of the word 'Ape'.

 

[Pertinax]

on the other hand moor macaques and Heck's macaques are black apes from Celebes too, and I suspect that there are other species - but I'm too lazy to look them up.

I think there's something like five or is it seven species/subspecies of tailless macaques(Apes?) on Sulawesi. There is also the Tonkean Macaque and of course the Barbary 'Ape' of North Africa.

 

[gentle lemur]

I think there's something like five or is it seven species/subspecies of tailless macaques(Apes?) on Sulawesi. There is also the Tonkean Macaque and of course the Barbary 'Ape' of North Africa.

But how many of these other species are both black and tailless? I think Barbary ape is fine (but not 'Ape'). I would prefer people to name tailless macaques as apes rather than referring to anthropoid apes as monkeys.
And of course we have come back in a circle, because Barbary is an old name for Morocco, so who wants to rename the Barbary ape as the Moor macaque?

Alan