No offence to Pipaluck and Ian, who like myself remember when London had far more animals in the collection, but regarding the proposed revamp of the lion terraces, this could not come sooner in my opinion, I have never liked this exhibit since it was opened in 1976, now nearing forty years later, it looks, cold, unattractive and shabby, although I am not suggesting that the lions themselves are living in substandard accommodation. With the advent of Gorilla Kingdom and the new tiger exhibit, this even makes it look worse, it sticks out like a sore thumb. I have no doubt an enormous amount of money will be spent on this project, and I am sure we will be astonished at what it will cost, but definitely another step in the right direction.
ZSL London Zoo ZSL London Zoo News 2013
- Thread starter Newzooboy
- Start date
When the new tiger enclosure was being built i was critical of the amount being spent on an existing species twhen so many others had been lost. But i said i'd wait to be amazed- to be fair, i was.
We dont know the plans yet, but i just hope it's not at similar expense, as i wouldn't see it as a priority. If it's at the cost of losing yet more mammals to make way for
a lion enclosure, i for one will be even more disillusioned than ever!
Interested that you didnt like the cat
terraces in 76, are you saying you preferred
the 19th century lion house ?
IanRRobinson
Well-Known Member
[QUOTE We dont know the plans yet, but i just hope it's not at similar expense, as i wouldn't see it as a priority. If it's at the cost of losing yet more mammals to make way for a lion enclosure, i for one will be even more disillusioned than ever!
Interested that you didnt like the cat terraces in 76, are you saying you preferred the 19th century lion house ?[/QUOTE]
I agree. The Mappin Terraces need a dramatic species, and Lions would fit the bill perfectly.
The Lion Terraces, by contrast, need a revamp, not demolition. Most of the cats held there (Tigers conspicuously excluded) have bred well, and I see no reason why medium-sized carnivores - including a smaller bear species - couldn't do very well either.
As a suggestion, how about Dhole in the old Tiger enclosure; Snow Leopards in the central three enclosures; Pallas' Cat where the macaques are kept; and Sun Bears for the present Lion and old Leopard enclosures. Clever usage of a nearby tree would create an enclosure for Red Pandas, and the waterbird enclosure would surely look better with Asiatic Short-clawed Otters.
This leaves only the Events Lawn. It tends to be forgotten that this was envisaged as a temporary feature; the plan was for a Hippopotamus house on that site, but the downturn in the Zoo's fortunes from the late 1970s (which I would suggest it has never really reversed - look at the attendance figures) put paid to that.
Older visitors remember the Lion House as the heart of London Zoo. It was where friends would arrange to meet, and where Stamford Raffles' bust sat.
Some people like having bird of prey demonstrations there, even though that leaves the site sitting there empty and unused for a great deal of time. It's a matter of taste, but to me London Zoo's revival needs a high-profile species in that space. Personally, I would suggest that a deal needs to be struck with the Chinese..
Interested that you didnt like the cat terraces in 76, are you saying you preferred the 19th century lion house ?[/QUOTE]
I agree. The Mappin Terraces need a dramatic species, and Lions would fit the bill perfectly.
The Lion Terraces, by contrast, need a revamp, not demolition. Most of the cats held there (Tigers conspicuously excluded) have bred well, and I see no reason why medium-sized carnivores - including a smaller bear species - couldn't do very well either.
As a suggestion, how about Dhole in the old Tiger enclosure; Snow Leopards in the central three enclosures; Pallas' Cat where the macaques are kept; and Sun Bears for the present Lion and old Leopard enclosures. Clever usage of a nearby tree would create an enclosure for Red Pandas, and the waterbird enclosure would surely look better with Asiatic Short-clawed Otters.
This leaves only the Events Lawn. It tends to be forgotten that this was envisaged as a temporary feature; the plan was for a Hippopotamus house on that site, but the downturn in the Zoo's fortunes from the late 1970s (which I would suggest it has never really reversed - look at the attendance figures) put paid to that.
Older visitors remember the Lion House as the heart of London Zoo. It was where friends would arrange to meet, and where Stamford Raffles' bust sat.
Some people like having bird of prey demonstrations there, even though that leaves the site sitting there empty and unused for a great deal of time. It's a matter of taste, but to me London Zoo's revival needs a high-profile species in that space. Personally, I would suggest that a deal needs to be struck with the Chinese..
It was indeed. You could sit and chat on the raised seating at the back and watch the Cats at the same time, and always the Sparrows chirping as a background.. Those were the days! But I am pleased to hear the Lions will be getting yet more new accomodation. As mentioned above,and I agree, their current enclosure is cold and damp looking, the huge water moat with lots of green mould and algae is wasted space and the whole thing seems too shady also.
I also agree those terraces could be revamped to house an interesting display of other species too.
No, I am not suggesting that the old lion house was better, of course not, When the old monkey house was pulled down to make way for the Sobelle Pavilion,as a child I thought this new exhibit was very attractive and complimented the ambiance of London Zoo, the same I cannot say about the Lion Terraces when they opened in 1976, as A teenager I was a bit disappointed with them, and I have never really grown to like this exhibit, as Ian says, and I fully agree with, the area is definitely in need of a revamp, although that does not mean the welfare of the animals is currently being compromised, certainly not. I also agree that more species of mammal would be welcome at London space permitting, why then not let English Heritage take their beloved Lubitkin penguin pool piece by piece and reassemble it elsewhere, that would be a little more space for something new.
I agree entirely. It just looks like an empty enclosure despite the signage explaining its past.
IanRRobinson
Well-Known Member
I don't know if you'd agree with me, Shirokuma, but I feel that it would actually look rather good placed outside Tate Modern. That red-brick building echoes the old Lion House that Lubetkin had as his backdrop when designing the damn thing...
Many years ago, I sugggested selling the Penguin Pool to an art/architecture museum for £10 million. I was told that. as the Penguin Pool is a Grade I listed building in a Royal Park, it cannot be moved.
London Zoo has recently issued a statement to the effect that they admit to have pinioned birds and currently hold pinioned birds, however they are now going to stop doing this as it will be unnecessary to pinion birds in the future due to a new major exhibit they have planned. Reading this I would suggest this will involve netting over the three island pond area when the lion terraces are refurbished, well done London Zoo, excellent news.
@Tarzan, something to rejoice indeed. Did it say exactly which species and aviaries would be involved?
IanRRobinson
Well-Known Member
The only pinioned birds kept onsite are those on Three Island Pond, namely pelicans, flamingos and waterfowl. There are no cranes presently at London and the only storks - Abdim's and Woolly-necked - are kept fully winged.
I hate pinioning, so I will be pleased to see this done at London. Any other considerations apart, the Park do not seem to want a taller, more obtrusive fence around the Zoo, so Red Foxes have taken a regular toll .
But I must admit that I'd be mildly surprised if there weren't objections to roofing over Three Island Pond. It was part of Decimus Burton's original plan for London, and the heritage enthusiasts have taken an interest in it recent years.
I shall await this proposal with interest. Incidentally, there is a far bigger issue for ZSL to face as far as pinioned birds are concerned at Whipsnade - assuming welfare is the pretext, and not Vulpes vulpes
I hate pinioning, so I will be pleased to see this done at London. Any other considerations apart, the Park do not seem to want a taller, more obtrusive fence around the Zoo, so Red Foxes have taken a regular toll .
But I must admit that I'd be mildly surprised if there weren't objections to roofing over Three Island Pond. It was part of Decimus Burton's original plan for London, and the heritage enthusiasts have taken an interest in it recent years.
I shall await this proposal with interest. Incidentally, there is a far bigger issue for ZSL to face as far as pinioned birds are concerned at Whipsnade - assuming welfare is the pretext, and not Vulpes vulpes
Yes I think so too as not that long ago they were housed on the Mappin Terraces.
I thought the same thing when I read this.
Incidentally, a covered aviary for Flamingos and Pelicans wouldn't benefit them very much over being pinioned, I don't think, apart from the general welfare issue. For unpinioned Flamingos, they can achieve better balance in mating I know. But Pelicans, rather like raptors, soar at great heights so the 'freedom' of flight in an aviary is still incredibly restrictive for them.
IanRRobinson
Well-Known Member
I must admit that I haven't looked at the Snowdon recently, so I didn't know about the Brolgas. That move does sound rather like an effort at housing animals for which there's no coherent plan.
As far as pelicans are concerned, I simply don't think they ought to be at London at all. They really need a big sheet of water and privacy, and there is nowhere at London that can provide that. A good breeding flock could be established at Whipsnade - the lake in the drive through area might be a good place.
As far as pelicans are concerned, I simply don't think they ought to be at London at all. They really need a big sheet of water and privacy, and there is nowhere at London that can provide that. A good breeding flock could be established at Whipsnade - the lake in the drive through area might be a good place.
I heard from a zookeeper that they would change the mappin terraces into a walk through lemur exhibit. This was given before the gorilla kingdom was built so it might have been changed.
Also I heard that one of the female African Wild dogs was pregnant and was due to give birth in December 2012 so I was wondering if anyone knew anything.
Also I heard that one of the female African Wild dogs was pregnant and was due to give birth in December 2012 so I was wondering if anyone knew anything.