Zoo Chleby Zoo Chleby news

ZooChleby said:
Thanks, it is all of those - try, experiment and an effort,... We of course got all information we could, so we can learn from mistakes that has been made in past. The biggest problem is the right nutrition (leaves), there should not be any problem with diseases etc.
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Brilliant news, and thanks ZooChleby for signing up and setting the record straight.

I completely agree that another attempt to keep doucs in Europe is very welcome given advancements in husbandry. I'll be another to visit after they arrive.

I can't see the validity of arguing that another collection should lead this attempt - If Zoo Chleby can import doucs then it wouldn't be impossible for larger or more experienced facilities to lead the import if they put in enough effort. Clearly a lot of time, effort and resources have been spent on this import to start things with the best possible odds of success.

Chlidonias said:
the zoo in question is undoubtably the Dusit Zoo.
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It's certainly the most likely, but now several of the ZPO zoos hold red-shanked douc, as well as a few even less likely collections (like Safari World), it could potentially be from elsewhere.
 
Adopt a wait and see approach here. It may go either way, but I do think it is worth another try.

To claim that maintaining douc langurs has never been a success is not true, Koeln Zoo kept the for years. What is true: most European zoos seem to have reneged on species conservation and have actually allowed to let most Colobine primates to go out the window ... Often husbandry and nutritional issues have been cited.

But given the good record of zoos like Singapore and Thai zoos with douc langurs I rather think we are failing out of disinterest and lack of willing to learn from past errors - if there had been any -.
 
zoomaniac said:
Thank you very much for your reply. But unfortunately my question is still unanswered. Where there any efforts for a cooperation with other European and/or North American zoos to import this species and for further breeding coordination?
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Sorry for that :).
We have studied papers published by Koln zoo about langurs and son of the founder/diretor of Zoo Chleby is going within a month on a meeting and consultation with crator and langurs main keeper.
We established a group of experts on primates from czech zoos and if it will be necessary we will of course discuss langurs with others.
 
ZooChleby said:
We have studied papers published by Koln zoo about langurs and son of the founder/diretor of Zoo Chleby is going within a month on a meeting and consultation with crator and langurs main keeper.
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Are there any papers from Cologne besides Ruempler (1998)? If so, I'd be interested to have a read.

As a final word on the subject, the last sentence of the aforementioned paper (from Cologne's Curator of Primates at the time): "It would appear to be most unlikely that a sustainable captive population of Douc langurs will ever be established and conservation efforts should focus on preserving the species in its natural habitat."
 
Giant Panda said:
Are there any papers from Cologne besides Ruempler (1998)? If so, I'd be interested to have a read.

As a final word on the subject, the last sentence of the aforementioned paper (from Cologne's Curator of Primates at the time): "It would appear to be most unlikely that a sustainable captive population of Douc langurs will ever be established and conservation efforts should focus on preserving the species in its natural habitat."
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That may well be ..., but is an assessment of the 1998 era and not the eighties and seventies when more effort seemed to be put in maintaining and improving captive husbandry standards for douc langurs and other leaf-eating primates. As such I remain critical over the position promulgated by the 1998 Koelner Zoo paper.

Both the Singapore Zoo et al and the Thai Zooparks Foundation as well as the various rescue centers in Vietnam and other range states are demonstrating beyond doubt that it is relatively easy to maintain a captive population of douc langurs in captivity. And the expertise to do so is there.

Furthermore, I can vouch from personal observation that their nutritional needs can be met by providing a double ration of both fresh leaf matter and assorted vegetables and even selected fruits.


Aside: the wild populations of red-shanked doucs number in the low thousands and the only secure wild and well protected sites are in the vicinity of Da Nang and central Vietnam.

It is therefore wishful thinking that saving doucs will entirely be accomplished by conserving and protecting wild populations. In this respect, a double track and concerted effort on both the in situ front and ex situ conservation breeding / assurance colonies for douc langur species and other invariably threatened leaf monkey species is a definite and essential need and requirement for saving them from utter and final extinction.

A human race that allows only scientific positioning what may or may not be saved is hardly worth the paper they are written on and evokes the question what standards have we fallen to?

As such: I am quite willing for Zoo Chleby to take a chance on these captive-reared and honed red-shanked douc langurs from Thailand. And given that a good segment of the Czech Zoo Organisation is involved ensures by their professionalism and more adventurous spirit and determination to succeed - knowing quite a few of them on the ground I can and will vouch for that - gives me reason to be far more hopeful.

And let us face it: if we did not have mavericks ..., we would not have any champions for species conservation, let alone the rest ...
 
Thanks MikeG for the paper. I am familiar with it. I assume the Zoo Chleby staff and others in the Czech Republic will be quite interested in it.

I would actually quite like to see any papers from the zoo nutritional and husbandry practice at Singapore Zoo and the Thai Zoo Foundation zoos. Not sure if they have ever published any papers on the subject in peer reviewed journals. Allthough, I do know that the zoo in Bangkok has quite an extensive science division that is doing some ground breaking work there. I did take more than a few photographs of the separate TZF exhibit in the Bangkok Zoo when I was there (and it did mention a.o. clouded leopard, banteng/gaur and douc langur research ...).

Must recheck - if only for our Czech friends -!!!
 
Cheers for posting those, Mike.

@Kifaru Bwana: Thanks for sharing your insightful views. The passage I quoted is, of course, outdated to an extent, given that the species is doing well in Southeast Asian collections. My problem, then, is why we need to try again in Europe and the welfare issues that arise from the potential for failure. I hope you're right, however.
 
I am afraid doucs may never get to Chleby. But with modern technology, it should be perfectly possible to freeze leaves in summer or import leaves from the tropics in winter, just like tons of tropical produce get to European supermarkets at knock-down prices.
 
Jurek7 said:
I am afraid doucs may never get to Chleby. But with modern technology, it should be perfectly possible to freeze leaves in summer or import leaves from the tropics in winter, just like tons of tropical produce get to European supermarkets at knock-down prices.
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Why shouldn´t they get to Chleby?
 
Chleby Zoo reports:
Our director's son visited the Philadelphia Zoo, USA to discuss douc langurs with experts – they have a lot of experience with them, even though they now have only the last one. They were very interested in all we know so far (i.e. we have found out which Czech leaves are good for langurs in Thailand) and very excited to help us and tell us all they know. We are very grateful for their great approach!
 
Thank you, MikeG and also others for support :)

We are familiar with these papers, it helps of course a lot... Now we are going to visit Germany, so we will see, what they will tell us then.
In Philadelphia it was great, they were really helpful.

MikeG said:
Another potentially-useful paper:
"Comparative diet and nutrition of primates at the Singapore Zoo"
Journal of Zoo and Aquarium Research: Published online: 31 July 2014.
Comparative diet and nutrition of frugivorous and folivorous primates at the Singapore Zoo | Sha | Journal of Zoo and Aquarium Research
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Phantastic News-I will be in Czech next Year and with a bit luck, they will be alive at this time; even not all three of them, but maybe one or two.

I hope, more doucs will follow to other zoos, too, so the population of this amazing creatures will successfully grow in europe.
 
Bib Fortuna said:
Phantastic News-I will be in Czech next Year and with a bit luck, they will be alive at this time; even not all three of them, but maybe one or two.
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but you would, of course, hope that all three are still fit and well... :cool:
 
Chlidonias said:
but you would, of course, hope that all three are still fit and well... :cool:
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Of course I do---but you know as good as I do, all Animals die-sooner or later, but some sooner than later;)

So let us see whats happening with this three colerful guys,hopefully Chleby has more luck than Apenheul with their big nose monkeys or Berlin with its gazelles with the long neck.....All three doucs are born in CAPTIVITY so it wouldn't be a loss for the wild poluation if they shoud die without reproduction, and to keep Docus in CAPTITY won't save the species-it it just to display them. And to display animals is since the beginning of Zoos their main reason for the existence, its not eduacation, and its not conservation-even nowadays;).
 
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