Article about thoughts about animal welfare and animal rights :
Animal welfare and animal rights are very different beasts
Animal welfare and animal rights are very different beasts
Animal welfare and animal rights
- Thread starter vogelcommando
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For a few years I went to this annual dog show that was held in a convention center. The place was filled with booths, mostly pet product retailers and rescue groups. Most of these rescue groups had anti-PETA pamphlets with them and urged people to support animal welfare, not animal rights.
So, yeah, I'm not a fan of animal rights. Concept has a lot of flaws, besides, kind of boring to have a world where humans and animals never interact. (and what if the animal initiates the interaction? Happens sometimes) It acts like humans and animals are equal while at the same time not treating them as equals. It's hard to get around acknowledging that humans and animals have differences without sounding like an unreasonable lunatic, like those people who try to feed their cats vegan/vegetarian diets and then the cat gets horribly sick and is taken away. If animals don't have the same concepts of morality as us, and they aren't nearly as intelligent, does it make sense to treat them equally?
The book "Life of Pi" made a pretty good argument in favor of zoos, namely, that animals don't really have the same concept of freedom as us. Granted, I'm not a fan of keeping a few certain animals in captivity, but that's out of me feeling that it's not possible to meet the physical, mental, and emotional needs of certain species.
So, yeah, I'm not a fan of animal rights. Concept has a lot of flaws, besides, kind of boring to have a world where humans and animals never interact. (and what if the animal initiates the interaction? Happens sometimes) It acts like humans and animals are equal while at the same time not treating them as equals. It's hard to get around acknowledging that humans and animals have differences without sounding like an unreasonable lunatic, like those people who try to feed their cats vegan/vegetarian diets and then the cat gets horribly sick and is taken away. If animals don't have the same concepts of morality as us, and they aren't nearly as intelligent, does it make sense to treat them equally?
The book "Life of Pi" made a pretty good argument in favor of zoos, namely, that animals don't really have the same concept of freedom as us. Granted, I'm not a fan of keeping a few certain animals in captivity, but that's out of me feeling that it's not possible to meet the physical, mental, and emotional needs of certain species.
Leptonyx
Well-Known Member
@ TheMightyOrca I agree with you completely; the one thing (of many things) that bugs me about animal rights is that it's a completely circular argument. You can't argue that all animals are "equal" and deserving of life, if the life of one animal depends on the demise of the other. Even if some animals are able to change their diet to fit with their moral stance, it also becomes circular when we then infringe our ethics on said animal because then we're claiming to be superior to them 
Anyways, it's a good article that highlights the difference between the two fields of thought. I personally am a huge proponent for animal welfare, and it used to make me incredibly angry when people would look down at me and say "Oh, so you're with PETA then?". It makes animal welfare all the more an uphill battle because others expect you to be just as extreme as the animal rights groups in your suggestions to improve animal life. Oh well...
Anyways, it's a good article that highlights the difference between the two fields of thought. I personally am a huge proponent for animal welfare, and it used to make me incredibly angry when people would look down at me and say "Oh, so you're with PETA then?". It makes animal welfare all the more an uphill battle because others expect you to be just as extreme as the animal rights groups in your suggestions to improve animal life. Oh well...
@ TheMightyOrca I agree with you completely; the one thing (of many things) that bugs me about animal rights is that it's a completely circular argument. You can't argue that all animals are "equal" and deserving of life, if the life of one animal depends on the demise of the other. Even if some animals are able to change their diet to fit with their moral stance, it also becomes circular when we then infringe our ethics on said animal because then we're claiming to be superior to them
Anyways, it's a good article that highlights the difference between the two fields of thought. I personally am a huge proponent for animal welfare, and it used to make me incredibly angry when people would look down at me and say "Oh, so you're with PETA then?". It makes animal welfare all the more an uphill battle because others expect you to be just as extreme as the animal rights groups in your suggestions to improve animal life. Oh well...
Yeah, good point on forcing our ethics and views on said animal. I hate when people do that. A lot of animal rights people (though not all of them) do seem to have this mindset that animals think and see the world just like humans. Which isn't fair to the animal and can actually be a dangerous mindset to have. (dangerous to people and animals) Oh, bonus points if the animal rights activists in question think all animals are naturally nice and peaceful and docile. It's true that most animals won't attack without reason, but many of them might attack for reasons we don't consider or understand and it's idiotic and dangerous to think we can interact with them as we would another human, or even a domestic animal. That tiger probably isn't going to attack me for food, but it might see me as a threat to its territory, so I'm standing back. Elephants can be friendly animals, but they can also be aggressive.
And if we are going to say animals are just like humans... Some animals are a lot like humans in their intelligence and diversity of personality, and like humans, they can be capable of compassion or cruelty. We judge humans based on actions, criticizing and punishing the bad ones on the basis that they should know to act better. If we are to see animals as people and we know they're capable of being good, should we look down on the ones who are bad? It's the inherent flaw of the version of animal rights where we're supposed to see all animals, including humans, as equals. We can't truly see animals as equal unless we hold them to the same standards, and doing that wouldn't be reasonable or fair to the animal.
And yeah, PETA ruins so many things. I'm opposed to orca captivity (and possibly cetacean captivity in general; I'm still on the fence about that) and they make it a lot harder for people to take my stance seriously. I spent SO much time mulling over the topic and doing research and then made the hard decision to oppose it; I hate when people think I'm some idiot who fell for PETA propaganda, or one of those people who thinks dolphins are totally just like humans.
(I have a growing obsession with dolphins, but my fear of being associated with the New Agey people keeps me from expressing it fully, buuut that's a different topic)