Animals You've Seen That Few Zoochatters Have Seen

Chlidonias said:
Yes... hence they have rarely been seen by Zoochatters. The same as saying few Zoochatters have seen Grey-shanked Doucs because few Zoochatters have been to Vietnam. That's generally how something being rarely seen works - they are either wild or captive in places to which few Zoochatters have been. It's not difficult to understand.
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OK, I really didn't expect it to be that simple, and was guilty of massively over-thinking it then - maybe Red Kangaroos and Emus are species which Few Zoochatters Have Seen, as it says above - after all... but it doesn't say 'In the Wild' so how can they be....? Sorry, I must be missing something which is apparently very obvious to you.
 
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TeaLovingDave said:
Until the decade or so before the species disappeared from Europe, it was faring pretty well in European collections - not many collections held the species relatively speaking, but they bred ridiculously well in those collections which did hold them; Wuppertal alone had a breeding population of something like 20 individuals in the early 1990s.

Then the population crashed due to genetic bottlenecking allowing fatal kidney disease to become prevalent in the captive population, sad to say. To give an idea of how fast the decline hit, of the 24 collections listed on ZTL as having held the species, 14 still did so within the 2000s and 2010s.
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We received the last 2.2 elderly Black-footed and 2.2 Rusty-spotted from Banham (along with their Collared and Sanford's Lemurs) before the above mentioned decline hit. Banham had kept both spp indoors. Neither spp bred 'ridiculously well' at Banham, and the Black-footed died here of kidney disease very quickly. Wild collected and F1 generation animals also had the same kidney problems in captivity in South Africa. There were a number of theories and Wuppertal always considered diet to be a factor and advised a proportion of vegetable matter, which our animals consistently refused. Feline vaccines changed at the time as commercial drug companies moved from inactivated to live vaccines, which were implicated too, but without any real proof either way.
 
Andrew Swales said:
Wild collected and F1 generation animals also had the same kidney problems in captivity in South Africa.
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Indeed, and still do in the USA I believe; I'd always been given to understand that the factor which made the fatal difference was that (as I noted) there was a distinct genetic bottleneck in the European population and - until a few years before the species disappeared from Europe - there were no attempts to obtain new bloodlines, and thus the kidney disease started to affect animals at younger and younger ages. The last individuals at Port Lympne only reached 2 or 3 years old I think.

I've never heard the theory about feline vaccines before - very interesting!
 
TeaLovingDave said:
I've never heard the theory about feline vaccines before - very interesting!
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The uncertainty over safety of the only vaccines available at the time (the 'live' ones) in non-domestic felids, was the reason Banham retained both spp indoors, to minimise the risk of keeping both the Black-footed and the Rusty-spotted un-vaccinated. Reduction of their collection by surplussing animals housed off-show not 'earning their keep' and in potential development areas, was the reason they came to us.

Currently Cheetah also have problems with kidney disease (and probably always have had), and it is ultimately the eventual cause of death of most individuals. Successful medication now allows a much extended and full life for many animals with compromised kidney function. We did not know this at the time with the Black-footed, so did not try it. I assume it has been tried in the US and SA, but of course remains a management tool for affected animals and not any kind of prevention. I think you are right in that in-breeding led to younger animals being affected, but there remains something 'different' about the susceptibility of Black-footed...
 
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Andrew Swales said:
OK, I really didn't expect it to be that simple, and was guilty of massively over-thinking it then - maybe Red Kangaroos and Emus are species which Few Zoochatters Have Seen, as it says above - after all... but it doesn't say 'In the Wild' so how can they be....? Sorry, I must be missing something which is apparently very obvious to you.
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The bit you were missing was where he specified them being wild.
 
This is the relevant post where A_E01 said he was talking about wild sightings:

animal_expert01 said:
Wild
Rufous Bettong**
Australian Bustard
Paradise Riflebird
Mary River Cod
Banded Plover*
Black Bittern
Blind Shark
Ornate Rainbowfish
Ragged Snake Eyed Skink
Elegant Snake Eyed Skink
Red Kangaroo* **
Rose Crowned Fruit Dove
Emu* **
Spinifex Pigeon
Leaden Flycatcher
Emerald Dove
Australian Pratincole
Fairy Penguin* **
Blue Billed Duck
Major Skink
Platypus* **
Comb Crested Jacana

*means I think quite a few people would have seen them in the wild but I'm asking just in case.
** means I have also seen the animal in captivity
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animal_expert01 said:
I never said any of them were rare, in fact in certain locations some of these species can be quite abundant (as I’m sure your quite aware). I just based my list of species that had limited ranges or were found in places people don’t usually visit.
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Oh yeah. That wasn't supposed to be a knock or anything. I was just a bit confused about why that specific mix of species, seeing as some of those are quite common and easy like the jacana, penguin, emu or red roo. And at least the last two I reckon lots of people would have seen in zoos outside Aus.

So probably the only things that could be considered rare sightings amongst zoochatters would be Mary River Cod, Ornate Rainbowfish, Paradise Riflebird, Australian Bustard, Emu, Spinifex Pigeon and Red Kangaroo.
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I reckon the Bittern might be up there too.

On a side note, I would be very interested in seeing your list.
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I don't really have much of an idea what other zoochatters have or haven't seen cause I haven't been a member here for that long. But I might get around to compiling a top ten or sth of what I think are generally rare species that I have seen in the next couple of days.
 
TinoPup said:
I'm surprised you haven't seen the vervet! Rosamond Gifford has them, plus San Diego and a few others.
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I have seen Common Vervet, Chlorocebus pygerythrus, and Grivet, C. aethiops, but I have never seen Green Monkey, C. sabaeus.

~Thylo
 
Here's a new attempt at a list. Species marked with an asterisk were wild:

Tree Pangolin
Kodiak Bear
Hawaiian Monk Seal
American Mink*
Common Muskrat*
Least Weasel*
North American Deer Mouse*
White-footed Mouse
Southern Flying Squirrel*
Snowshoe Hare*
Thirteen-lined Ground Squirrel*
Franklin's Ground Squirrel
Eastern Red Bat*
Hoary Bat*
Little Brown Bat*
Royal Antelope
Northern Short-tailed Shrew*
American Pygmy Shrew*

I've only listed mammals here because, due to the surprisingly low number of American birders on this site, the bird list would be pretty long. :p
 
@animal_expert01
Here's a quick (Australian) mammal list of species I've seen in the wild that I'm guessing most zoochatters haven't seen. (I've excluded common species and those that are also around in zoos even if rare in the wild.) Would be interesting to know if anyone else has seen any of 'em?

Top 7:
Northern Hairy-nosed Wombat
Long-tailed Pygmy-possum
Little Pygmy-possum (mainland)
Scaly-tailed Possum
Gilbert's Potoroo
Long-footed Potoroo
Cape York Rock-wallaby

These other one's might work for the purpose of this thread too:
Brush-tailed Phascogale
Little Red Kaluta
Sandstone False-antechinus
Woolley's False-antechinus
Cinnamon Antechinus
Buff-footed Antechinus
Stripe-faced Dunnart
Gilbert's Dunnart
Cape York Brown Bandicoot
Northern Long-nosed Bandicoot
Southern Common Cuscus
Godman's Rock-wallaby
Sharman's Rock-wallaby
Herbert's Rock-wallaby
Monjon
Purple-necked Rock-wallaby
Rothschild's Rock-wallaby

Bare-backed Fruit-bat
Coastal Sheathtail Bat
Cape York Melomys
Cape York Rat
Kimberley Rock-rat
Golden-backed Tree-rat
Australian Snubfin Dolphin

"Captive" species (not seen in the wild):
Common Planigale
Banded Hare-wallaby
Nabarlek (I know some others have seen it too but I'm still including it just based on the current status/situation of the species and it basically being the only accessible individual)
 
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here are some i came to think of. most of them are wild. most Swedish zoos just keep common exotic or just local fauna
mammals
a wild snowlepard
saiga wild
goiterde gazeel i don`t now how rare they are. the only i now is korkeasaari zoo has them but i am sure some more do. wild
tadjik urial captive
siberian roe dear wild
siberian marmot wild
hoffman two toed sloth rare in Europe captive
tail les tenrec



birds
ther is only three zoos in the worlds that keep white backed vodpecker is in sweden and i have bean to two of them.
hazel grouse
pallas sandgrouse
lots of birds of birds from mongolia or borneo.
most maurtitus enedmicks
and some seychells endemics cant find if there are any in captivety
 
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Najade said:
Here's a quick (Australian) mammal list of species I've seen in the wild that I'm guessing most zoochatters haven't seen. (I've excluded common species and those that are also around in zoos even if rare in the wild.) Would be interesting to know if anyone else has seen any of 'em?
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I have only seen one of those! - the Northern Long-nosed Bandicoot.
 
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