Has any date been given as to when construction might start
Australasian Asian Elephant Population 2021
- Thread starter Zoofan15
- Start date
This is the schedule Werribee have released for completion:
June 2021: Bison Plains
January 2022: Woodlands, Safari Station and Cheetah
September 2022: Waterhole
August 2023: Lions
December 2023: Elephants Phase I
The construction of first phase of the elephant complex should begin in late 2022/early 2023, baring in mind everything’s been pushed back a little due to COVID-19 (the elephants wont arrive until 2024).
The Bison Plains, which was scheduled for June, hasn’t even opened yet; and when I did visit back then there were no signs of construction.
Considering the Woodlands and Safari Station was meant to open next month and we haven’t heard any updates nor have I seen any construction at the zoo regarding it yet; the whole redevelopment is probably delayed by at least 6+ months.
This could push the Elephant move all the way back to the end of 2024, unless they play priorities and prioritise the elephant move over the Lions.
I agree,I believe with several babies due the elephant complex should be given top priority
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Their lion pride currently consists of three lionesses. At one stage, they held a breeding pride of 11 in what remains an adequate exhibit, so the elephants are definitely the higher priority in my opinion.
Melbourne Zoo’s complex is arguably overcrowded already by modern welfare standards and the three calves will certainly tip them over the edge, which isn’t a huge deal if they’re only to remain at Melbourne for their first year.
The delay in moving the herd to Werribee will likely extend the natural three to four year birth interval by a year or two, but this is no big deal and I suspect the zoo may even opt to breed every five years as a midway compromise between natural birth intervals and the upper limit of 10 years.
I believe the current enclosures will remain, but they’ll receive an extension so they can be viewed on the Safari tour as well. There isn’t any rush to breed them at the moment so there’s no harm in keeping the situation like this for a year longer.
Melbournes facilities are definitely beginning to look overcrowded, and when Luk Chai is in with the girls they have to give them both enclosures (the cows and the bulls) to give them enough space. The barn is only suitable for around 6-8 cows, preferably around 6 and with the calves arriving it’ll definitely push them over the top so they’d be wanting to get the complex at Werribee completed as soon as possible.
Would have to agree I guess now is the time for common sense to kick in. Another thing would be if over crowding did cause an accident the AR crowd would be right on to it about not having elephants in captivity
Unlikely to happen, but if it does it could be very detrimental for the zoo. At least they will be moving them to Werribee anyway.
The main thing I’m a little concerned about is their barn size. The barn only has 3 small stalls and then a much bigger stall with sand mounds which I think is their designated sleeping area although I’m not quite sure. I believe some of the cows sleep there and the rest are spread out over the remaining stalls.
Maybe they’ll have to move Man Jai into the bull barn with Luk Chai, but that’ll mean they’ll have to share the same overnight space.
There is a slight sense of urgency to bring in a male lion as Nilo and Nairibi turn 10 early next year. Even if breeding efforts are to focus on the younger lioness, it would be advantageous to bring in the male while Nilo and Nairibi are still cycling.
Monarto tried to introduce their new males to their oldest lionesses (born 2004) and their younger lionesses (born 2013), but were unable to integrate the former due to them being unreceptive to the males. It was a real shame as it would have been nice to see a multigenerational pride - something which can hopefully be achieved at Werribee.
Nonetheless, a male lion could be brought in with or without the extension, so hopefully it’s on the back burner while they sort out their elephants.
Man Jai will need to leave the female herd before the birth of the calves, so it would free up maximum space for the female herd if he could be integrated with Luk Chai overnight.
That’s correct. In the bull barn there is only one main stall and then a small outdoor pen adjacent to it. If Luk Chai and Man Jai were to be held together overnight, it’d be better if they had access to the outdoor pen too.
I believe Luk Chai used to stay with Sabai overnight back at Dubbo, so it would be much easier to put him with Man Jai.
Not to be little Johnny Contrarian here, but am I the only one who sees quite a few drawbacks in all this? In the sense that while an open-range enclosure is fantastic and all... aren't Asian elephants more of a forest-dwelling species that need significant amounts of shade? (Granted, that can be rectified with trasplanted mature trees and unobstructive shade-structures, kinda like TWPZ). That, and while the hippo exhibit is themed to look like an African river complete with boardwalks, marshes and accessible "boat"-style viewing, could that be the case for the elephants as well with an Asian-style fishing village? I'm not too impressed with the current renderings, though I am interested in hearing the counterpoints to what I'm saying.
I agree with you to a point but I believe that in this case a growing herd needs the space which I feel is a bigger priority than theming , I hope some mature trees can be transplanted and hope there are a lot of shade structures also, I believe this exhibit complex can be a big winner for Werribee something the zoo was really lacking
I’ll admit you make some good points, Mr Contrarian.
Artist rendering show the exhibits to be planted with mature trees (albeit behind fencing to prevent the elephants from stripping the bark). Shade structures (like at Dubbo) aren’t shown, but will presumably be used to provide additional shade.
While the Asian elephant is indeed a forest dwelling species, I think they’re largely having to work with the local climate; and priority has been given to giving the elephants wide open spaces. As mentioned, the trees need protection and planting beyond what they have outlined would comprise the wide open spaces they’re aiming for.
The current shade features will be unobtrusive and placed strategically to maximise viewing points i.e. encouraging the elephants to congregate where they can be seen.
If they were given a mini forest it would be destroyed very quickly. At Melbourne, they had a few trees and were absolutely covered in grass, but over time they have all disappeared.
As @Zoofan15 pointed out with the climate we have here is not really suitable for a forest to be created. The plans seem to show a lot of natural trees though which should provide adequate shade.
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This has been rescheduled for April 2022 and the elephants have now begun crate training, which they are progressing well with.
The keepers noted Anjalee (2006) is a lot more confident around the crates than Burma, having arrived at Auckland Zoo in 2015.
Burma (1982) has been at Auckland Zoo since 1990, so this will be a big change for her. She will hopefully settle in well at Australia Zoo. They have a great exhibit.
I was told Melbourne were interested in getting Anjalee but unfortunately didn’t really have the space for another breeding cow.
With Anjalee’s arrival to Dubbo, she’ll push the female herd to four cows.
I’d assume the plan is to breed from both her and Thong Dee when she arrives next year. as Thong Dee hasn’t had a calf in more than 5 years now. This would give them two calves at the same time, and seems the next most logical step for their breeding program.
Sounds like a good plan
It’s probably for the best that Werribee won’t be receiving Anjalee as they’ve already got three breeding cows. I’d rather see them breed regularly from the three cows they have versus having to restrict breeding like at Taronga.
My prediction is they’re look at mating Thong Dee in late 2022. This will give Anjalee time to settle into the herd before any pregnancies arise, which can impact upon behaviour.
Then when Thong Dee is a few months into her pregnancy, they’ll look at breeding Anjalee. A gap of three months (an insignificant gap in the long run) will allow Anjalee a chance to witness the birth and newborn process role modelled by an experienced mother.
Irregardless of what maternal behaviour she did or didn’t observe at the orphanage, it will do her no harm to observe it again prior to her own first birth.
Swanson02
Well-Known Member
Visited Australia Zoo on a very rainy day today and luckily had a good long chat with one of the off-duty elephant keepers. I apologise in advance as some of the information he gave me may have already been stated in this discussion.
He said that Australia Zoo were now expecting just one Sumatran bull as the import was being delayed by covid (and potentially Australia Zoo's finances?). He was also adamant that Australia Zoo were managing elephants at a subspecies level and there would be no hybridisation (makes me wonder if it was a part of the deal with Taman Safari?). The ETA he gave me on the lone bull import was 2-5 years and that Australia Zoo would commence construction of an off exhibit bull enclosure when they got the go ahead. With the plan to eventually construct a dedicated on-display bull exhibit after arrival (potentially to the north of the current cow exhibit?).
When I asked him about breeding in relation to the progressing ages of Megawati and Widya he wasn't too phased. Saying that they will not be attempting to breed from Megawati and that with Widya it was likely a no as well, as it really depended on the time of the bull import. He was confident that they could found a program around just Christina and Raflesia. Also apparently two of the cows are half-sisters through their father, I can't remember but I believe it was either Widya and Raflesia, or Raflesia and Christina. Sorry again if this information has already been shared or if some of it is wrong.
He said that Australia Zoo were now expecting just one Sumatran bull as the import was being delayed by covid (and potentially Australia Zoo's finances?). He was also adamant that Australia Zoo were managing elephants at a subspecies level and there would be no hybridisation (makes me wonder if it was a part of the deal with Taman Safari?). The ETA he gave me on the lone bull import was 2-5 years and that Australia Zoo would commence construction of an off exhibit bull enclosure when they got the go ahead. With the plan to eventually construct a dedicated on-display bull exhibit after arrival (potentially to the north of the current cow exhibit?).
When I asked him about breeding in relation to the progressing ages of Megawati and Widya he wasn't too phased. Saying that they will not be attempting to breed from Megawati and that with Widya it was likely a no as well, as it really depended on the time of the bull import. He was confident that they could found a program around just Christina and Raflesia. Also apparently two of the cows are half-sisters through their father, I can't remember but I believe it was either Widya and Raflesia, or Raflesia and Christina. Sorry again if this information has already been shared or if some of it is wrong.
