Australasian Orangutan Population

[Jambo]

@Zoofan15 - Auckland Zoo staff have also told me that Zabu was wild-born and that added to Charlie's genetic value (possibly his mother Girlie was also, but I am not sure about that). Some of Zabu's surviving offspring have been determined to be hybrids, also - I always thought that Mandai Wildlife Reserve never confirmed the paternity of the iconic Sumatran orangutan Ah Meng's hybrid daughter, Medan, but an Australian friend who knows the Singapore orangutans well has informed me that Zabu did indeed sire Medan (and also, unfortunately, Medan's son Budi).

I've wondered if new import Daya was chosen because, not only will she soon be old enough to breed with Charlie, she will also still be of prime breeding age when Bahmi matures, should the unthinkable happen and Charlie passes away. and Auckland Zoo therefore decided to retain Bahmi as breeding male.

Girlie was also wild born so Charlie is a first generation male.

I'd say your probably right with that assumption. Charlie is entering his 40's and not many males have reached their 40's. Hopefully Charlie is able to have at least one offspring with Daya, but after his eventual passing, Bahmi would obviously be a suitable mate for her and her offspring (if it is a girl).

Long term I'd assume the goal would be to use Bahmi as their breeding male; he's very valuable and his mother, Melur is in her mid 30's so there's also a chance Bahmi will be her last offspring (especially with Charlie ageing). New females could also be imported to breed with Bahmi if desired.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

Girlie was also wild born so Charlie is a first generation male.

I'd say your probably right with that assumption. Charlie is entering his 40's and not many males have reached their 40's. Hopefully Charlie is able to have at least one offspring with Daya, but after his eventual passing, Bahmi would obviously be a suitable mate for her and her offspring (if it is a girl).

Long term I'd assume the goal would be to use Bahmi as their breeding male; he's very valuable and his mother, Melur is in her mid 30's so there's also a chance Bahmi will be her last offspring (especially with Charlie ageing). New females could also be imported to breed with Bahmi if desired.

@Jambo - thanks for that information! That certainly makes Charlie and his offspring very valuable indeed. I'd think so, too, that Melur is unlikely to breed again, though occasionally older females have given birth, including Melur's own mother, Yasmin.

I am hoping Bahmi will be retained as breeding male, as he and Daya have a good chance of bonding, going forward, as Daya is introduced to the habitat and new companions.

 

[Jambo]

@Jambo - thanks for that information! That certainly makes Charlie and his offspring very valuable indeed. I'd think so, too, that Melur is unlikely to breed again, though occasionally older females have given birth, including Melur's own mother, Yasmin.

I am hoping Bahmi will be retained as breeding male, as he and Daya have a good chance of bonding, going forward, as Daya is introduced to the habitat and new companions.

It would explain why Charlie is still considered a valuable male, even though he has many half siblings through his father.

Considering Melur is currently 35 and females usually have gaps of at least six to seven years, that would mean her next offspring would arrive sometime around the age of 40, which is possible. My concern isn't her being able to concieve at that time, it's more Charlie still being around at that time. If he is, I don't see why she shouldn't be able to have one final offspring.

Bahmi has the benefit of being a younger male, and so in a decades time he would still be a younger male once Charlie passes. At that time we can assume *hopefully* we'll have at least one offspring from Daya too. Bahmi could then breed with Daya who'll still be fairly young herself and the opportunity to acquire an additional female could be explored too.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - Auckland Zoo staff have also told me, if I remember right, that Zabu was wild-born and that added to Charlie's genetic value (possibly his mother Girlie was also, but I am not sure about that). Some of Zabu's surviving offspring have been determined to be hybrids, also - I always thought that Mandai Wildlife Reserve never confirmed the paternity of the iconic Sumatran orangutan Ah Meng's hybrid daughter, Medan, but an Australian friend who knows the Singapore orangutans well has informed me that Zabu did indeed sire Medan (and also, unfortunately, Medan's son Budi).

I've wondered if new import Daya was chosen because, not only will she soon be old enough to breed with Charlie, she will also still be of prime breeding age when Bahmi matures, should the unthinkable happen and Charlie passes away. and Auckland Zoo therefore decided to retain Bahmi as breeding male.

It would explain why Charlie is still considered a valuable male, even though he has many half siblings through his father.

Considering Melur is currently 35 and females usually have gaps of at least six to seven years, that would mean her next offspring would arrive sometime around the age of 40, which is possible. My concern isn't her being able to concieve at that time, it's more Charlie still being around at that time. If he is, I don't see why she shouldn't be able to have one final offspring.

Bahmi has the benefit of being a younger male, and so in a decades time he would still be a younger male once Charlie passes. At that time we can assume *hopefully* we'll have at least one offspring from Daya too. Bahmi could then breed with Daya who'll still be fairly young herself and the opportunity to acquire an additional female could be explored too.

Charlie is currently ranked as the second most genetically valuable male in the global captive population. I disucssed the concern with a keeper that delaying breeding Charlie with Daya could risk Charlie not being around, but they assured me he’s in excellent health and they’re confident he’ll be around for a few years yet.

I imagine Charlie and Melur will breed again circa 2027 if time allows. In the meantime, Charlie and Daya will hopefully welcome an offspring. They may chose to stagger the births so they’re not catering to more than one neonatal mother at a time. Plus Melur is out of action for at least three years and there’s no reason to delay Daya this long.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Jambo - thanks for that information! That certainly makes Charlie and his offspring very valuable indeed. I'd think so, too, that Melur is unlikely to breed again, though occasionally older females have given birth, including Melur's own mother, Yasmin.

I am hoping Bahmi will be retained as breeding male, as he and Daya have a good chance of bonding, going forward, as Daya is introduced to the habitat and new companions.

In the event Melur does breed, she’ll be the oldest female orangutan to give birth at Auckland Zoo. Females have bred into their early to mid-40’s overseas (unlike gorillas, where late 30’s seems to be the upper limit).

I think there’s a reasonable chance Bahmi will stay on as Auckland’s next breeding male. The only thing that could disrupt this is if Daya and Melur each produce a daughter in turn. This would be an excellent way to grow the colony with mothers/daughters standing a better chance of remaining a cohesive unit long term as opposed to bringing in new females, which may clash with Melur and Daya. Bahmi is genetically valuable, so there’s a strong likelihood he’ll be paired with two females (at Auckland or elsewhere).

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

In the event Melur does breed, she’ll be the oldest female orangutan to give birth at Auckland Zoo. Females have bred into their early to mid-40’s overseas (unlike gorillas, where late 30’s seems to be the upper limit).

I think there’s a reasonable chance Bahmi will stay on as Auckland’s next breeding male. The only thing that could disrupt this is if Daya and Melur each produce a daughter in turn. This would be an excellent way to grow the colony with mothers/daughters standing a better chance of remaining a cohesive unit long term as opposed to bringing in new females, which may clash with Melur and Daya. Bahmi is genetically valuable, so there’s a strong likelihood he’ll be paired with two females (at Auckland or elsewhere).

It will be very interesting to see how everything plays out with future breeding. Daya's arrival is an exciting development and I am hopeful that we will see more orangutan births in the coming years. In the meantime, I personally am looking forward to how Daya interacts with her new companions.

 

[Zoofan15]

It will be very interesting to see how everything plays out with future breeding. Daya's arrival is an exciting development and I am hopeful that we will see more orangutan births in the coming years. In the meantime, I personally am looking forward to how Daya interacts with her new companions.

I’m really excited to have Daya here after the import of the two female Bornean orangutans from Usti Zoo was canned. They were a wild born mother and first generation daughter, so would have created a very valuable line with Charlie.

I hear there’s been positive interactions through the mesh between Daya and Bahmi, which is good to hear. Some of the integration process of the three Sydney females to the colony was covered in the third season of The Zoo and involved the three of them being introduced to Horst first. The youngest member of the colony was the then seven year old Isim, so introductions may be undertaken with more caution due to an infant being involved. Either way I imagine they’ll introduce Charlie and Daya first.

Daya (DOB 27/05/2012) had a full sibling born 11/05/2016; and a half sibling born 10/03/2019, so has had plenty of exposure to infants.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

I’m really excited to have Daya here after the import of the two female Bornean orangutans from Usti Zoo was canned. They were a wild born mother and first generation daughter, so would have created a very valuable line with Charlie.

I hear there’s been positive interactions through the mesh between Daya and Bahmi, which is good to hear. Some of the integration process of the three Sydney females to the colony was covered in the third season of The Zoo and involved the three of them being introduced to Horst first. The youngest member of the colony was the then seven year old Isim, so introductions may be undertaken with more caution due to an infant being involved. Either way I imagine they’ll introduce Charlie and Daya first.

Daya (DOB 27/05/2012) had a full sibling born 11/05/2016; and a half sibling born 10/03/2019, so has had plenty of exposure to infants.

@Zoofan15 - I am fascinated to see how things will develop between Daya and her new habitat-mates, and hope that Bahmi and Daya might develop a similar playful bond to the one Madju and Wanita had. It will bode well for them going forward. Some of the zoo staff indicated that Daya seemed to be a bit shy of the adult orangutans, but hopefully that will change as they all get used to each other.

I visited the zoo on Sunday, and the family group were kept indoors as Daya was allowed to have the habitat all to herself for the entire day. She seemed a lot more confident than when I saw her last, happily climbing and exploring and sitting in the nesting basket to eat and observe the delighted visitors. And she calmly ignored the siamang pair next door, who according to a keeper were singing louder than he's ever heard them at the sight of Daya next door! Intan was puffing himself up and staring down at Daya from the aerial pathways. Daya didn't seem bothered by the gibbons at all and seemed happy and energetic for the entire day.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - I am fascinated to see how things will develop between Daya and her new habitat-mates, and hope that Bahmi and Daya might develop a similar playful bond to the one Madju and Wanita had. It will bode well for them going forward. Some of the zoo staff indicated that Daya seemed to be a bit shy of the adult orangutans, but hopefully that will change as they all get used to each other.

I visited the zoo on Sunday, and the family group were kept indoors as Daya was allowed to have the habitat all to herself for the entire day. She seemed a lot more confident than when I saw her last, happily climbing and exploring and sitting in the nesting basket to eat and observe the delighted visitors. And she calmly ignored the siamang pair next door, who according to a keeper were singing louder than he's ever heard them at the sight of Daya next door! Intan was puffing himself up and staring down at Daya from the aerial pathways. Daya didn't seem bothered by the gibbons at all and seemed happy and energetic for the entire day.

I’m glad to hear Daya is settling in well and growing in confidence. As the adolescent of the colony, I anticipate we’ll see her make even greater use of the aerial pathways than Charlie and Melur.

Melur is sweet natured and shy, so Daya will surely have an easier time integrating with her than she would with females with stronger personalities.

Since Melur and Gangsa arrived at 12 and 11 years respectively in March 2001, it’d be interesting to know how they got on with Intan, who turned 12 years old that month. I’ve heard nothing of her their relationship; but know Intan was reserved and shy, so likely kept to herself. Isim apparently embraced them the most; as well as Charlie, who loves females (despite Indra and Intan preferring Horst).

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

I’m glad to hear Daya is settling in well and growing in confidence. As the adolescent of the colony, I anticipate we’ll see her make even greater use of the aerial pathways than Charlie and Melur.

Melur is sweet natured and shy, so Daya will surely have an easier time integrating with her than she would with females with stronger personalities.

Since Melur and Gangsa arrived at 12 and 11 years respectively in March 2001, it’d be interesting to know how they got on with Intan, who turned 12 years old that month. I’ve heard nothing of her their relationship; but know Intan was reserved and shy, so likely kept to herself. Isim apparently embraced them the most; as well as Charlie, who loves females (despite Indra and Intan preferring Horst).

I'm looking forward to seeing the orangutan group fully integrated. And thank you for providing some insight into the previous orangutan group. I think there will be a lot less conflict than there would have been if there had been stronger personalities like Gangsa and Wanita thrown into the mix.

 

[Zoofan15]

I'm looking forward to seeing the orangutan group fully integrated. And thank you for providing some insight into the previous orangutan group. I think there will be a lot less conflict than there would have been if there had been stronger personalities like Gangsa and Wanita thrown into the mix.

Auckland Zoo have so many advantages here both with the personalities (Charlie is also regarded as placid for a male of his species); and with the amazing complex they have, which offers the apes opportunities to have space from one another. It’s a far cry from the rainy days the previous colony spent in the dayroom of the old exhibit, where six adults and one adolescent would cohabit.

It stands to reason that increased space will reduce conflict and 2-3 females is surely ideal for ensuring a lone female isn’t harassed by the attentions of the male. I’m not sure if you ever saw The Zoo: This is your Life, but it did an episode on Indra’s life (covering her arrival, the births of her offspring, her escape and how she was affected by Dara’s death). There was a scene where Charlie was let back in with the group following his two week rotation with Horst and he made a beeline straight for Indra, ignoring the others. It was quite overwhelming for her (especially without Dara to share the attention) and the import of the Sydney females was surely beneficial.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

Auckland Zoo have so many advantages here both with the personalities (Charlie is also regarded as placid for a male of his species); and with the amazing complex they have, which offers the apes opportunities to have space from one another. It’s a far cry from the rainy days the previous colony spent in the dayroom of the old exhibit, where six adults and one adolescent would cohabit.

It stands to reason that increased space will reduce conflict and 2-3 females is surely ideal for ensuring a lone female isn’t harassed by the attentions of the male. I’m not sure if you ever saw The Zoo: This is your Life, but it did an episode on Indra’s life (covering her arrival, the births of her offspring, her escape and how she was affected by Dara’s death). There was a scene where Charlie was let back in with the group following his two week rotation with Horst and he made a beeline straight for Indra, ignoring the others. It was quite overwhelming for her (especially without Dara to share the attention) and the import of the Sydney females was surely beneficial.

@Zoofan15 - yes, I agree with you about the space and the personalities involved. Daya's arrival will be good not only for Charlie and the breeding programme, but for Melur who was frequently getting annoyed by Charlie's attentions. Daya's addition to the group will also benefit Bahmi, as I hope that he and Daya will be playmates and find a lot of enrichment in that way. Future siamang introductions may also be interesting, should the zoo decided to reinstate them. The new habitat has worked wonders for Charlie and Melur - it's a wonderful place for Bahmi to grow up in, and Daya seemed to be enjoying herself exploring everything when I saw her on Sunday.

I never saw the This Is Your Life episode, but it does sound fascinating. Things have changed so much for the orangutans from then till now.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - yes, I agree with you about the space and the personalities involved. Daya's arrival will be good not only for Charlie and the breeding programme, but for Melur who was frequently getting annoyed by Charlie's attentions. Daya's addition to the group will also benefit Bahmi, as I hope that he and Daya will be playmates and find a lot of enrichment in that way. Future siamang introductions may also be interesting, should the zoo decided to reinstate them. The new habitat has worked wonders for Charlie and Melur - it's a wonderful place for Bahmi to grow up in, and Daya seemed to be enjoying herself exploring everything when I saw her on Sunday.

I never saw the This Is Your Life episode, but it does sound fascinating. Things have changed so much for the orangutans from then till now.

Regionally, there’s been massive changes to the way orangutans are housed. Most zoos housed orangutans communally; whereas now every zoo holds a pair or trio of adults, bar Perth Zoo, who accomodate a colony across multiple exhibits. They were the first in the region to acknowledge orangutans are a solitary species.

It’d be great if integration with the Siamang can be achieved as it’d allow all the apes increased access to the exhibits. Mixing them with Melur/Bahmi as he was beginning to venture off probably wasn’t the ideal time. Melur would surely be more relaxed in a couple of years, though by then I’d hope Daya will have her first infant.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

Regionally, there’s been massive changes to the way orangutans are housed. Most zoos housed orangutans communally; whereas now every zoo holds a pair or trio of adults, bar Perth Zoo, who accomodate a colony across multiple exhibits. They were the first in the region to acknowledge orangutans are a solitary species.

It’d be great if integration with the Siamang can be achieved as it’d allow all the apes increased access to the exhibits. Mixing them with Melur/Bahmi as he was beginning to venture off probably wasn’t the ideal time. Melur would surely be more relaxed in a couple of years, though by then I’d hope Daya will have her first infant.

@Zoofan15 - It would certainly be enriching for both orangutans and siamang to have access to both habitats. I'm wondering if the conflicts between Melur and male siamang Intan, as well as the arrival of Daya, were reasons for introductions being put on hold. There seemed to be no issues with the orangutans and female siamang Kera, who kept her distance from the orangutans, but Intan was constantly teasing Charlie and Melur, though he made no attempts at contact with Bahmi (probably because Bahmi was still clinging to Melur at the time). A couple of times I witnessed Melur chase Intan, throw objects at him and she almost managed to swat him when he swung too close to little Bahmi's head.

Speaking of teasing, young Bahmi's favourite pastime these days appears to be winding up his father, Charlie, as big brother Madju used to do. Two weeks ago, I saw Bahmi pull Charlie's hair and, while seated in the higher nesting basket, smack Charlie on the top of the head (Charlie and Melur were eating palm stalks in the lower basket). Charlie mostly ignores Bahmi's silliness, but that time he thumped the bottom of the basket to get Bahmi to stop. Melur didn't swoop in to rescue Bahmi as she usually does, so I guess she knew Bahmi wasn't in any danger.

I had hoped Bahmi would befriend Intan and Kera, as other young orangutans have befriended gibbons in other zoos, but perhaps Daya will be the playmate he needs!

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - It would certainly be enriching for both orangutans and siamang to have access to both habitats. I'm wondering if the conflicts between Melur and male siamang Intan, as well as the arrival of Daya, were reasons for introductions being put on hold. There seemed to be no issues with the orangutans and female siamang Kera, who kept her distance from the orangutans, but Intan was constantly teasing Charlie and Melur, though he made no attempts at contact with Bahmi (probably because Bahmi was still clinging to Melur at the time). A couple of times I witnessed Melur chase Intan, throw objects at him and she almost managed to swat him when he swung too close to little Bahmi's head.

Speaking of teasing, young Bahmi's favourite pastime these days appears to be winding up his father, Charlie, as big brother Madju used to do. Two weeks ago, I saw Bahmi pull Charlie's hair and, while seated in the higher nesting basket, smack Charlie on the top of the head (Charlie and Melur were eating palm stalks in the lower basket). Charlie mostly ignores Bahmi's silliness, but that time he thumped the bottom of the basket to get Bahmi to stop. Melur didn't swoop in to rescue Bahmi as she usually does, so I guess she knew Bahmi wasn't in any danger.

I had hoped Bahmi would befriend Intan and Kera, as other young orangutans have befriended gibbons in other zoos, but perhaps Daya will be the playmate he needs!

I think Daya and Bahmi could potentially form a play based relationship. Daya may well miss those interactions with her natal colony and Bahmi clearly has a desire to initiate play, which isn’t reciprocated by the adults. With Bahmi becoming independent, Daya can form the relationship directly with Bahmi versus him clinging to Melur, who would regulate access.

Though play based relationships clearly traverse large age gaps (Wanita and Madju being an example), there’s no doubt infants within two to three years of each other gain maximum benefit and so I hope for that reason an infant from Daya is here by 2024/2025.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

I think Daya and Bahmi could potentially form a play based relationship. Daya may well miss those interactions with her natal colony and Bahmi clearly has a desire to initiate play, which isn’t reciprocated by the adults. With Bahmi becoming independent, Daya can form the relationship directly with Bahmi versus him clinging to Melur, who would regulate access.

Though play based relationships clearly traverse large age gaps (Wanita and Madju being an example), there’s no doubt infants within two to three years of each other gain maximum benefit and so I hope for that reason an infant from Daya is here by 2024/2025.

@Zoofan15 - Yes, absolutely! Speaking personally, I'd like to see Bahmi and Daya develop a play-based relationship. I've seen Melur and Bahmi occasionally play together, but this seems to be lessening in frequency as Bahmi gets more independent. Charlie seems disinterested in interacting much with Bahmi, although I heard from zoo staff that he used to play with Madju on occasion.

I too would like to see Daya have an infant within the next couple of years, as there would be many benefits for the species as a whole, and also to the current group.

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - Yes, absolutely! Speaking personally, I'd like to see Bahmi and Daya develop a play-based relationship. I've seen Melur and Bahmi occasionally play together, but this seems to be lessening in frequency as Bahmi gets more independent. Charlie seems disinterested in interacting much with Bahmi, although I heard from zoo staff that he used to play with Madju on occasion.

I too would like to see Daya have an infant within the next couple of years, as there would be many benefits for the species as a whole, and also to the current group.

I would have loved to have seen the interactions between Intan (1989), Datuk (1989) and Isim (1994). They were all together for two years between the birth of Isim and the export of Datuk to Taronga Zoo in 1996.

It would have been similarly interesting for Taronga visitors to have seen Melur (1988), Gangsa (1989) and Datuk (1989) together for two years until Datuk’s death in 1998. I often wonder how different the regional population would have looked had this trio bred at Taronga.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

I would have loved to have seen the interactions between Intan (1989), Datuk (1989) and Isim (1994). They were all together for two years between the birth of Isim and the export of Datuk to Taronga Zoo in 1996.

It would have been similarly interesting for Taronga visitors to have seen Melur (1988), Gangsa (1989) and Datuk (1989) together for two years until Datuk’s death in 1998. I often wonder how different the regional population would have looked had this trio bred at Taronga.

@Zoofan15 - absolutely, yes! I would love to have seen those interactions as my memory of the old orangutan population is a bit fuzzy except for remembering play interactions between Madju and Wanita. I also wonder how Auckland Zoo's orangutan population would look today if Dara and Darli had survived, or if Horst, Indra, Isim, Gangsa and Madju had not been exported to the USA.

Were Taronga staff aware that Datuk's parents were paternal half-siblings at the time he was put into the breeding programme?

 

[Zoofan15]

@Zoofan15 - absolutely, yes! I would love to have seen those interactions as my memory of the old orangutan population is a bit fuzzy except for remembering play interactions between Madju and Wanita. I also wonder how Auckland Zoo's orangutan population would look today if Dara and Darli had survived, or if Horst, Indra, Isim, Gangsa and Madju had not been exported to the USA.

Were Taronga staff aware that Datuk's parents were paternal half-siblings at the time he was put into the breeding programme?

I often wonder that myself! The colony of nine Auckland Zoo had in 2005 would have made far greater use of the zoo’s current complex than the 1.2 adult trio did upon opening, but at least the colony is growing now.

I recall on The Zoo them saying that Charlie was the father of Dara’s upcoming infant as he and Dara were the pair the zoo was trying to breed with. I thought that was strange as a child as Charlie was predicted to be the father of Intan and Isim (later revealed to be Horst); but then later I found studbooks etc. and learnt about Dara and Horst being half siblings. I was puzzled why the zoo imported half siblings (as well as two males), but then saw the original plans of the division of the complex into two and it made more sense. Inbreeding was also taken less seriously in the 80’s then it is today.

I would certainly say Taronga was aware of Datuk being the product of half-siblings and considering Melur and Gangsa were unrelated to him, I see no harm in outbreeding him to them.

Given Charlie’s genetic value, they may have bred him and Dara again around the late 2000’s. Dara was only 23 when she died.

 

[ApeLadyNZ]

I often wonder that myself! The colony of nine Auckland Zoo had in 2005 would have made far greater use of the zoo’s current complex than the 1.2 adult trio did upon opening, but at least the colony is growing now.

I recall on The Zoo them saying that Charlie was the father of Dara’s upcoming infant as he and Dara were the pair the zoo was trying to breed with. I thought that was strange as a child as Charlie was predicted to be the father of Intan and Isim (later revealed to be Horst); but then later I found studbooks etc. and learnt about Dara and Horst being half siblings. I was puzzled why the zoo imported half siblings (as well as two males), but then saw the original plans of the division of the complex into two and it made more sense. Inbreeding was also taken less seriously in the 80’s then it is today.

I would certainly say Taronga was aware of Datuk being the product of half-siblings and considering Melur and Gangsa were unrelated to him, I see no harm in outbreeding him to them.

Given Charlie’s genetic value, they may have bred him and Dara again around the late 2000’s. Dara was only 23 when she died.

Looking at the original plans for housing, it does make more sense as to why Auckland Zoo imported orangutans as they did. Initially, since Horst and Charlie were juveniles when they arrived, the zoo may have assumed that they would coexist successfully until the planned enclosure was built.

I too think that the larger orangutan group would have thrived in the current orangutan/siamang habitat and made good use of the towers and aerial pathways. Although I do believe that the current group will make increased use of the aerial pathways as Bahmi matures and Daya is allowed to explore them.