Australasian Sumatran Tiger Population

Currently they don't plan to continue with tigers after the current two pass, the whole TOTE area will eventually be redeveloped.

It must be getting close to an announcement of what the plans for the area will be as the elephants will move this year!
I've heard this before about Melbourne not receiving new tigers following the deaths of their current pair, and I have no reason to disbelieve it, although to me that would be a very odd decision, considering that Sumatran tigers are an endangered species with an established breeding program in the region.

That said, I can see the reasoning for redeveloping TOTE following the departure of the elephants, considering their main attraction will have departed and there will be the opportunity to use that space for something completely different, rather than just slotting another species (ie rhino or tapir) into those existing exhibits.

Hutan makes a very poor display animal. Whether he lacks confidence or whether it’s the design of the exhibit that makes the off display dens preferable to being on exhibit, I don’t know; but there’s potentially an argument there for demolishing the facility in TOTE given it’s age and the progression of exhibit standards over the past three decades.

I was lucky to see Indrah a number of times in the Carnivores exhibit. Others haven’t had the same experience and again, that could be her personality. It’s a decent exhibit and would be better utilised by a larger social grouping of tigers (siblings at dispersal age for example).

I would be surprised to see Melbourne phase out tigers indefinitely. It’s worth noting that plans change on a regular basis as management comes and goes and assuming the tigers reach their late teens, we’re talking of something that will happen five years from now (i.e a long time away). The outcome could be anything from a total phase out; to reducing the zoo’s holdings to one exhibit in the Carnviores precinct; to redeveloping the TOTE complex in five years time to recommence breeding.
 
Knowing Melbourne if they do intend to continue exhibiting and breeding tigers, we can almost guarantee at least one tiger will be brought over from overseas (Although, like you I do believe an entirely new pair would be best).

Taking into account the ages of Melbourne's current sibling pair, they could still have half a decade ahead of them, so we probably won't see this come to fruition until the end of this decade at earliest.

At best, I'd hope Melbourne takes this time (following the departure of the elephants) to renovate the TOTE exhibit if required.

If they import an Ramah and zayana offspring and then another mate for it from outside the region. That wouldn't be a bad match.
 
I've heard this before about Melbourne not receiving new tigers following the deaths of their current pair, and I have no reason to disbelieve it, although to me that would be a very odd decision, considering that Sumatran tigers are an endangered species with an established breeding program in the region.

That said, I can see the reasoning for redeveloping TOTE following the departure of the elephants, considering their main attraction will have departed and there will be the opportunity to use that space for something completely different, rather than just slotting another species (ie rhino or tapir) into those existing exhibits.

I have also heard that, which is why im skeptical if its a permanent phase out. Or a phase out while they renovate exhibits. Which they dont deal well with, and unlike taronga can't just send there tigers of to the sister zoo to hold them while they do it.
 
Hutan makes a very poor display animal. Whether he lacks confidence or whether it’s the design of the exhibit that makes the off display dens preferable to being on exhibit, I don’t know; but there’s potentially an argument there for demolishing the facility in TOTE given it’s age and the progression of exhibit standards over the past three decades.

I was lucky to see Indrah a number of times in the Carnivores exhibit. Others haven’t had the same experience and again, that could be her personality. It’s a decent exhibit and would be better utilised by a larger social grouping of tigers (siblings at dispersal age for example).

I would be surprised to see Melbourne phase out tigers indefinitely. It’s worth noting that plans change on a regular basis as management comes and goes and assuming the tigers reach their late teens, we’re talking of something that will happen five years from now (i.e a long time away). The outcome could be anything from a total phase out; to reducing the zoo’s holdings to one exhibit in the Carnviores precinct; to redeveloping the TOTE complex in five years time to recommence breeding.

While you have said the exhibits are perfectly fit for use. I have heard before that there tigers are difficult to see when on exhibit. So im wondering whether a redevelopment like the one at taronga would be more beneficial. The exhibits are very well done in that they look nice but also allow easy viewing of the tigers when on display. And whther they dont plan to require tigers strait away enables them to be able to move things around and redevelop/develope tiger exhibits that better suit a more modern look with easier viewing.
It would be a strange decision to phase out tigers, after the loss of elephants. They are a high profile animal that people expect/go to zoos to visit. Tigers are on par with lions in that regard.
 
If they import an Ramah and zayana offspring and then another mate for it from outside the region. That wouldn't be a bad match.

It certainly wouldn’t be a bad match; but I think we should still be aiming to see the import of a pair into the region (either at Melbourne or elsewhere).

Between 2000-2008, a total of 13 Sumatran tigers were imported into the region. In the 16 years that’s followed, we’ve imported just two (Ramah and Zayana).

The first offspring of Ramah and Zayana may well be paired with Reggie (the obvious move at this point in time). If at least one offspring from their second litter could be paired with an imported mate; and then an additional pair imported, that’d be greatly beneficial to the breeding programme.
 
While you have said the exhibits are perfectly fit for use. I have heard before that there tigers are difficult to see when on exhibit. So im wondering whether a redevelopment like the one at taronga would be more beneficial. The exhibits are very well done in that they look nice but also allow easy viewing of the tigers when on display. And whther they dont plan to require tigers strait away enables them to be able to move things around and redevelop/develope tiger exhibits that better suit a more modern look with easier viewing.
It would be a strange decision to phase out tigers, after the loss of elephants. They are a high profile animal that people expect/go to zoos to visit. Tigers are on par with lions in that regard.

The tigers are very enabling and being a the face of a conservation campaign (palm oil) and a critically endangered species aligns them with a total of three of Zoo’s Victoria’s collection criteria. You can’t ask for more than that for an exotic species.

All things considered, I agree it’s probably time for a redevelopment of the tiger complex in TOTE. It’s aged well, but is comparatively dated compared to Auckland and Taronga’s complexes and a modern facility purpose built to manage breeding would be an asset to Melbourne.

I’m still in favour of maintaining the tiger exhibit in the Carnivores precinct. Next to the Snow leopards, it was the most popular attraction and a decent sized exhibit. If we’re hoping Melbourne will aspire to importing a breeding pair (or one half of a breeding pair), we can expect any offspring bred to transfer promptly, using this exhibit to refine social skills with their littermates for a year or two prior.
 
It certainly wouldn’t be a bad match; but I think we should still be aiming to see the import of a pair into the region (either at Melbourne or elsewhere).

Between 2000-2008, a total of 13 Sumatran tigers were imported into the region. In the 16 years that’s followed, we’ve imported just two (Ramah and Zayana).

The first offspring of Ramah and Zayana may well be paired with Reggie (the obvious move at this point in time). If at least one offspring from their second litter could be paired with an imported mate; and then an additional pair imported, that’d be greatly beneficial to the breeding programme.

Id also say even one of the ramah and zayana young paired with one of the direct offspring of sumatran imports. Would also be beneficial, that gene flow would be hugely beneficial. (im not sure if reggie is on or not of memory)

If you have ramah/zayana, one of there offspring to a sumatran descendant and new pair. Then the new pairs offspring mixed with the established generic Nico/meta descendants. That would broaden out gene pool and set up enough genetic diversity for more then a few generations.
 
Id also say even one of the ramah and zayana young paired with one of the direct offspring of sumatran imports. Would also be beneficial, that gene flow would be hugely beneficial. (im not sure if reggie is on or not of memory)

If you have ramah/zayana, one of there offspring to a sumatran descendant and new pair. Then the new pairs offspring mixed with the established generic Nico/meta descendants. That would broaden out gene pool and set up enough genetic diversity for more then a few generations.

Reggie is the son of Satu (imported from Germany) and Maneki (imported from Indonesia). He’s one of the most genetically valuable males in the region and notable as the only offspring of the Indonesian imports that wasn’t sired by a male from the Nico-Meta line. It’s for that reason, Reggie should enter the breeding population sooner rather than later and I’m hopeful the plan is to pair him with Ramah and Zayana’s daughter, Cahya.

Correct, that would be four pairings not descended from Nico and Meta’s sons (I will note Auckland’s pair descend from their daughter, Kali):

Ramah and Zayana
Reggie and Cahya
Second offspring of Ramah and Zayana + import
Imported male and female
 
Hutan makes a very poor display animal. Whether he lacks confidence or whether it’s the design of the exhibit that makes the off display dens preferable to being on exhibit, I don’t know; but there’s potentially an argument there for demolishing the facility in TOTE given it’s age and the progression of exhibit standards over the past three decades.

I was lucky to see Indrah a number of times in the Carnivores exhibit. Others haven’t had the same experience and again, that could be her personality. It’s a decent exhibit and would be better utilised by a larger social grouping of tigers (siblings at dispersal age for example).

I would be surprised to see Melbourne phase out tigers indefinitely. It’s worth noting that plans change on a regular basis as management comes and goes and assuming the tigers reach their late teens, we’re talking of something that will happen five years from now (i.e a long time away). The outcome could be anything from a total phase out; to reducing the zoo’s holdings to one exhibit in the Carnviores precinct; to redeveloping the TOTE complex in five years time to recommence breeding.
I diagree. I have seen Hutan out and in his enclosure far more than I have seen Indrah in hers. I think people that don't see Hutan are there on the day of his feeding, and the subsequent 3 or so that he stays with his carcass while he eats it.
His being off display comes more down to the new feeding regime than him or his enclosure.

I'd also hate to see the enclosure destroyed - it's one of the nicer ones in the zoo. Far from replacing his enclosure, I'd like to see it retained, and a second tiger enclosure built on the other side of the BoH. The BoH is set up for breeding with multiple BoH enclosures.
 
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I diagree. I have seen Hutan out and in his enclosure far more than I have seen Indrah in hers. I think people that don't see Hutan are there on the day of his feeding, and the subsequent 3 or so that he stays with his carcass while he eats it.
His being off display comes more down to the new feeding regime than him or his enclosure.

I'd also hate to see the enclosure destroyed - it's one of the nicer ones in the zoo. Far from replacing his enclosure, I'd like to see it retained, and a second tiger enclosure built on the other side of the BoH. The BoH is set up for breeding with multiple BoH enclosures.

I visited four times last year and saw Hutan on exhibit once (and even then as he was disappearing back inside); and Indrah three times (each time with really good views). From what you and others have said, it sounds like I was lucky to see Indrah though. One of those visits, there was heavy rain, which seemed to hype her up; and on the others it was so hot, she was wading in the pool to cool down. The visit I didn’t see her was normal weather - the type of day most people would choose to go to the zoo. :p

A feeding schedule that sees Hutan off exhibit for 3-4 days a week doesn’t make for an engaging exhibit. I’ve seen Sumatran tigers at every single facility I’ve visited that holds them and most (if not all) practice either a daily or intermittent feed schedule (feeding 3-4 times a week). If Melbourne have found this to be the most effective feeding schedule, then perhaps rotating Hutan with a second tiger would be preferable. That way when he’s off display, he’s off display.

How many BOH exhibits are there?
 
I visited four times last year and saw Hutan on exhibit once (and even then as he was disappearing back inside); and Indrah three times (each time with really good views). From what you and others have said, it sounds like I was lucky to see Indrah though. One of those visits, there was heavy rain, which seemed to hype her up; and on the others it was so hot, she was wading in the pool to cool down. The visit I didn’t see her was normal weather - the type of day most people would choose to go to the zoo. :p

A feeding schedule that sees Hutan off exhibit for 3-4 days a week doesn’t make for an engaging exhibit. I’ve seen Sumatran tigers at every single facility I’ve visited that holds them and most (if not all) practice either a daily or intermittent feed schedule (feeding 3-4 times a week). If Melbourne have found this to be the most effective feeding schedule, then perhaps rotating Hutan with a second tiger would be preferable. That way when he’s off display, he’s off display.

How many BOH exhibits are there?

I’m very much the same Zoofan - I visited three times last year and once this year, and I’ve never seen Hutan but did see Indrah all but one. Glad I was able to at least spot her!
 
I’m very much the same Zoofan - I visited three times last year and once this year, and I’ve never seen Hutan but did see Indrah all but one. Glad I was able to at least spot her!

What I really like about Melbourne’s exhibits (both of them) is that they provide their tigers with large (naturalistic) bodies of water to cool down in. It creates a very immersive experience, which was Melbourne’s intention going into the 1990’s, when the TOTE exhibit opened; and has been achieved equally well in the Carnivores precinct imo.

I always enjoy seeing animals engage in wild behaviour and seeing tigers wading in the water to cool down like they would in the wild is truly magical.

Photos from my visits:

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I visited four times last year and saw Hutan on exhibit once (and even then as he was disappearing back inside); and Indrah three times (each time with really good views). From what you and others have said, it sounds like I was lucky to see Indrah though. One of those visits, there was heavy rain, which seemed to hype her up; and on the others it was so hot, she was wading in the pool to cool down. The visit I didn’t see her was normal weather - the type of day most people would choose to go to the zoo. :p

A feeding schedule that sees Hutan off exhibit for 3-4 days a week doesn’t make for an engaging exhibit. I’ve seen Sumatran tigers at every single facility I’ve visited that holds them and most (if not all) practice either a daily or intermittent feed schedule (feeding 3-4 times a week). If Melbourne have found this to be the most effective feeding schedule, then perhaps rotating Hutan with a second tiger would be preferable. That way when he’s off display, he’s off display.

How many BOH exhibits are there?

I’m very much the same Zoofan - I visited three times last year and once this year, and I’ve never seen Hutan but did see Indrah all but one. Glad I was able to at least spot her!
I've been visiting Melbourne for more than a decade now and can say for sure that it was always very rare to spot Hutan. From experience and what I've been told, the best time to spot him is late afternoon as he is a huge sleepyhead and spends majority of his morning in his dens. So within the past few years I've taken this advice into account and have actually seen him a lot more. Pretty much every visit since.

A keeper once mentioned the depth of the enclosure to be a problem, as the tigers can go quite far back and out of view. Binjai used to do this a lot. Hutan doesn't seem to utilise most of the exhibit and when he's out, he paces near the pond making for easy viewing. The exhibit is obviously far better suited to multiple tigers.

In the case of Indrah, she spends majority of her time in the bamboo forest that covers half of her enclosure. If she's in there it's virtually impossible to spot her. But unlike Hutan, she's definitely more active in the mornings.

I do think the time of your visit can be a huge factor - if you visit in the morning, you'd have a strong chance to see Indrah; if you visit in the afternoon, Hutan.
 
I do think the time of your visit can be a huge factor - if you visit in the morning, you'd have a strong chance to see Indrah; if you visit in the afternoon, Hutan.

Good point. From memory, the one time I saw Hutan was in the afternoon; and conversely, the one time I didn’t see Indrah was in the afternoon, where I’d entered through the main entrance and did other precincts first. All my subsequent visits were via the rail gate entrance and I would head to the Carnivores precinct first. I saw Indrah every time.
For the Tigers specifically there are around four or so. They built an extension of cages around 2015 (where the Snow Leopards were housed during Carnivores construction). At least another three or four of them from what I've seen. I believe the Coatis are in one of the enclosures there too now.

That’s impressive. I can confirm the coatis are indeed in one of those exhibits. One of the volunteers told me you can get a glimpse of their exhibit from the treetop boardwalk.

Tonyi and Tombo were housed BOH for around a year, following their import from Auckland Zoo in 2003. Their departure would have tied in with Binjai’s import in 2004.
 
What I really like about Melbourne’s exhibits (both of them) is that they provide their tigers with large (naturalistic) bodies of water to cool down in. It creates a very immersive experience, which was Melbourne’s intention going into the 1990’s, when the TOTE exhibit opened; and has been achieved equally well in the Carnivores precinct imo.

I always enjoy seeing animals engage in wild behaviour and seeing tigers wading in the water to cool down like they would in the wild is truly magical.

Photos from my visits:

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Good shots!

Adelaide Zoo posted on their socials recently a video of their one-year-old tiger cubs playing in the water, which was great to see.
 
Good shots!

Adelaide Zoo posted on their socials recently a video of their one-year-old tiger cubs playing in the water, which was great to see.

Hamilton Zoo’s viewing hut also offers panoramic views of their large tiger pool, which was considered a modern feature when the exhibit opened in 2001. It was a great idea, but I rarely see the tigers in the water (even on hot days) and the pool looks artificial compared to the more naturalistic design of Melbourne’s exhibits.

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I've been visiting Melbourne for more than a decade now and can say for sure that it was always very rare to spot Hutan. From experience and what I've been told, the best time to spot him is late afternoon as he is a huge sleepyhead and spends majority of his morning in his dens. So within the past few years I've taken this advice into account and have actually seen him a lot more. Pretty much every visit since.

A keeper once mentioned the depth of the enclosure to be a problem, as the tigers can go quite far back and out of view. Binjai used to do this a lot. Hutan doesn't seem to utilise most of the exhibit and when he's out, he paces near the pond making for easy viewing. The exhibit is obviously far better suited to multiple tigers.

In the case of Indrah, she spends majority of her time in the bamboo forest that covers half of her enclosure. If she's in there it's virtually impossible to spot her. But unlike Hutan, she's definitely more active in the mornings.

I do think the time of your visit can be a huge factor - if you visit in the morning, you'd have a strong chance to see Indrah; if you visit in the afternoon, Hutan.
I guess that might explain my high success rate at seeing Hutan - majority of my visits have been afternoons in recent years.
 
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I guess that might explain my high success rate at seeing Hutan - majority of my visits have been afternoons in recent years.
Yeah, I'd say so. I reckon I've visited Melbourne almost 100 times now so I've started to pick up on a few things like when each individual animal tends to be active more.

It's interesting to see the difference between the two siblings. Mum Binjai was much like Indrah and more of a morning girl, so this worked for Melbourne as most days they were able to rotate her on display in the mornings and then give Hutan access outdoors in the afternoon.
 
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