Zoo Wuppertal Bili the Bonobo

Pertinax said:
Not having outdoor access for Apes on a daily basis is an archaic system nowadays. They do benefit from the sunlight, extra space and stimulation, particularly during the summer months.
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Do they not have a rotation each day then, or are they locked in for 1 in 4, or every other day or something?
 
littleRedPanda said:
Do they not have a rotation each day then, or are they locked in for 1 in 4, or every other day or something?
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As far as I know the orange and gorillas always have outdoor access, but the bonobos share their outdoor enclosure with the zoo's two remaining common chimps. I've no idea what the rotation system is, but it couldn't really be less than one day out of every two.
 
Could someone confirm the outdoor facilities and access for the 4 ape species please. I can't find many photos and remember reading that there was nothing when it was first built/adapted?
I know @migdog visited recently, but your video doesn't show much of the apes. Thanks all :)
 
littleRedPanda said:
Could someone confirm the outdoor facilities and access for the 4 ape species please. I can't find many photos and remember reading that there was nothing when it was first built/adapted?
I know @migdog visited recently, but your video doesn't show much of the apes. Thanks all :)
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There are three outdoor enclosures, one for gorillas, one for orangs and one which is shared between the chimps and the bonobos.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
There are three outdoor enclosures, one for gorillas, one for orangs and one which is shared between the chimps and the bonobos.
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Thank you, I wanted to be certain as WAMS have stated that the one outdoor enclosure is shared between all 4 apes and a lady (with work experience with gibbons) we have been speaking with is outraged. WAMS will supposedly upload a photo later to show their followers the unacceptable conditions :rolleyes: Unsurprisingly, the video she posted to their timeline, received no acknowledgement from WAMS. The only comment came from a lady expressing that it calm while it is hidden from the public. My friend asked if she has witnessed that it is still closed off, to which she replied "no".
 
littleRedPanda said:
Thank you, I wanted to be certain as WAMS have stated that the one outdoor enclosure is shared between all 4 apes and a lady (with work experience with gibbons) we have been speaking with is outraged. WAMS will supposedly upload a photo later to show their followers the unacceptable conditions :rolleyes: Unsurprisingly, the video she posted to their timeline, received no acknowledgement from WAMS. The only comment came from a lady expressing that it calm while it is hidden from the public. My friend asked if she has witnessed that it is still closed off, to which she replied "no".
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To be honest Wuppertal's Ape House is not that photogenic, I wouldn't be surprised if WAMS manage to produce some fairly unflattering pictures, if that is indeed their intention. I think they've made a decent fist of adapting what was clearly an old and inadequate house, but it still feels really adequate rather than 'good'. It's very much like Berlin's rather Cologne or Frankfurt.

I'm also not sure why they haven't moved the chimps on; I know someone told me they want to move out of them and that would obviously free up more space for the remaining species.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
To be honest Wuppertal's Ape House is not that photogenic, I wouldn't be surprised if WAMS manage to produce some fairly unflattering pictures, if that is indeed their intention. I think they've made a decent fist of adapting what was clearly an old and inadequate house, but it still feels really adequate rather than 'good'. It's very much like Berlin's rather Cologne or Frankfurt.

I'm also not sure why they haven't moved the chimps on; I know someone told me they want to move out of them and that would obviously free up more space for the remaining species.
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One of the chimps is very old and I think they are waiting for this individual to die before they send the remaining animal to another zoo.

It is also quite crazy to see how easily it is to lie for such a sanctuary and how easy they seem to get away with it. Or they must be really incompetent and not know anything, but I don't believe that...
 
FunkyGibbon said:
There are three outdoor enclosures, one for gorillas, one for orangs and one which is shared between the chimps and the bonobos.
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I thought it was very unusual for 4 species of Apes to share a single outdoor area...one or two zoos in Europe still(?) lack any outdoor areas at all for their Apes, but that's a little different and I've never heard of 4 species sharing one outdoors like that. It seems WAMS got their facts wrong on this also...this isn't any different from say, the two Twycross Bonobo groups sharing an outdoors.
 
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lintworm said:
It is also quite crazy to see how easily it is to lie for such a sanctuary and how easy they seem to get away with it. Or they must be really incompetent and not know anything, but I don't believe that...
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FunkyGibbon said:
To be honest Wuppertal's Ape House is not that photogenic, I wouldn't be surprised if WAMS manage to produce some fairly unflattering pictures, if that is indeed their intention.
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It looks to me that they have removed the request from the lady we were in touch with, who was promised the photographic proof would be posted lol! However, they have left another post saying "Graham saw and photographed for himself. None of those apes has constant access to fresh air."

I've been out all day and now see they have posted the video I linked above themselves with a positive note. I think maybe they have accepted it is for the best to butt out of Bili's integration, for now. Lets hope it continues
 
Again, sorry for dragging this up again, but having found a report from the Great Ape Project post on WAMS facebook, I wanted to ask for an accurate translation of the line "wolle ihn eher euthanasieren (=töten), als ihn in das Waliser Primaten-refugium abzugeben"

When translating the page in chrome, it says "would rather euthanise him (= kill him) than hand him over to the Welsh primate retreat."

But translating the passage on google it says "I would rather euthanise him than kill him in the Welsh primate refugium"
The report is here
Great Ape Project - Bili

Also, I noticed in another post that WAMS are saying the only true thing that Wuppertal has said, is that they do not hold Bonobos :rolleyes:
 
littleRedPanda said:
When translating the page in chrome, it says "would rather euthanise him (= kill him) than hand him over to the Welsh primate retreat."

But translating the passage on google it says "I would rather euthanise him than kill him in the Welsh primate refugium"
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When I translate abzugeben in Google it says "leave".
 
jwer said:
Abgeben = to hand over, so the above is correct.
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If it was meant as coldly as that, then I'd understand the passionate response against the zoo. Could it have meant "prefer to euthanize him rather than hand him over to die there" perhaps?
 
I haven’t seen the whole text, but just that one sentence alone is as cold as you state. Rather euthanise than hand over, without much ambiguity.
 
littleRedPanda said:
It looks to me that they have removed the request from the lady we were in touch with, who was promised the photographic proof would be posted lol! However, they have left another post saying "Graham saw and photographed for himself. None of those apes has constant access to fresh air."

I've been out all day and now see they have posted the video I linked above themselves with a positive note. I think maybe they have accepted it is for the best to butt out of Bili's integration, for now. Lets hope it continues
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Unless WAMS literally never close the hatch between the indoor and outdoor areas then like every zoo that holds apes presumably they also don't provide constant access to fresh air.
 
FunkyGibbon said:
Unless WAMS literally never close the hatch between the indoor and outdoor areas then like every zoo that holds apes presumably they also don't provide constant access to fresh air.
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They really are 'guilty' of all the things that they accuse zoos and the establishments that plot against them of being. I hope Bili's missing ear and digit (is it a toe or a finger, they don't seem to know) grow back soon and he is accepted by the group.
 
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