Botswana threatens to send elephants to Germany

This sentence is more interesting, in a conservation perspective without cynicism nor irony :

"Botswana has even given about 8,000 elephants to Angola and Mozambique - an effort to boost international tourism in those nations while also helping to control numbers in Botswana."

I assume the two latter countries have experienced huge population declines in the last 50 years, due to political unrest.
 
TheFrogLady said:
Botswana threatens to send 20,000 elephants to "roam free" in Germany in public dispute over trophy hunting - CBS News

According to this article, Botswana is threatening to send 20,000 of its elephants to “roam free” in Germany in response to restrictions on importing hunting trophies to Germany from Africa.
Click to expand...
This is the net result of uninformed Wholesale Policy decisions under CITES trade that do not reflect the localised situation on the ground across the entire range of African elephants.

FYI: Botswana has actually experienced progressively expanding elephant populations over decades past.
 
Kifaru Bwana said:
This is the net result of uninformed Wholesale Policy decisions under CITES trade that do not reflect the localised situation on the ground across the entire range of African elephants.

FYI: Botswana has actually experienced progressively expanding elephant populations over decades past.
Click to expand...

What do you mean by that, if you don’t mind me asking?
 
birdsandbats said:
Although we classify Bush Elephants as a threatened species on a global level, that doesn't mean the species is actually threatened in every part of its range. Sustainable take of this species is possible in certain areas and in fact in some areas the species is overpopulated.
Click to expand...
Indeed - Kenya, for example, has actually seen its elephant population double over the past three decades (although that didn't stop a certain Damian Aspinall from trying to send Howletts' African Elephants there!), while in Zambia there has been a substantial decrease throughout that same time frame.
 
birdsandbats said:
Well Hannibal got them to survive in the Alps. Maybe they're more adaptable then we give them credit for.
Click to expand...
Well, barely survived. He started out with 37 elephants and possibly half of them (along with a whole lot of horses and men) died on the crossing through cold, accidents, etc. It isn't known exactly how many survived the crossing of the Alps (the number 20 is given in quite a few sources), however all but one died from cold shortly after the following battle in Trebia when a winter storm swept through the area.
 
TheFrogLady said:
I see. Considering the fact that the article included a quote from animal rights activists, I wonder if they have an influence in such policies.
Click to expand...
They are the worst advisors for sound in situ conservation policies or even ex situ conservation breeding (there is no chance now to import/export under the premise of captive-breeding of elephants from the wild (where the populations are in their 100,000's rather than the odd few 10,000's when we think of hippos (taking another pachyderm for starters that ye old AW-activist don't give a damn thing about)! Picture: PR/communication screw up.
 
birdsandbats said:
Although we classify Bush Elephants as a threatened species on a global level, that doesn't mean the species is actually threatened in every part of its range. Sustainable take of this species is possible in certain areas and in fact in some areas the species is overpopulated.
Click to expand...
Exactly.

The Germany proposal ... is something hilariously iconic proof of in the pudding epitomising what the Botswana authorities meant and how paternalistic/almost neo-colonial our collective CITES wildlife law mechanisms and approaches have evolved into and unfortunately sometimes pandering both to rather emotive sometimes irrational AW-activism (elephants and other fluffy animal species) and protectie of own North economic interests North versus South (remember endangered species in the NE and central Atlantic like cod, herring, tarbot et cetera remain uncovered and regulations for salmonids nor sturgeons are fully effective), over well informed conservation ethics and policy-making).
 
Kifaru Bwana said:
They are the worst advisors for sound in situ conservation policies or even ex situ conservation breeding (there is no chance now to import/export under the premise of captive-breeding of elephants from the wild (where the populations are in their 100,000's rather than the odd few 10,000's when we think of hippos (taking another pachyderm for starters that ye old AW-activist don't give a damn thing about)! Picture: PR/communication screw up.
Click to expand...

Forgive me for sounding naive, but if AR activists TRULY cared about elephant conservation and wanted to stop them from getting killed, wouldn't it make more sense to work WITH their native countries to found alternative ways of funding conservation efforts and mitigating human-elephant conflicts, and maybe looking into populating countries with declining elephant populations with those from over-populated ones? That way, they might get less hostile reactions such as this as well.
 
TheFrogLady said:
Forgive me for sounding naive, but if AR activists TRULY cared about elephant conservation and wanted to stop them from getting killed, wouldn't it make more sense to work WITH their native countries to found alternative ways of funding conservation efforts and mitigating human-elephant conflicts, and maybe looking into populating countries with declining elephant populations with those from over-populated ones? That way, they might get less hostile reactions such as this as well.
Click to expand...
It sure would make more sense. But ARA have demonstrated well that they don't care about making sense or even helping animals, just enforcing their ridiculous ideals on other people.
 
birdsandbats said:
Wild elephants in Germany would be epic. I mean, elephants and rheas in the same country! It would be so cool!
Click to expand...

Then ARA's complain that elephants were "kidnapped" from their own country and left stranded in a colder climate (or would it not matter to them since they are still "free" :p)
 
I sympathize if Botswana is experiencing an elephant overpopulation problem and looking for solutions, that's a good conversation to have, but keeping in mind he followed this up by insisting he was serious and not joking, it seems like a needlessly mean-spirited comment and outright mocking towards people trying to save the species. They seem like very "why do you care about stupid animals when people are suffering" series of comments, which I feel undercuts part of the point of conservation to begin with.
 
JVM said:
I sympathize if Botswana is experiencing an elephant overpopulation problem and looking for solutions, that's a good conversation to have, but keeping in mind he followed this up by insisting he was serious and not joking, it seems like a needlessly mean-spirited comment and outright mocking towards people trying to save the species. They seem like very "why do you care about stupid animals when people are suffering" series of comments, which I feel undercuts part of the point of conservation to begin with.
Click to expand...
While admittedly, that comment was overly mean-spirited, it illustrates the issue with ill-informed policies, sometimes influenced by ARAs, turning people off to conservation, which can be a hinderance to people that are truly working to save these animals
 
Last edited:
TheFrogLady said:
While admittedly, that comment was overly mean-spirited, it illustrates the issue with ill-informed policies, sometimes influenced by ARAs, turning people off to conservation, which can be a hinderance to people that are truly working to save these animals
Click to expand...
Yes, unfortunately ... that is spot on.

Compared to rhinos or hippos and tapirs elephants are really at the lesser end of the stick, especially when this concerns the African Savannah elephant. African forest elephants are really in dire straits across major parts of their rainforest habitats and given the large range across southern and S.E. Asia Asiatic elephants are also very much a concern, in parts with the islands populations on Sumatera and Kalimantan/Sabah-Malaysia critically endangered so.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top