British Isles Cup Redux - League B - Bristol/Wildplace vs Jersey

Bristol et al vs Jersey - ISLANDS

  • Total voters
    12
  • Poll closed .
TeaLovingDave said:
I can't see any posts by yourself mentioning the non-mammalian collection at Bristol actually!

Your last post before the one I am replying to was this:



Also, pipaluk is a man last time I met him :p not that it matter in terms of the discussion at hand, but it's always interesting to get an insight into people's assumptions about what gender a given poster might be! I cannot recall who it was, but there is at least one member who was surprised to learn I am a bloke despite the name "Dave" being in my username!
Click to expand...

I posted this comment which was a pretty comprehensive look at Bristol's strongpoints in current and historic species, species kept by both institutions and included reptiles, birds, mammals and even inverts. :p


Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
It isn't a walkover but it is a decisive win for Jersey in terms of their conservation output vs Bristol's.

The only one of that species list that really counts and is sorely lacking at Jersey is the Sclaters lemur.

Some mammals and birds that are not on that list are slow loris, warty pig, Victoria crowned pigeon, Socorro dove. Another island endemic mammal species kept historically at Bristol that are interesting would include the tarsier. Agile kept at Bristol are analagous to lar gibbons at Jersey in this competition I suppose so don't really count.

Also you didn't include inverts or reptiles or amphibians or birds :p that are further strong points for Bristol. These would include: Cuban boa, yellow headed day gecko, prehensile tailed skinks, Malaysian giant turtle, Aldabra giant tortoise, partula snails and Lord Howe Island stick insect.

Jersey keep Livingstones flying fox, Malagasy giant jumping rat, Lac Alaotra lemur, aye-aye and historically kept Parma wallaby which are also all kept by Bristol. Another species historically kept at Jersey (which I forgot in my list above) and which they are / were heavily involved in conserving in-situ and ex-situ was the Majorcan midwife toad.

Even with all of that considered Jersey still ultimately wins over Bristol in my opinion because of its outsized conservation output :p.
Click to expand...

My bad, always assumed that Pipaluk was a woman because of the name :p
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
I posted this comment which was a pretty comprehensive look at Bristol's strongpoints in current and historic species, species kept by both institutions and included reptiles, birds, mammals and even inverts. :p




My bad, always assumed that Pipaluk was a woman because of the name :p
Click to expand...
And you had the cheek to accuse me of'not having a clue'!! Pipaluk was male, anyone with a clue would know that:p
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
I posted this comment which was a pretty comprehensive look at Bristol's strongpoints in current and historic species, species kept by both institutions and included reptiles, birds, mammals and even inverts.
Click to expand...

Ah, you had edited the post whilst I was still on the page :P hence my seeing only the shorter version!

I am currently working out the relevant species numbers for various animal groups at both collections, under multiple definitions of the category for comparative purposes.
 
pipaluk said:
And you had the cheek to accuse me of'not having a clue'!! Pipaluk was male, anyone with a clue would know that:p
Click to expand...

Who is Pipaluk then ? because I type it in to google and it comes up with it being an Icelandic feminine name.

Pipa in the Anglo Saxon world is usually a feminine name and the only other pipa I can think of is the scientific name for a frog from Suriname which has both males and females.

So where is this male / masculine Pipaluk that I so blithely ignored then ? :rolleyes: :p
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Who is Pipaluk then ? because I type it in to google and it comes up with it being an Icelandic feminine name.

Pipa is usually a feminine name and the only other pipa I can think of is the scientific name for a frog from Suriname. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Only the second most famous Polar Bear born in the UK....
 
pipaluk said:
Yes since you are so knowledgeable and others don't have a clue apparently!
Click to expand...

Well you kind of made a sweeping statement about the absence of reptiles, amphibians, inverts and birds not to mention a number of mammal species too at both institutions.

You could have spent less than 10 minutes looking on the collection pages of the websites of both zoos and noted these things down with paper and pencil as I did in order to make an informed comment.

You would have then clearly seen and realized that there are actually many island endemic herps, inverts and birds species there and mammals other than those that you listed. ;)

The names of polar bears kept in zoos in the Northern hemisphere are just evidently not my thing really and I could care less what they are called.
 
I would agree that an Australasian zone including islands east of the Wallace line, and likewise including the Greater Sundas in Asia, would make sense. However throwing all islands and Australia into one category is problematic. However if you took my position to it’s logical conclusion you would be left with oceanic islands which would be a limited category. I’ll be casting my vote and reasons later today.
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Well you kind of made a sweeping statement about the absence of reptiles, amphibians, inverts and birds not to mention a number of mammal species too at both institutions.

You could have spent less than 10 minutes looking on the collection pages of the websites of both zoos and noted these things down with paper and pencil and you would have seen that there are actually many island endemic species other than those that you listed. ;)
Click to expand...
Most of the mammals I missed off didn't previously count in this category, as noted by @TeaLovingDave earlier, including most of Indonesia and the Philippines!
I didn't say there was an absence of birds, reptiles and amphibians, just that I didn't think there was much between the two zoos!
 
pipaluk said:
Most of the mammals I missed off didn't previously count in this category, as noted by @TeaLovingDave earlier, including most of Indonesia and the Philippines!
Click to expand...

Indonesia and the Philippines are not islands ? :rolleyes:

The other species you missed from Papua New Guinea, Cuba (yes an archipelago but also an island), the Solomon and Polynesian islands don't count either right as they are not from islands either, right ?

Lorde Howe Island stick insect ? :rolleyes:

Oh and by the way you also missed the Kea at Bristol, a species native to New Zealand which is an island. ;)
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Indonesia and the Philippines are not islands ? :rolleyes: Papua New Guinea is not an island ?

Lorde Howe Island stick insect ? :rolleyes:

Oh and by the way you also missed the Kea at Bristol, a species native to New Zealand which is an island. ;)
Click to expand...
I didn't list anything other than mammals that I considered qualified! Please read before trying to mock people!!
 
pipaluk said:
I didn't list anything other than mammals that I considered qualified! Please read before trying to mock people!!
Click to expand...

The category was Islands wasn't it ?

This applies fauna in general from islands and is not biased towards island endemic mammals so all I am saying is if you want to defend Bristol zoo then you missed a whole lot of points in their favour (but evidently not enough to bear Jersey).
 
I have now run the figures on three different definitions of the category; firstly, my broad version including all areas covered by previous matches using this category PLUS the Philippines, Greater Sundas and Caribbean; secondly, the narrow version omitting Australian fauna preferred by @MRJ ; and finally the original version of the category which omits all Greater Sundaic, Philippine and Caribbean fauna, but does include Australian fauna:


Mammals

Bristol and Wildplace - 18 species; 14 species, 16 species
Jersey - 13 species; 13 species, 10 species

---

Birds

Bristol and Wildplace - 23 species, 20 species, 13 species
Jersey - 18 species, 18 species, 8 species

---

Reptiles

Bristol and Wildplace - 16 species, 16 species, 11 species
Jersey - 24 species, 23 species, 17 species

---

Amphibians

Bristol and Wildplace - 3 species, 2 species, 1 species
Jersey - 1 species, 1 species, 0 species


Zootierliste doesn't do invertebrates unfortunately :p but I think @Onychorhynchus coronatus has fairly conclusively demonstrated that Bristol has the edge there both in terms of conservation programmes and captive collection.
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
Indonesia and the Philippines are not islands ? :rolleyes: Papua New Guinea is not an island ?
Click to expand...

Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
The category was Islands wasn't it ?

This applies fauna in general from islands and is not biased towards island endemic mammals so all I am saying is if you want to defend Bristol zoo then you missed a whole lot of points in their favour (but evidently not enough to bear Jersey).
Click to expand...

To be fair to @pipaluk , as I have already mentioned the previous definition of the category *did* omit the Philippines, Greater Sundas and Caribbean. Papua New Guinea *was* included, however.
 
TeaLovingDave said:
I have now run the figures on three different definitions of the category; firstly, my broad version including all areas covered by previous matches using this category PLUS the Philippines, Greater Sundas and Caribbean; secondly, the narrow version omitting Australian fauna preferred by @MRJ ; and finally the original version of the category which omits all Sundaic, Philippine and Caribbean fauna, but does include Australian fauna:


Mammals

Bristol and Wildplace - 18 species; 14 species, 16 species
Jersey - 13 species; 13 species, 10 species

---

Birds

Bristol and Wildplace - 23 species, 20 species, 13 species
Jersey - 18 species, 18 species, 8 species

---

Reptiles

Bristol and Wildplace - 16 species, 16 species, 11 species
Jersey - 24 species, 23 species, 17 species

---

Amphibians

Bristol and Wildplace - 3 species, 2 species, 1 species
Jersey - 1 species, 1 species, 0 species


Zootierliste doesn't do invertebrates unfortunately :p but I think @Onychorhynchus coronatus has fairly conclusively demonstrated that Bristol has the edge there both in terms of conservation programmes and captive collection.
Click to expand...

My point in terms of conservation output of Jersey is that they are involved in both in-situ and ex-situ conservation and do much more of this than Bristol have done or will do.

So regardless of Bristol's greater variety of island species I believe that Jersey wins on that account pretty much for its enormout output and work with predominately island species.
 
Onychorhynchus coronatus said:
How were these excluded though when they are clearly regions comprised of islands and archipelagos (which are obviously still islands) ?
Click to expand...

@CGSwans chose to classify them as solely Asian and South American in biogeographic terms.

As noted elsewhere in this thread (and in previous threads where the category of Africa came up and I emphasised that Malagasy fauna and flora were permissible for consideration) I have been treating biogeographic categories in a more broad sense to allow the maximum chance for collections to get a fair crack at proving their worth.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top