Captive Orca Population

[Great Argus]

I've previously stated San Diego's best companionship wise, as they have Corky, but they do have rather limited space as it is and San Diego is all the way on the other side of the country.

In terms of Lolita's welfare, SW Orlando is hands down the best option. It would be a short time in transit, expert care for her needs, and even potential protected interaction with other orcas. She could probably be there in a couple of months, for a fraction of the cost this whole planned endeavor would be. Absolutely as minimally stressful as possible and with her best interests at heart.

This whole releasing back to the wild/sea pen thing is getting plastered all over the news and it's a whole giant AR attention grabber that probably will never come to fruition. It's absolute garbage and is not actually benefitting Lolita or the Pac White-sides in any way, shape, or form. Typical publicity stunt that anthropomorphizes the animals and doesn't give a dime what actually happens to them.

 

[ZoologicallyDepraved]

I decided to take a look at the "industry professionals" that thought this would be a good idea. The people at the press conference included the mayor of Miami and Jim Irsay, who are obviously not professionals. In terms of people who have experience with marine mammals, there were the owners of Miami Seaquarium and Friends of Lolita. The owners are probably going along with this due to the years of pressure. Friends of Lolita consists of 2 philanthropists and 3 scientists, only one of which is a zoological professional. None of Lolita's actual caretakers or vets were a part of this. Funny thing is, Friends of Lolita has conducted many welfare assessments on Tokitae, and a lot of them are quite positive. So the decision is not based on anything we know about her health or welfare. It's all a PR stunt.

 

[Jambo]

In terms of Lolita's welfare, SW Orlando is hands down the best option. It would be a short time in transit, expert care for her needs, and even potential protected interaction with other orcas. She could probably be there in a couple of months, for a fraction of the cost this whole planned endeavor would be. Absolutely as minimally stressful as possible and with her best interests at heart.

This whole releasing back to the wild/sea pen thing is getting plastered all over the news and it's a whole giant AR attention grabber that probably will never come to fruition. It's absolute garbage and is not actually benefitting Lolita or the Pac White-sides in any way, shape, or form. Typical publicity stunt that anthropomorphizes the animals and doesn't give a dime what actually happens to them.

Very much agree there. There's a whole lot of benefits, and additionally Orlando does have the space as it is to accommodate her and possibly her white sided dolphin companions as well. She'd get superior health care which she needs at her age, more space and ultimately interaction with other orcas; whether that's through a gate or together.

In terms of people who have experience with marine mammals, there were the owners of Miami Seaquarium and Friends of Lolita. The owners are probably going along with this due to the years of pressure.

The current owner is Eduardo Albor, the owner of The Dolphin Company. He recently acquired the Seaquarium, and he's seemingly always wanted to get Lolita back to the wild which I'd imagine was part of the reason why he brought the Seaquarium in the first place.

I've read multiple articles from former trainers and current ones who all agree its best for Lolita to be moved up to Orlando. At her age it's just inadvisable to attempt a reintroduction to the wild and would be a massive risk to undertake. It's a shame that a lot of these people that are rallying for Lolita to be freed have zero experience within the marine industry and are going off information laid out by the activists.

 

[JVM]

Just a little side note, but noticing a lot of the press coverage is beginning to use the Tokitae name, which years ago I'd read on zoochat was avoided in press/public with Lolita being maintained as the public name. Just interesting to see this change made, which again shows how much the approach has changed.

 

[Jambo]

Shanghai news:

It appears from recent photos that both Cookie and Dora are heavily pregnant and are probably expecting very soon (as in the next few months).

There's also been rumors floating around regarding Shanghai having plans to send Sean and Chip to another facility to make space for breeding. Maybe Japan? Neither of the two facilities really have the space for two males. Another dark horse would be Loro Parque of course, who are down on numbers atm.

 

[Jambo]

Suma Aqualife:

From photos it seems Suma are well into the construction process of their Orca complex. They apparently have two ‘males’ off location somewhere and plan to work with Kanagowa for breeding going forward.

 

[katinakalinakaterina]

Moskvarium have announced the death of their 16 year old male orca Nord. This follows the death of their older female, Narnia, back in January. They are left with 1 female, Naya (formerly Juliet/Malyshka) who is around 10/11 years old. The cause of death is believed to be acute peptic ulcer.

Moskvarium's translated statement:
“Moskvarium mourns the loss of the orca Nord.
At the age of 16, the male killer whale Nord left us. Until the last day, Nord's behavior and medical indications showed no signs of illness. What happened is a huge loss for everyone. The cause of death was acute peptic ulcer of the third part of the stomach. Unfortunately, the development of some diseases cannot be prevented in advance.
Despite the high level of competence of the center's experts, extensive experience in working with marine mammals, the constant development and implementation of new elements to enrich the habitat of animals, significant annual investments in veterinary equipment and the modernization of all systems of the complex, it is extremely difficult to approximate the artificial conditions for keeping large marine mammals to natural.
Nord's departure once again confirms the Moskvarium's position on the need for a complete ban on capture of marine mammals for educational and cultural purposes, which the center's specialists expressed by taking part in the development of draft law N40333-8 "On Amendments to the Federal Law" On Fishing and Conservation aquatic biological resources."

 

[Jambo]

Moskvarium have announced the death of their 16 year old male orca Nord. This follows the death of their older female, Narnia, back in January. They are left with 1 female, Naya (formerly Juliet/Malyshka) who is around 10/11 years old. The cause of death is believed to be acute peptic ulcer.

Moskvarium's translated statement:
“Moskvarium mourns the loss of the orca Nord.
At the age of 16, the male killer whale Nord left us. Until the last day, Nord's behavior and medical indications showed no signs of illness. What happened is a huge loss for everyone. The cause of death was acute peptic ulcer of the third part of the stomach. Unfortunately, the development of some diseases cannot be prevented in advance.
Despite the high level of competence of the center's experts, extensive experience in working with marine mammals, the constant development and implementation of new elements to enrich the habitat of animals, significant annual investments in veterinary equipment and the modernization of all systems of the complex, it is extremely difficult to approximate the artificial conditions for keeping large marine mammals to natural.
Nord's departure once again confirms the Moskvarium's position on the need for a complete ban on capture of marine mammals for educational and cultural purposes, which the center's specialists expressed by taking part in the development of draft law N40333-8 "On Amendments to the Federal Law" On Fishing and Conservation aquatic biological resources."

Very sad news to hear of Nord's death so soon after Narnia's.

Obviously the Moskvarium have two options from here; either import some orcas from China (maybe Sean and Cody who were 'rumored' to be going elsewhere), or send Naja to a Chinese facility.

There's been rumors recently that Marineland Antibes also plans to send their remaining four to China; so there's a possibility we will see some moves soon.

 

[Great Argus]

There's been rumors recently that Marineland Antibes also plans to send their remaining four to China; so there's a possibility we will see some moves soon.

Japan per what I've seen - will be interesting to see if it comes to pass.

 

[Jambo]

Japan per what I've seen - will be interesting to see if it comes to pass.

Yes, that's correct - Suma Aqualife Park being the facility in question.

Considering Antibes are apparently struggling to care for their orcas recently, to the point where Wikie is off contraception, I think we could see them part ways with their orcas sooner than expected. The two parks share the same management too, so a move between the two would make sense.

 

[LiSom]

.Nord's departure once again confirms the Moskvarium's position on the need for a complete ban on capture of marine mammals for educational and cultural purposes, which the center's specialists expressed by taking part in the development of draft law N40333-8 "On Amendments to the Federal Law" On Fishing and Conservation aquatic biological resources."

I'm confused by this. Wasn't Nord capture and then sent to Moskvarium once it was finish? So now they position themselves as against captures when all 3 of their orcas were recently capture specifically for their park??

I hope at least they won't do it again but the comment makes me confused..

 

[Jambo]

I'm confused by this. Wasn't Nord capture and then sent to Moskvarium once it was finish? So now they position themselves as against captures when all 3 of their orcas were recently capture specifically for their park??

I hope at least they won't do it again but the comment makes me confused..

It appears @katinakalinakaterina quoted an announcement made by a different organisation that have themselves quoted the Moskavarium's announcement of Nord's death.

That would explain their stance - being against marine mammal captures.

 

[LiSom]

Ahh ok, that would make more sense, thanks!

 

[zoologicus]

I'm confused by this. Wasn't Nord capture and then sent to Moskvarium once it was finish? So now they position themselves as against captures when all 3 of their orcas were recently capture specifically for their park??

I hope at least they won't do it again but the comment makes me confused..

That quote comes directly from Moskvarium's announcement of North's death (it was not from a different organization), and yes, every single one of their founder marine mammals were wild-caught in Russia and Japan specifically for the park less than 10 years ago. Just a particularly flagrant example of greenwashing on the aquarium's part.

 

[Jambo]

That quote comes directly from Moskvarium's announcement of North's death (it was not from a different organization), and yes, every single one of their founder marine mammals were wild-caught in Russia and Japan specifically for the park less than 10 years ago. Just a particularly flagrant example of greenwashing on the aquarium's part.

It dosen't seem so - they go from saying 'we' and 'us', to using phrases like 'the center' and 'the Moskavarium'.

The orcas themselves were all captured between 2012 and 2014 in Russia. The last remaning female, Naja, was the youngest of the trio.

 

[zoologicus]

It dosen't seem so - they go from saying 'we' and 'us', to using phrases like 'the center' and 'the Moskavarium'.

The orcas themselves were all captured between 2012 and 2014 in Russia. The last remaning female, Naja, was the youngest of the trio.

The quote comes from their announcement of his death, published by the facility themselves on their official website. Last paragraph. Two second search to verify. «Москвариум» скорбит об утрате косатки Норда

 

[katinakalinakaterina]

It appears @katinakalinakaterina quoted an announcement made by a different organisation that have themselves quoted the Moskavarium's announcement of Nord's death.

That would explain their stance - being against marine mammal captures.

Apologies, the announcement was taken from their website but the link didn't copy across, I am also working off a poor quality translator, it makes an awful mess of German (let alone Russian)! It is strange given that the company that owns Moskvarium was actively involved in the captures of the animals I believe, it gets difficult trying to keep track of the companies involved, maybe they don't want to risk the backlash they got last time they captured orcas, or they can't get the permits? I don't know if a quota has been set for this year or not.

 

[Jambo]

Apologies, the announcement was taken from their website but the link didn't copy across, I am also working off a poor quality translator, it makes an awful mess of German (let alone Russian)! It is strange given that the company that owns Moskvarium was actively involved in the captures of the animals I believe, it gets difficult trying to keep track of the companies involved, maybe they don't want to risk the backlash they got last time they captured orcas, or they can't get the permits? I don't know if a quota has been set for this year or not.

Yes, Moskavarium were definitely involved in their initial captures and the other Russian captures too (including those that were sent to China).

I believe the Russian government has become more strict recently about giving out permits and restricting orca captures, so that could very well be a possibility. I'd be very surprised if they do get permission to capture anymore.

 

[Jambo]

The quote comes from their announcement of his death, published by the facility themselves on their official website. Last paragraph. Two second search to verify. «Москвариум» скорбит об утрате косатки Норда

Thanks for the confirmation.

Just dosen't make sense why they would be going against their own activities?

 

[katinakalinakaterina]

Thanks for the confirmation.

Just dosen't make sense why they would be going against their own activities?

They've always claimed in their promotional material (and I am guessing displays to visitors) that these three were rescued from poachers. Could be financial issues behind the scenes caused by current world events, I am unsure who the people are behind these companies so that could be a problem?