The Cat Survival Trust Cat Survival Trust

zootiger said:
- Receive Amur leopard, Chinese golden cat and clouded leopard from Thrigby...... They hope to bring in more golden cats, leopard cats as well as possible Indian Leopards (and melanistic ones) from a contact in India
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It would be a shame for the Thrigby golden cat to move to the CST - he is pretty old and unlikely to live much longer, so it would be nice if he lived out his days at Thrigby. Not to mention the fact that as the last CGC outside of the native range, it would be good if he remained visible to the public rather than going to a private collection - especially one which actually refuses to accept he *is* a Chinese Golden Cat!
 
I'm not sure if it is happening, just one of the tour guides at the CST said they may be looking at getting a couple of cats from Thrigby, I believe he mentioned the golden cat.
 
zootiger said:
I'm not sure if it is happening, just one of the tour guides at the CST said they may be looking at getting a couple of cats from Thrigby, I believe he mentioned the golden cat.
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I would say there was more chance of the Jaguar that Thrigby have than the Golden Cat,as I know they have been looking for a new home for her,as she doesn't fit with the collection!
 
Our guide did mention that they may have be looking at getting a new female jaguar , not sure if it's from thrigby or not. I also heard they may be looking at the younger clouded leopard
 
I've uploaded a photo of the golden cat at CST to the zoochat album, does anyone know it's subspecies? Thanks
 
zoogiraffe said:
Well its not a Chinese Golden Cat,tld will be the man to tell you which of the other species it is!
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It's an Indochinese Golden Cat :)

Of course, if you listen to the bloke in charge of the CST *all* the Golden Cats in Europe belong to that subspecies - myself and Al got into an argument with him on Facebook on that matter some time ago when he claimed the studbook holder knew less about the species than he did! :p
 
Thanks a lot! I may have misheard about the Thrigby Golden Cat, although he did say they were looking at hopefully bringing a couple of the cats down from there.
 
I have trouble believing that a collection whose purpose is to provide homes for surplus captive felines is not acting like a zoo in importing new bloodlines of species from India. If the collection is not on public view as a zoo, is this not just a private menagerie? From my understanding of the enclosures the cat survival trust would not be considered close to top standard for breeding or keeping felines. Would be interested to hear from people who have actually seen the set-up.
 
tetrapod said:
I have trouble believing that a collection whose purpose is to provide homes for surplus captive felines is not acting like a zoo in importing new bloodlines of species from India. If the collection is not on public view as a zoo, is this not just a private menagerie? From my understanding of the enclosures the cat survival trust would not be considered close to top standard for breeding or keeping felines. Would be interested to hear from people who have actually seen the set-up.
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It is a private collection which takes on surplus cats from both public and private zoos. Incidentally, in my mind a zoo is a collection of animals, no matter where it may be, if that is open to the public or not, or whether it is public or private. They are all zoos of some description.
 
Nanook said:
It is a private collection which takes on surplus cats from both public and private zoos. Incidentally, in my mind a zoo is a collection of animals, no matter where it may be, if that is open to the public or not, or whether it is public or private. They are all zoos of some description.
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I understand where you are coming from, however if you asked the general public the definition of a zoo they would not include a private backyard, a petshop or a circus - all which could conceivably fit within your category of a zoo. A zoo needs to include a conservation, education and 'public enjoyment' (for better description of why people visit) angles. Yes some zoos do provide a sanctuary element also to their role. I was just arguing that a private collection that is importing new animals from India and breeding on-site is not just a sanctuary for surplus felines, and should be viewed in the same manner as a private zoo. If their captive conditions are not up-to-scratch then it should be pointed out, as happens with numerous other collections on this site. Poor standards bring the reputation of all zoos down.
 
tetrapod said:
I understand where you are coming from, however if you asked the general public the definition of a zoo they would not include a private backyard, a petshop or a circus - all which could conceivably fit within your category of a zoo. A zoo needs to include a conservation, education and 'public enjoyment' (for better description of why people visit) angles. Yes some zoos do provide a sanctuary element also to their role. I was just arguing that a private collection that is importing new animals from India and breeding on-site is not just a sanctuary for surplus felines, and should be viewed in the same manner as a private zoo. If their captive conditions are not up-to-scratch then it should be pointed out, as happens with numerous other collections on this site. Poor standards bring the reputation of all zoos down.
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Ideally a zoo needs to include all those things you mention - yes, though many do not. I think in this case this collection is trying to serve two main purposes - firstly to take on surplus cats, and clearly this also includes those from overseas collections, they used to just take stock from the UK only. But now they are increasingly trying to fulfil a conservational role
by buying land to help protect it and by breeding some species of conservational value such as Snow Leopards etc...
I would imagine the cats coming from India would be surplus animals or perhaps "rescue cases" - there is a large "rescue sanctuary" in India which has a large amount of cats such as leopards so this could be where they are coming from ??
There is only one element stopping the Cat Survival Trust "becoming a proper zoo" - in the context you describe, and that is by having public barriers, health and safety regulations and a zoo licence. All of which could easily be achieved if they wanted. Some enclosures may also need up-grading in terms of their standards, some are a bit small but still functional.
 
"I think there is, now more than ever, a need for places like this.
They serve a purpose, yes it is hard to "classify them" as such, because they are neither one thing nor another, but in the case of the Cat Survival Trust it is run by a knowledgeable and experienced man (Terry Moore) with a passion for what he does. Surplus zoo animals have always been a problem, and there are few respectable collections that are in a position to help as he can in relation to keeping wild cats in particular. He is also trying to do his bit for conservation along the way, so let`s not knock him for trying to help." Nanook.

Sadly and truthfully, I would completely disagree with your comments regarding that it is "run by a knowledgeable and experienced man (Terry Moore)". He may give that impression and he may give out a charming persona, bursting with I know this and I know that. I can understand your loyalty to the CST and to Dr Moore and I also agree with your last post. I also agree with tetrapod and tealovingdave, especially the following: "Of course, if you listen to the bloke in charge of the CST *all* the Golden Cats in Europe belong to that subspecies - myself and Al got into an argument with him on Facebook on that matter some time ago when he claimed the studbook holder knew less about the species than he did!" I can say with experience that the CST and Moore have come across as fraudulent, disrespectful, false and somewhat lacking on following rules, procedures and basic health and safety. Now, you may disagree and say otherwise. However, when someone who has big or medium cats in his home, handling exotic cats without the compliance of the law and regulations that others have to follow. Who has photographic sessions and "volunteers" wandering about inside enclosures that sadly are so poorly constructed they would fail any inspection. Ah, I hear you say, but he has a DWA So what? That does not the man complies with the rules, he just merely avoids them by cutting corners and so on. If he applied for a zoo licence then it would not get that. I totally agree with Nanook regarding: "There is only one element stopping the Cat Survival Trust "becoming a proper zoo" - in the context you describe, and that is by having public barriers, health and safety regulations and a zoo licence. All of which could easily be achieved if they wanted. Some enclosures may also need up-grading in terms of their standards, some are a bit small but still functional." That s 100% correct but again, there is a great deal more than just having safety barriers, good and practical enclosures and complying with the HASAWA. As we know, he would have to satisfy the Secretary of State's standards of modern zoo practice (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...data/file/69596/standards-of-zoo-practice.pdf), thus far and demonstrated, he would fail. Unfortunately, I am not a fan of the CST or Dr Moore, unless he can change then I remain so.
 
I visited yesterday and spent a very pleasant hour being shown around. Overall I liked it. The enclosures are obviously quite functional, and a little on the small side, but very well planted and equipped with climbing equipment.
Some news:
A new small cat house is being built. It will have fourteen new enclosures, two of which will be climate controlled. It is hoped that this will ai in the breeding of some of the trickier species.
A Clouded Leopard has arrived from Exmoor. A Snow Leopard will soon be making the journey in the other direction.
The trust currently houses two breeding pairs of Puma. Neither of the individuals in one of the pairs is represented in the European population and they are hopeful of changing this.
 
Are you sure you mean Clouded Leopard? To my knowledge, this species has not been at Exmoor recently - and I don't think it ever *has* been.
 
TeaLovingDave said:
Are you sure you mean Clouded Leopard? To my knowledge, this species has not been at Exmoor recently - and I don't think it ever *has* been.
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I didn't see the cat but I don't think it's plausible that the experienced volunteer who told me this could be so misinformed. I can easily believe however,that either he or I misheard the Exmoor bit, although I'd like to think it wasn't me :)
 
A clouded leopard has joined the collection, but not sure where from!

The trust now also has a lynx cub, a racoon and jaguarundi!

I also saw that they have some kind of bird species now, as well as ring tailed lemurs but I'm not sure how new these are! I got this info from this youtube video- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJsHwnYZbN0
 
The Eurasian Lynx kitten is called "Pudding" according to various photographs that have appeared on social media, the photographer makes money form his images as does the CST. The Youtube footage shows a very over weight, fat racoon running on a sofa, various exotic cats that are not in the best condition and the enclosures are sad, shameful and not fit for purpose let alone be seen as functional. The CST is a sad run down place that lacks any real foresight and houses various exotic animals. The methodology and ideology that Terry Moore and his Mrs have are suspect and very questionable. From not complying with Charity laws regarding sending in upto date accounts (he has admitted this previously), from the questionable "volunteers" which he uses and "we don't open to the public" to escape the zoo licence, which in turn the volunteers bring their families and friends, regular photographic shoots are held and are advertised, to the way the animals are kept including owls and some other birds of prey. Terry Moore "may" be seen as a knowledgeable person but his overall distaste for BIAZA and EAZA and DEFRA (saying that red tape and the power struggles he has with them that gets his goat and he only surrenders to the application of DWA licence as he has to, otherwise he would rather not) to the application of the ZLA and Secretary of State’s Standards of Modern Zoo Practice is painful to him as he is against the rules it brings.
 
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As an update, the last time I visited this was what was there.

5 servals
2 caracals
2 leopard cats
1 jaguarundi
1 jaguar
2 amur leopard
3 snow leopard
3 eurasian lynx
1 european wild cat
1 gordon’s wild cat
1 temick’s golden cat
1 clouded leopard
4 pumas, I believe, and 3 new puma cubs
3 cheetahs (now left)

Other animals included lemurs, a number of racoon dogs and a number of owls
 
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